Boy wants to wear a skirt, so duhddy wears a skirt too.

http://www.buzzfeed.com/rsultan/this-dads-superhero-cape-is-a-skirt

I have every respect for trans people, but lets be honest, that kid is going to get all kinds of shit kicked out of him for wearing skirts. His handlers should understand this, but nooo. Lets join in, that won't give the bullies more ammo.

Even if the kid does grow out of it it won't just go away, not if they're living in a small town- that kid will probably have to live with it for the rest of his school life.

The comments. Dear god, the comments. Run the full spectrum of shut the fuck up right from so0 sexi becuz gud dad to THE BIBLE SAYS YOU'RE ALL LIBTARDS but I had to dig out this little gem (bolding mine):

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Rick Murphy · St. Edward High School
Telling your child "No" When they do something wrong is important. Telling your child "No" when they don't do something wrong is demoralizing and probably traumatizing. Letting kids experiment with who they are at a young age is important so they can figure out what and who they were meant to be. Without personality experimenting, we would all just be robots with no character.

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"Pro life childfree" is just another way of saying parent minus 9 months.

In this case, I don’t agree with you.

I am a woman, and I use “man” clothing. IE: Pants. They are normal now because a century or so ago some strong women started using them, for various –mostly political- reasons.

If a male child wants to wear a skirt, better for him. If he wants to play with “girl” clothes, all the better for him.

Will the child be bullied? Most probably. But it is the bully the wrong one, not him.
If he stops wearing dresses because he is being bullied, well, that is different from prohibiting him to put on the dress in the first place.


A side note:

I disagree with parenting decision that A) bother me or B) have high probability to result in future not-so-great human beings.
As such, I disagree with parents who let their children shrieks and on parents who don’t tell Pwechus to stop hitting people.
Now, it is possible that this man is doing either of those things, but it is not the major point in question.
Is a male toddler in a skirt something that bothers me?
No. Save if the idea of wrong-gendered clothes bothers me, in which case, I would be moron and should grow up.
Is this toddler likely to grow up as a terrible person for this?
No. “Worst” thing is he will be a man in skirt. Which is completely his business and not mine.

You might say that since this father allows his child to wear skirts, then he must belong to a category of breederhood in which behaviours A and B is common. To which I answer that it is not at all so. Frankly, I am more worried for the future of the Bibble preaching “breaks your son wrist if he behaves in a feminine way”’s fathers.

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“I was talking about children that have not been properly house-trained. Left to their own impulses and indulged by doting or careless parents almost all children are yahoos. Loud, selfish, cruel, unaffectionate, jealous, perpetually striving for attention, empty-headed, for ever prating or if words fail them simply bawling, their voices grown huge from daily practice: the very worst company in the world. But what I dislike even more than the natural child is the affected child, the hulking oaf of seven or eight that skips heavily about with her hands dangling in front of her -- a little squirrel or bunny-rabbit -- and prattling away in a baby's voice.”


― Patrick O'Brian, The Truelove


lib'-er-ty: the freedom given to you to make the wrong decision, based on the reasoned belief that you will normally make the right one.

Yes, strong women started wearing them.

There's an important word in that sentance. Women. Not girls. If a grown man wants to wear a skirt, then fine.

But this kid isn't making a statement. He's five years old. He doesn't understand consequence.

The duh does, or at least should. So all I can see is him throwing a nice bloody hunk of meat into the shark pool.

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"Pro life childfree" is just another way of saying parent minus 9 months.

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thursdaynext
Yes, strong women started wearing them.

There's an important word in that sentance. Women. Not girls. If a grown man wants to wear a skirt, then fine.

But this kid isn't making a statement. He's five years old. He doesn't understand consequence.

The duh does, or at least should. So all I can see is him throwing a nice bloody hunk of meat into the shark pool.

Again, I disagree.

I would agree with you if the father had some kind of agenda, and was putting himself the clothes on his son. Which is in possible, but not what is going one (at least, not what it seems to be going on).

A 2 years old might not know about social pressure enough than “not caring” is the answer. At age 5, most kids know all too well about it.

However, I reiterate that, if the child doesn’t want to put on a skirt and the father is making him, that count as child abuse.
But if the child wants it, then it is just as much child abuse in the case his father forces him not to.

There is a very real possibility that the child is a transgender. Most transgender people I know tell me they have know to be born in the wrong body and that they craved what the other gender did from a very early age. They also speak about how much their parents refusal to threat them in the way they wanted, forcing them into trousers or skirts (depending of course) hurt them.
Again, we aren’t told in the article if the boy identifies as male or female. But it is possible that he does indeed consider himself a “she”.

But, again, what if “just” likes skirts and “girl’s toys”?
Should his parents talk him out of it? And why? Because other people are dumb? A certain degree of bending to dumbness is to be accepted, but in this particular case, since the child is not so little, I have reasons to believe it is better not to.

First, the child is five, not two or three. Many boys passed in a “phase” in which they like skirts and /or girls’ toys. But they grow out of it sometimes around 3 years old. A five years old in skirts shows a certain degree of self awareness for one, and I doubt that he hadn’t already been harassed, for second, so if he persists it is probable that the issues is important enough for him to keep pressing it.
Why shouldn’t his parents support him?

Of course, it would be different if the boy lived in, say, Saudi Arabia or other place where this behaviour could get him killed.

But frankly, if we should stop doing everything that some dumb idiot disagree with and could bully us with, there would be little left to do, indeed.


(I follow some interesting gender creative blogs, if anybody is interested in the argoument, PM me )


PS: of course, it would be different if, say, the father, or mother, would come out with asinine ideas like: “Let’s make a skirt-only day in Pwechus’s kindergartner!” trying to force all their son playmates to wear skirt as well. But it is not the case.

_______________________

“I was talking about children that have not been properly house-trained. Left to their own impulses and indulged by doting or careless parents almost all children are yahoos. Loud, selfish, cruel, unaffectionate, jealous, perpetually striving for attention, empty-headed, for ever prating or if words fail them simply bawling, their voices grown huge from daily practice: the very worst company in the world. But what I dislike even more than the natural child is the affected child, the hulking oaf of seven or eight that skips heavily about with her hands dangling in front of her -- a little squirrel or bunny-rabbit -- and prattling away in a baby's voice.”


― Patrick O'Brian, The Truelove


lib'-er-ty: the freedom given to you to make the wrong decision, based on the reasoned belief that you will normally make the right one.

I agree with you T. I was really happy to see the fact that the dad was actually encouraging his son to express himself (in a safe way that didn't force other people to change their behavior....shocker!) and has stuck up for his child without being a "Daddy Bear" or whatever. It's kind of refreshing to me.

I found this to be a really positive story.

I'm with T. Maybe the kid doesn't realise how people will react, but he'll figure it out, soon enough. Then he'll either decide to conform or learn that standing up for yourself isn't easy. By wearing a skirt as well, his father is making an important statement to his son that there is nothing wrong with a man wearing a skirt.

And there is nothing wrong with a man wearing a skirt. I wish we could ditch all these old sexist hangovers from previous ages, but we've still got a long way to go. It's just an article of clothing. It won't make him gay or trans, and if he is gay or trans, so fucking what?

I wouldn't be who I am today if my parents had applied gender constraints to me at an early age simply because that was the social expectation.

i don't care what people wear, including kids. will this kid get bullied? yes. and he would probably get bullied no matter what. i think it's fine to let kids wear what they want, (except little girls dressing like sluts - ick) provided the clothing is clean and weather appropriate. when i was in HS i was the only goth girl, and i got bullied mercilessly, but i expressed myself and wore what i wanted. if anyone had tried to stop me i would not have listened.

i think it's fine.

I don't think that every boy who likes skirts and "girl toys" is trans. They're cute, they come in bright colours, they flutter around you, why wouldn't a kid like them? Up until a hundred years ago or so, they dressed all kids in skirts.
If he likes "girl toys" it's likely that he just likes cute and cuddly things. Or he wants to play nicely; "girl games" tend to have an emphasis on being social and getting along and "boy games" have an emphasis on competing and generally acting like an animal.

I think that it's a big mistake that there are "girl" toys and "boy" toys. Kids should be free to play with whatever they please.

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" ... what's one more once you've already got two shedding on the couch?"

Eh, it's alright. If a boy wants to wear a skirt, there's actually male skirts out there. They aren't kilts, but real skirts that are made in (almost the same way) a woman's is. The difference is, these often have cargo pockets and such, and have a different pattern to sewn to flatter the male figure instead of a female.
It's also entirely possible that the boy is a Janegirl, and not dressing because he thinks he's a girl. These do exist, but often are hidden away into privacy by the boys themselves or (incorrectly) lumped into the category of Transsexualism.

Heck, hot designers were all over that trend last year.

It's your hell; you rot in it!

I don't see the problem with a little boy wearing a skirt if this is something he wants to do.

I wore boy clothes and played with masculine toys as a child. I refused to wear a dress or be pigeonholed into something I wasn't comfortable with. I am not transgendered. I just liked wearing pants and t-shirts and playing football with my guy friends. I still do that to this day. I got bullied in school for being 'odd' but it didn't stop me. I wore whatever the heck I pleased, and so should this kid.

Maybe it's a phrase like how some kids want to eat nothing but Cheetos and milk. Maybe he really is trans and is trying to find his identity. Children that young do know they are trans. Who knows? At this point, it's just a skirt. It's not going to kill him. Kid has an awesome father. That's nice to see.

We all have to conform in our attire choices at some point and time in our lives
No, this isn't good and for many reasons. In a perfect world people of any age, size, or gender should be able to wear and dress how ever and in whatever fashion they desire, but this isn't a world anywhere near perfect. I'd like to wear tank tops and/or go bra less all the time because it's more comfortable, but with my chesty bust line I have never been able to do that. It is socially unacceptable for a big chested woman to walk around town, conduct business, and attend school looking like she's about to pose for a "Girls Gone Wild" video. Is it fair my flat chested friends can get away with either going bra less or wearing what would be considered "revealing" clothing if I wore it instead? I don't think so, but that's the way it is in this society and especially in my "circle" and environment. This is the same principle but with even worse consequences than the exposure of my big boobs.

Other clothing is inappropriate too, not just the dress
No one says the boy can't have a say in his own clothing choices, but what he wants to wear to school at this age needs to be monitored whether it's a red dress, full camouflage with combat boots, or like that Awtard a few years back who had a meltdown because the school wouldn't let her wear that full faced raised cow shirt with a tail dangling off the back of it. This is one of the primary reasons I am "for" school uniforms. If he wants to dress to the nines at home or other places, complete with blonde wig, heels, and makeup, I suppose that's okay, but I wouldn't let my imaginary kid out in public with any clothing that was sure to draw negative attention to him, not at 5 years of age.

Transgendered MAY not even be the issue
Another issue which seems to be being ignored here is the assumption the kid is transgendered because he wants to wear dresses. This is a HUGE misconception in several ways with the most important being not ALL tramsgendered males, MTF, desire to wear dresses, they simply are female in a male body. MOST women(born female) do NOT like to wear dresses, so this idea he wants to be "like a girl" by wearing a dress is in and of itself misleading. The odds are the boy is NOT transgendered and if this is so and he's encouraged he is a girl in a boy's body, which seems to be happening here with all the knee jerkers, this could be MORE detrimental to his psychological well being and gender identity than not being allowed to wear the dress to school.

Parents need to be in control of kids at age 5
God help him if this dress wearing desire is a phase, which it IS a common phase for little boys to play "dress up" especially if he has an older sister, and after he outgrows it, no one will forget. They need to stop making this about it's a boy wanting to wear a dress and focus on the point the "dresses" he wants to wear are inappropriate, like many OTHER items of clothing traditionally thought to be "male". Instead of, "Transgenderlee, boys can't wear dresses", it should be, "You can wear what you want at home Weirdlee, but that outfit isn't appropriate for school and NEITHER is your Sponge Bob costume. Now quit acting like a freak and go change into some jeans before you make us late with this nonsense while I get your pancakes ready" case closed.

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If YOU are the "exception" to what I am saying, then why does my commentary bother you so much?
I don't hate your kids, I HATE YOU!

I figure there is no harm in letting him wear what he wants at home. He might outgrow it, or he might not. If he gets a little older and decides that he wishes to wear women's clothes 'recreationally' and not for any other reason, then he can pick and choose the places he feels most comfortable wearing them.

I have a friend who wears girl's clothes at home, and he's always wanted to dress like a girl since he was little. He has no desire to go through with the operation and become a woman. He just does it for fun, and enjoys the fantasy aspect of pretending to be a girl. It's harmless and fun...however, he's old enough to know that it wouldn't be wise for him to visit a bar in Redneckville dressed in his latex maid's outfit.

If dad wants to support him by wearing a skirt too? Hell! Why not? There are too many parents that would freak out if they knew their little boy wanted to dress as a girl. He's just having a little dress-up fun at this stage, and I don't see the harm in it at all. It's nice to know that his dad is supportive.

Meh.

I actually wear men's clothing. Not just slacks or pants, but "go over to the men's section for my clothing" clothes. They're more comfortable than women's clothes, and I hate froo-froo shit. In fact, I've only owned three or four fancy dresses and caught the girly bug here and there, but I was mostly a tomboy.

Nobody ever says 'boo' to me about my choice, so why the double-standard from society?

I think what the guy's doing is great. He's not slapping the boy to "straighten up"(bad pun, sorry), he's basically going with the flow. If the boy decides it's time to wear pants, that's cool, too. The father's color choices are a bit off-putting because the top clashes with the bottom, but I'll get over it.

And...at least the little boy wasn't wearing a Disney Princess dress. THAT shit's gotta go whether you're a girl or boy.

Hey, if you need to find this boy and his dad, just look in the closet!

Sorry, just being mean... Couldn't resist.

I think it's fine if he wants to do it at home, but otherwise I have to agree with Kim and Mo6B. I think this is going to expose this kyd to ridicule and bullying that really no one should have to deal with, especially at 5.

I think it would be enough to say "you can wear your dresses at home, but for school, you have to dress like the other boys". There have to be some boundaries I think. Most of us live with some level of conformity on a daily basis. Most workplaces have dress codes, as do stores and restaurants and what have you.

I think it could be a good lesson in the fact that you can't always do what you want and live by your own rules. Sometimes you have to live by the rules of others, and when you're on your own time, then you can do what you want.

I can't imagine that not being able to wear a dress all the time is going to impact this kyd in a negative way. As Kim said, most girls/women don't like to wear dresses, a lot, or at all.

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"I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." - Antoine de Saint-Exupery

Sometimes a boy in a skirt is just a boy in a skirt. My neighbors kid wore one almost exclusively from ages 2-6, then he grew out of it on his own. At 15, the boy isn't gay or trans or anything else. No harm, no foul.

What's next, girls wearing pants? Oh, the irrational outrage!

Are you seriously saying that rather than be open about alternative lifestyle choices, or just living your life your own way, you should be shoved into the closet because some closed-minded sections of society might not like what you do (and FSM forbid anyone do anything to change their views.)? Because if that's the case, I would expect you to either leave the board or produce a baby because being childfree is not considered "normal" and you might be occasionally given shit for it.

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juliewashere88
What's next, girls wearing pants? Oh, the irrational outrage!

Are you seriously saying that rather than be open about alternative lifestyle choices, or just living your life your own way, you should be shoved into the closet because some closed-minded sections of society might not like what you do (and FSM forbid anyone do anything to change their views.)? Because if that's the case, I would expect you to either leave the board or produce a baby because being childfree is not considered "normal" and you might be occasionally given shit for it.

My general view on this is people should be able to dress any way they like or live whatever lifestyle they choose, as long as it's not breaking any laws or encroaching on other peoples' rights. However, an adult presumably possesses the maturity, experience, and capacity for understanding that when his not typical and not "normal" choices are made public, there will likely be unpleasant consequences ranging from judgmental looks and comments, bullying, and outright discrimination, to name a few. NO, this isn't "okay", but that's the way it is, unfortunately. An adult, or even an older teen, can make the decision if he's willing to endure the negativity from society for his choices, whereas a child can't make that decision yet for himself mainly because he doesn't yet have the capacity to fully understand the consequences of his actions, which could be retroactive after he is old enough to realize his choices, or at least making them public, is NOT something he wants to do.

By then though, it may be too late to "UN-OUT" himself. So, sure, let him dress up like Gypsy Rose Lee and hang out at the mall, when he is old enough to fully appreciate the likely consequences for doing so, but NOT at the age of 5. This dad needs to protect his child, not encourage him to walk blindly into the slaughter house.

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If YOU are the "exception" to what I am saying, then why does my commentary bother you so much?
I don't hate your kids, I HATE YOU!

As I've mentioned above, let him do it in the safety and comfort of his home. When he's old enough to decide better for himself, and weigh the consequences, he can choose to either do it or not.

My friend's parents understood that, and while they didn't discourage him dressing, they didn't encourage him to run around in a girl's bathing suit at the lake either. They knew that he would have been teased mercilessly for it. He was too young to understand that at the time, but when he got older, he was actually grateful that his mother had him dress more boyish while out in public. It saved him a lot of grief as a kyd.

Now, he dresses however he wishes at home, but doesn't want to go out dressed up because he knows it will stigmatize him. It's something that I completely respect.

A five-year old child is far too young to understand the consequences of their actions...that's why they have guardians. I do support kyds dressing up and doing whatever they want in privacy, and I'm happy that his dad is being cool about it.

Kim...how DARE you discourage a chyld from expressing himself!!! The outrage!!!

Also, juliewashere, nobody here was suggesting that the boy shouldn't play dress-up. We aren't suggesting that he be shoved in a closet. I don't know where you come up with this shit sometimes.

Nobody here was gay-bashing, TG-bashing or anything else of the kind. I am very supportive of all lifestyle choices, but all lifestyle choices come with consequences. I am currently working with a TG M2F who is terrified of changing, because it could cost her job, her family AND her friends. She has been my client for over two years now. I am slowly getting her to come to her own conclusion about what will make her happiest.

I am CF, and I KNOW there are consequences to that as well. My opinions don't always sit well with people. My lifestyle offends breeders. My lifestyle choice comes with minor penalties, but just because I don't believe in throwing caution to the wind (which is one reason I didn't have baybees) doesn't mean I should give it up and follow the lifescript. Encouraging a child to participate in something that could cause him greater misery, for the instant gratificaton of having fun, is to me...throwing caution to the wind.

I don't know why you come to these conclusions, and why you would suggest that ANY of us leave the board to sluice....the same thing could be said to you. See how much you like it.

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mumofsixbirds
Also, juliewashere, nobody here was suggesting that the boy shouldn't play dress-up. We aren't suggesting that he be shoved in a closet. I don't know where you come up with this shit sometimes.

Nobody here was gay-bashing, TG-bashing or anything else of the kind. I am very supportive of all lifestyle choices, but all lifestyle choices come with consequences. I am currently working with a TG M2F who is terrified of changing, because it could cost her job, her family AND her friends. She has been my client for over two years now. I am slowly getting her to come to her own conclusion about what will make her happiest.

I am CF, and I KNOW there are consequences to that as well. My opinions don't always sit well with people. My lifestyle offends breeders. My lifestyle choice comes with minor penalties, but just because I don't believe in throwing caution to the wind (which is one reason I didn't have baybees) doesn't mean I should give it up and follow the lifescript.

I don't know why you come to these conclusions, and why you would suggest that ANY of us leave the board to sluice....the same thing could be said to you. See how much you like it.

I agree with you 100% mumofsixbirds. When I read juliewashere's post I did major and didn't know where the hell she came up with that bullshit telling posters here to leave and go breed. Pffft. WTFE.

In ten years this kid will turn to his father and say "Remember that goofy phase when I wanted to wear a skirt and then my name was in all the papers? The kids in high school remember too! I'm a fucking pariah and it's all your fault, Dad! What're you, a closet homo? I HATE YOU!"

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also I am not looking for a women with kids or diseases herpes or any other sexual deceases