Worship of Breeding

I couldn't agree more! The whole little-girl-with-horses thing just disgusts me. And don't even get me started on UNICORNS! UGHH!! Go down the toy aisle for little girls--all you see is (1) princess sh*t, (2) unicorns, (3) horses, (4) dolls that glorify moohood, (5) little baby dolls so that a 6-year-old can play moomie, and (6) fake kitchen crap. Gee, do you think little girls could grow up to be anything but a spoiled entitlement-minded little b*tch that worships moohood? At least the toys for boys are more open minded, such as telescopes, microscopes, and chemistry sets. When my ex-best-friend sprogged and had a little girl, that was the beginning of the end. Her room was made into a Disney-ized Cinderella-Princess-Barfarama. It makes me SICK. And what's with the d*mn unicorns, anyway?

Who figures and immigrant is gonna have a pony? --Jerry Seinfeld

It's worse than even I thought. Here is a post I read on-line. I never realized that I was so *hated* just because I don't have kids.

"Reason eleven. We can out-breed the liberals and re-take our country in 2-3 generations. Most libs only have 1-2 children, if any at all (That's why they have to steal ours in the government schools, after all.) Do the math, then have another one, home-school all that you have and watch what happens.

BINGO! The future belongs to those who are willing to colonize it, by launching and funding colonists in that direction. The other team is busy exterminating itself through its love of death and hatred of God. The future is up for grabs -- and this is one home school dad who is grabbing with both hands and all my heart! (Before I finish my course, I hope to look at Mars and pray for descendents living and working there!) "

Wow. These breeders really hate us. If they are so full of "love", why do they spew so much hatred?

Fundie breeders are the worst bigots alive. They can't see past their own noses. Don't they ever ask themselves, when they're feeling particularly hateful, what God would think of that? Isn't God supposed to be all about love, and forgiveness? What would Jesus do? Would Jesus approve of their hatred towards others? Goddamn hypocrite fundie bastards, fuck'em all! Oh, gee. That wasn't very charitable, and loving was it? Oh, well.

The person who posted really doesn't know what he/she is talking about and I take exception to his/her bullshit about little girls and horses. I've loved horses all my life as have many other women. If you would care to do a little checking, you might notice that many of the world class riders in dressage, hunter/jumper, cross country, trail, western pleasure and reining are women. Anky van Grunsven, a Dutch woman, has been one of the top 3 or 4 dressage riders in the world for several years. Princess Anne of Great Britain was an Olympian in equestrian events and her mother is very much respected for her knowledge of horses. Little girls learn responsibility when they get into the horses thing, like mucking out stables, feeding, grooming, working to pay for horse stuff, sportsmanship and courtesy, among other things. This kind of activity keeps kids out of the malls and out of trouble. I know this from personal experience so please, educate yourself a little. If you find something "sick" about this, it's probably because you have that kind of tendency.

There really is no reason that little girls can't play with chemistry sets or telescopes. I played with my brother's toy trucks and Lincoln logs as well as my dolls and other girl things when I was a kid. I now drive a pick-up truck and am a hell of a good cook. Just didn't get into the child thing. I think the Betsy Westy doll that needed constant changing kind of sealed the deal for me. But, if you're not involved in buying kids toys, why bother with it? I mean, is it really worth your time to be concerned about what other people buy their kids? Kids change with time and experience anyway. Just because a little girl gets dolls and princess and Barbies and all that doesn't mean squat, same as boys getting G.I. Joes and building sets and such.

As for the fundies and their crackpot notions, I don't think they were attacking you personally. I think they're just shooting off at the mouth in their own ignorant way. They are fundamentally clueless, hypocritical and cruel. While maddening beyond endurance sometimes, they aren't usually worth the effort to get excited over. They aren't going to "win" because there's no war or contest or game or whatever to "win."

Alright, Morganmad. Don't get your horses all riled up. OF COURSE there's nothing wrong with horses. What I am talking about is these BREEDERS that have a girl and suddenly their whole life is princess fairy-tale b*llsh*t. It's unnerving. A friend of 20 years sprogged a girl. Suddenly, his whole world became Disney-ized. Princess this, unicorn that. On his minivan is a sticker that says "Future Princess on Board." And no, I don't take special interest in the toy aisle, but I do have to venture that way to get gifts for nieces and nephews, and it's REALLY HARD to avoid all the Little Princess crap. And, I NEVER said girls can't play with the other cool things. I am talking about how these items are marketed in the stores. They don't put the chemistry sets in the girl aisle, now do they???? Please READ the post before getting so angry.

I did read the post and I'm not angry; I was pointing out an error in what was said and/or implied. I haven't been in a toy store since about 1996 but I haven't seen aisles marked "Girls" or "Boys" since the late 60s or early 70s. If you dislike the way things are marketed, have you tried doing anything about it, like start a letter writing campaign or a boycott or something?

"What I am talking about is these BREEDERS that have a girl and suddenly their whole life is princess fairy-tale b*llsh*t. It's unnerving. A friend of 20 years sprogged a girl. Suddenly, his whole world became Disney-ized. Princess this, unicorn that. On his minivan is a sticker that says "Future Princess on Board.""

So what? Are you saying that breeeders aren't allowed to make their own choices? Don't you think it's their business if they want fairy princess stuff all over or Disney things out the wazoo? Isn't the big thing with us, as CF, respecting someone's choices and their right to make those choices?

The toy aisle thing is so true. I had to venture there not so long ago, and it's really bad. Everything is pink- everything. The kitchen crap is awful(pink), and they have washer/dryer sets,too(pink w/sparkles). It was nauseating. The dolls were enough to give me nightmares, forever. The "realistic" ones were the most horrid things ever created. They look all waxy, like they're still coated with vernix. When I was a kid, there was this doll called "Chew, Susie, Chew". Does anyone remember that? It was the first one of these realistic dolls. You'd feed it this special "food", and it would come out the other end looking the same as it did going in. One of it's meals was red. After "burping" it (which was really just patting the food through the doll), it would crap. The thing looked like it was bleeding out of it's arse.
The whole idea is to develop the breeder instincts early on. Then when the girls become tweens, they can move- up to those slutty Bratz dolls. After that, they ho around, get knocked- up, and feed the breeding industry a new consumer group. We're living in a sad world, friends...

I've always disliked pink and tossed most toys in that color. It didn't take long to stop receiving pink toys. there have been toy kitchens on the market for 50 years that I know of and I've never met anyone whose life course was determined by them. Most kids go through various stages in their likes and dislikes and interests. At least now more parents are willing to give a chemistry set or tlescope or building set to a girl than when I was a kid. I've also seen commercials in which both boys and girls are playing with non-pink, non-"girly" toys like building sets and such. If someone wants to give their kid pink toys, well, that's their business. There are far more important things to get worked up about than the color or type of toys someone's kids have.

Oh, yeah, I agree. I wasn't there for fun- I had to pick up a gift for my niece. It was just something I noticed. I don't remember the toys being as breeder- oriented when I was a kid, though. Next time you're at Target, just take a walk past the aisles- don't go look or anything, but peek. This stuff is bad. I was feeling a little bit bad for the kids, these toys sucked!

Fortunately, my nieces are far beyond that kind of toy now. Their toys are electronic, computer-related and expensive but they also like books so I don't have to break the bank at Christmas. Since I don't have any interest in buying kids toys any more, I ignore them for the most part. I have a weakness for those tacky stuffed toys that move and play cheesy Christmas music but that's about all I ever look at. But, still, to each his own. Stores will stock what consumers want to buy, whether it's toys, cars, clothes, books, electronic gizmos or what have you. That's the nature of commerce.

What is puzzling is the ASSumption that, because someone chooses to spend their money differently than others, that said person is automatically a BREEDER. That's really presumptuous and rather hypocritical in that CF dislike being labled or having ASSumptions made about them. And don't even think of coming back with some childish nonsense about how "they" do it. Just because someone else does something doesn't mean a) it's right or b) you have to do it, too. "They" do it, too, or"they" did it first is what you expect to hear on an elementary school playground, nor from those claiming to be adults.

There are plenty of places online where you can go to sympathize/agree with/protect breeders. Why do it here, on a CF **RANT BOARD**, where the CF go to RANT about all things kid-centric, including breeder-minded toys? We come here to RANT in a sort of SANCTUARY. If I wanted to hear a speech about BREEDER'S rights, I would go to any one of a million parent boards. AH, now I feel better. Alas, this place isn't as CF/rant/vent friendly as I once believed. How sad. I think I'll go to a Parent board and see how many lectures on "parent's rights" I can get.

Toys are important because they are we socialize little boys and little girls. A little girl growing up receiving 'proper' girls toys like dolls and kitchen sets will pretty soon figure out that to be a 'proper' women she must like these things and learn to use them because that is her role in life. Similarly little boys get guns .... guess their proper role in life is to be Bush-fodder.

If none of this is 'important' if it does not 'matter' then why does society work so damn hard to push appropriate gender roles on to kids - starting with the toys they get as kids and the way that shops aare so careful to designate these by gender?

Get over yourself, CF4Ever. I'm not defending or pleasing or sympathizing with breeders, nor did I say anything about breeder's rights outside of the those rights common to everyone. The right to ordinary courtesy, for example. I'm pointing out the inherent hypocrisy in your neverending, childish squawking. You have no clue in the world if the people who buy those toys are breeders or not, you just want to complain. This is not worth ranting about. Are they making you pay for the toys? Live with the toys? Deal with the kids playing with the toys? How is it any of your business? Have you considered actually getting off your dead ass and doing something about the things that are so bloody offensive to you or are you just a whiner? Excuse me, whining is breeder behavior, isn't it?

You demand various rights for yourself but fail to see that other people also have those rights. It's EXACTLY the entitlement-minded behavior you accuse breeders of having. You also fail to note that not everyone who has a child or multiples thereof is a breeder. Rant all you want but no one is required to agree with you or foampad the world for you. If you can't handle the fact that others have opinions different from yours, that's your problem and you need to deal with it.

This is for Morganmad. I pasted this directly from the "About This Site" page of Bratfree.

"Content
This site was created to provide a forum (free of judgement) for the childfree to rant/vent. Many childfree people have no outlet for the many frustrations they face because of their childfree lifestyle. This site is for those people. It is a place to both vent and discuss other childfree issues. While it was created specifically for those who neither have nor want children of their own, Bratfree.com welcomes all who support the childfree. "

I believe I was VENTING. You have no right to judge me or anyone else here. I didn't judge YOU.

Am I in the wrong place? I don't mind leaving, there are plenty of on-line forums to vent about kids/parents/kid-centric society. Maybe, somehow, Morganmad is right. Maybe all this whining IS childish. Hmmm. Give me minute on this one....

And I was discussing ("discuss other childfree issues"). As for judging you,I wasn't but you are certainly quick to judge others. If you can't take it, don't hand it out. I abhor the hypocritical position taken by so many so-called CF who demand respect for their choices but refuse to accord the same respect to others who make choices different from theirs.

Re: right-wing fundies are overbreeding for the wrong reasons (i.e. to "outbreed the liberals")"

It's stupid of them to assume that all of their kids are also going to grow up to be right-wing fundies. It's not unheard of for kids to rebel and to have completely different ideas than their parents. Many of the '60s radicals came from conservative 1950's homes.

I guarantee that at least 50% of these fundie-raised kids are going to rebel.

And as for the girly toy thing, I couldn't agree more. Growing up in the early '70s, my clothes were unisex and so were my toys. I had dolls and stuffed animals, but I also had toy soldiers, cars, blocks, etc.

It does seem like things have gone backwards for today's girls. Everything is pink, princessy stuff. I see the crap they give my 4-year-old neice, and then I see her ignoring it and playing with her little brother's trucks. And the family is so blind to it! Instead they make dumb comments like, "Look at the boy playing with that truck! It's instinctive."

HuH? Then why is the girl playing with the truck too? And why does this same little nephew put on his mom's high-heeled shoes and try to walk around in them?

Annonymouse Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Toys are important because they are we socialize
> little boys and little girls. A little girl
> growing up receiving 'proper' girls toys like
> dolls and kitchen sets will pretty soon figure out
> that to be a 'proper' women she must like these
> things and learn to use them because that is her
> role in life. Similarly little boys get guns ....
> guess their proper role in life is to be
> Bush-fodder.
>
> If none of this is 'important' if it does not
> 'matter' then why does society work so damn hard
> to push appropriate gender roles on to kids -
> starting with the toys they get as kids and the
> way that shops aare so careful to designate these
> by gender?


Exactly. I don't think MorganMad is getting it. We CF don't live in a vaccuum. How other people raise their kids DOES affect us and will affect us in the future, when all the women become SAHMs because those were the only toys they were given.

Growing up, a certain type of toy was never forced on my brother and I. Thank the Gods, too. Our parents asked us what we liked and it was usually constructive types of things: pottery wheel, crafts, things to build, etc. I did play with Barbies but to me, Barbie is a toy that you can "build" a "dream life" that you would like to have as an adult. That's pretty much what I did with them. I feel sorry for kids who are force-fed the bullshit dolls and everything else. It seems the parents are trying to create little clones of themselves.

Whew! Thank you, fellow CF'ers. I thought I was in the wrong place for a while. Now, back to our regularly scheduled ranting and **REAL** CF venting and opinion-sharing.

My goddaughter is INUNDATED with princess crap. Her mom gives her all the princess-your-so-speshal-and-better-than-everyone-else CRAP, and it sickens me. I thought maybe these friends would be different when when they adopted a girl (which was a noble gesture), but NO. They started with the PRINCESS talk almost immediately, and then asking me over and over, "don't you want kids?" From then on, EVERYTHING in their lives revolved around The Princess. No more fun evenings playing cards or watching cool movies. This effects my life directly--I basically lost a good friend. I tried to "get past" it for so long, but I just couldn't stand the constant princess talk. Also, just because my friend's life now revolves around Walt Disney doesn't mean mine has to.

I "get" it, CF Scorpio, but I don't think you do. Children's toys are not a big deal except to the kids themselves and their parents. How someone CHOOSES to raise their child is their business. Until the child actually infringes on your rights in some way, what is the big deal? Just because a little girl is given dolls and toy kitchens does not mean she will grow up to be a mother of any kind, nor does giving a truck to a boy ensure he will work around trucks as an adult. How many CF women do you think had dolls as children? How many were steered into the mother mold? And, if they're CF, do you "get" it that it didn't matter? And all the women are not going to become SAHMs any more than everyone is going to be CF or fundie or whatever. That's not even remotely sensible.

As for forcing certain toys on a kid, it never has worked and never will. If a kid is more interested in playing with cardboard boxes, that's what he'll play with. And toys don't dictate what a child becomes in adulthood.

Shops are displaying toys in a manner that will cause the toys to be sold. It's simple merchandising and has nothing to do with gender roles or future parenthood or anything like that. They set things up to sell them and they sell what people are buying. People who don't like those things, guess what they do? They don't buy them! Amazing, isn't it?

Not all little boys get guns; many don't as a matter of fact and by the time they are old enough to go into military service, Bush will be long gone from power. If you think society is pushing gender roles now, you need to get a clue. Look back to the first 6 decades of the twentieth century, for starters, and you'll be enlightened. There is more gender role pushing in some imaginations than in real life.

Childfree Ladies and Gentlemen, methinks we have a Troll amongst us. According to this person, we CF have ABSOLUTELY NOTHING legitimate to complain about. Unfair taxes? Our imagination. Princess toys? Not an issue. Children being raised rotten? Not our business.

WHAT?? This is a CF board. Morganmad, go back to the parent or parent wannabe boards, please.

So, if someone dares to disagree with you, they are automatically a troll? I never said that CF have nothing to complain about. I merely pointed out the gross hypocrisy of your position re: some one else making a decision different from yours. You've yet to respond to that, by the way.

Kids toys generally don't impact anyone outside their own family unless they leave the stuff out in the street.You weren't talking about someone raising their children rotten, just whining about the choices they made for their kids toys. And princess toys are not worth complaining about. You can claim to be CF but you have an unhealthy obsession with parents and their chldren. Most adult CF have other things to do, talk about, think about, etc. Try getting a hobby or something and you'll find you won't have to spend so much time fussing over parents and kids. It works, it really does. I've been CF for 56 years and I can assure you there are many things to talk about or think about than parents and kids.

Morganman, I've read your posts. You frequently criticize US for our rants. That's fine, I can take it. However, what CF complaints DO you have? Or do you just like to rant about our rants? We come here to vent, not to have a finger in our face pointing out our flawed thinking. We get ENOUGH of that from parents. The only thing worse than a judgemental parent is a self-righteous childless person. (After reading all your posts, I've come to the sad conclusion that you are CL, not CF.) There, now THAT'S a judgement, and it may be wrong, you know.

If you have CF complaints, bring 'em on, and stop critiquing our rants. Besides, you haven't been there for all of our experiences in this kid-centric world. Maybe you live in a CF utopia where all the parents and kids are wonderful, but that's not the case here.

Grow up, little girl. Your main problem here is that someone disagreed with you and called your hypocrisy for what it is. I don't have children because I didn't want any. Very simple. A matter of choice. Whatever complaints I have are definitely more substantial than pink toys. Half the complaints that the so-called CF ramble on about are either non-existent, exaggerated beyond reason or self-inflicted. Frankly, I've found relatively little that is really worth complaining about but maybe I just learned what's worth fussing about and what isn't. If I choose to disagree and not follow the "childfree" script like a sheeple, then so what? Maybe you need to do a bit more thinking than skimming the surface before doing your wah-wah-wah-ing.