Have Yourself Spayed or Neutered, Fucking Breeders

Yurble, it is in no way my point to portray animals as inherently friendly and loving, yes I know they can be cruel. In fact your examples were in fact on my mind when I wrote what I wrote.

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yurble

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law1204
I've never seen an animal deliberately torture another animal for a prolonged period of time, or kill other animals en masse.

I've seen this happen with untrained dogs and animals they see as prey. They will kill everything they can.

I don't think the instinct of a wild dog or pack of dogs would fall in the same category as when militaries drop bombs on civilian areas. Wild dogs have a strong prey drive and that is inherent in them, but they aren't deliberately torturing their prey on par with what happened in the Hanoi Hilton or during the bombing of Hiroshima, for example.

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As for torture, haven't you seen a cat play with a mouse?

Yes, I have, and I am sure the mouse feels fear but cats are actually honing their hunting instincts, not torturing their prey for the fun of it. What a cat does to a mouse when it plays with it I don't think falls on the same plane as what happened to Native Americans on the Trail of Tears or to Americans and Filipinos during the Bataan Death March, for example.

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What about chickens picking on each other? In every coop there's one hen missing most of the feathers on her back because the others peck at her...

This is true, meanwhile humans have burned other humans alive at the stake for religious reasons.

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Given an opportunity and lack of natural controls, any species will overfill its ecosystem, killing other species in the process.

Here's a paper from the National Academy of Sciences outlining extinctions on islands from other species, vs extinctions worldwide caused by humans and human factors.
http://www.pnas.org/content/105/suppl.1/11490.full

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I don't think humans are exceptional in our cruelty

Yeah, I kinda do, when I see things like mass graves and nuclear bombs and oil spills, etc. Because we know better.

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I find it hard to believe in the inherent kindness of nature or animals. A documentary of lions which shows them eating a gazelle without even killing it first tells me that kindness is not the norm.

I don't think animals are inherently kind. I also don't think, like humans, that they are evil - and I say evil specifically BECAUSE humans have the capacity to rise above acting like they don't know the difference.

I am no expert, but other than some documented cases of primates actually committing murder for various reasons, much like humans, most all other animals kill or appear to "torture" other animals due to hunting instincts, hunger, self preservation, or in defense of their territory, selves, offspring, or possibly in defense of another of their pride,herd, group, etc..... Of course I can't know what any animal is actually thinking, for the most part, but I seriously doubt they kill for fun, amusement, greed, jealousy(except maybe some primates) and certainly not for drugs, oil, weapons, etc..........................like humans have been known to do.

My mother has never had a desire to have pets or share her home with animals, in OR outdoor pets, and her only explanation to me over the years has been, "I just don't want to", much like her pat(and teary eyed, wounded look) answer as to why she is a Christian is, "I don't know! I just have faith!!" So, other than my mother, I have never known anyone who had no desire for a pet well enough to ask them why. If anyone cared to explain to me why they have no desire for a pet, beyond pets aren't allowed where they live or serious allergies, I'd appreciate it if they might explain their reasons. I am genuinely curious and don't mean to sound judgmental because obviously it's not really any of my business and doesn't affect me personally if someone doesn't desire a pet of any kind. It's just not something I can imagine for myself, that's all.

yurble, I'd like to hear from you because I know that if you don't mind sharing about it that you'd give a pretty damned good and easy to understand answer for your feelings on the subject. If not, that's okay because I am just being nosy anyway.

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If YOU are the "exception" to what I am saying, then why does my commentary bother you so much?
I don't hate your kids, I HATE YOU!

And please stp adopting me "for the kids"- they don't give a shit.....



IN HONOUR OF SAVANNAH.

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Miss_Hannigan
Worst of all are breeders who give up animals because they shat a loaf, and The Precious Baybee Snowflake's needs come first. Breeders like that are the most inhuman, self-centered monsters on earth. And yes, there really are monsters living among us.

OR GET THE DESIGNER CAT AFTER YEARS OF PREACHING ABOUT SAVING STREET CATS- I'M LOOKIN RIGHT AT YOU "URSULA, LYING, 2 FACED BITCH."

I'm curious.
Does anyone here own a fox/foxes?
As in, Red, Fennec, or Arctic?
I'm really interested in getting one someday and I'd like some advice from an actual owner.

“I don’t have pet peeves, I have major, psychotic fucking hatreds.”
— George Carlin

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kidlesskim
My mother has never had a desire to have pets or share her home with animals, in OR outdoor pets, and her only explanation to me over the years has been, "I just don't want to", much like her pat(and teary eyed, wounded look) answer as to why she is a Christian is, "I don't know! I just have faith!!" So, other than my mother, I have never known anyone who had no desire for a pet well enough to ask them why. If anyone cared to explain to me why they have no desire for a pet, beyond pets aren't allowed where they live or serious allergies, I'd appreciate it if they might explain their reasons. I am genuinely curious and don't mean to sound judgmental because obviously it's not really any of my business and doesn't affect me personally if someone doesn't desire a pet of any kind. It's just not something I can imagine for myself, that's all.

yurble, I'd like to hear from you because I know that if you don't mind sharing about it that you'd give a pretty damned good and easy to understand answer for your feelings on the subject. If not, that's okay because I am just being nosy anyway.

I suppose I have a number of reasons. First, I grew up in a rural area, and I tend to have a more utilitarian approach to domesticated animals than most people here. I don't often elaborate on these views because I am aware most people on this board have a different view, and I don't want to offend or get in a fight over this. Now that I live in a city, I simply don't have any need for the functions an animal can perform (for instance, I don't need a cat to prevent mice from getting into the grain).

Second, I have allergies and couldn't have indoor pets. Outdoor pets are not really an option in the city, as it's cruel to keep animals where they don't have space to run around.

Third, having an animal requires a measure of commitment and responsibility--medical care, shelter, opportunities to exercise, and food and water at a minimum. (If you keep an animal indoors, you also have a responsibility to entertain it to some extent.) I have no real desire to take on that commitment or responsibility. I also would rather spend my free time doing something other than entertaining or caring for something.

Fourth, I am somewhat concerned about the ecological impact of pet ownership. It's better than a lot of other things people do, but it still strikes me as wasteful. (Remember, I am also opposed to human reproduction, and I think it's far better to have pets than to have children.)

Now, none of this is to say that I don't have sympathy for the many animals that are put down, or that I don't think other people should own pets. It does make me sad to see colonies of feral cats which inhabit many parts of the world. I would feel bad for any creature that is suffering without purpose. I just don't have a romantic view of either humans or other animals.

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law1204

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yurble
I find it hard to believe in the inherent kindness of nature or animals. A documentary of lions which shows them eating a gazelle without even killing it first tells me that kindness is not the norm.

I don't think animals are inherently kind. I also don't think, like humans, that they are evil - and I say evil specifically BECAUSE humans have the capacity to rise above acting like they don't know the difference.

It's just a different way of looking at it. I would say that humans and animals share a lot of characteristics, and we are both capable of 'cruelty'--cruelty being causing the suffering of another creature without it being absolutely necessary (like lions eating the gazelle before they kill it). What distinguishes humans is that we have the potential to go beyond our instincts, and it is because of this potential (when it is not followed up on) that we become worse than other animals.

So, for me, it's not what we do, but that we have the option to do otherwise that makes our actions wrong...but all animals are cruel, because nature is cruel and requires that we kill to live.

I agree animals are cruel and nature is cruel. On QI a couple of weeks ago they showed a clip of this tree spore that sends ants mad and makes them climb up these trees when they normally don't. Then the tree sends a shoot into the ant's brain and makes more spores, basically sucking the ant dry in the process, not unlike a vampire.

However, I am with Law on the fact that humans are worse since we have ego. We know what we're doing to the environment, we have the ability to stop what we're doing, yet we choose not too. No-one on the planet need be hungary or homeless, but the 1% of people wouldn't even be happy with 90% of the wealth. They want to keep the whole 99%. And they'll have the remaining 1% back, just like in proper feudal times, as soon as they can.

Animals may well act ammorally, but only humans can be immoral. In my opinion, that's so much worse. And animals will usually learn to be kind if they're treated with kindness, depending on the animal. Humans often exploit the kindness of other humans.

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GaiasRevenge
I agree animals are cruel and nature is cruel. On QI a couple of weeks ago they showed a clip of this tree spore that sends ants mad and makes them climb up these trees when they normally don't. Then the tree sends a shoot into the ant's brain and makes more spores, basically sucking the ant dry in the process, not unlike a vampire.

Cordyceps lloydii! My favorite fungus. Yes, I know, I'm a geek.

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GaiasRevenge
Animals may well act ammorally, but only humans can be immoral. In my opinion, that's so much worse. And animals will usually learn to be kind if they're treated with kindness, depending on the animal. Humans often exploit the kindness of other humans.

I think we're saying the same thing here, just in different ways. I agree with this statement.

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yurble

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GaiasRevenge
Animals may well act ammorally, but only humans can be immoral. In my opinion, that's so much worse. And animals will usually learn to be kind if they're treated with kindness, depending on the animal. Humans often exploit the kindness of other humans.

I think we're saying the same thing here, just in different ways. I agree with this statement.

As do I, thank you GR for boiling it down exactly.

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yurble
I just don't have a romantic view of either humans or other animals.

I was curious about this as well.
Your answer makes plenty of sense.
It's different for me because of my experiences.
I grew up being picked on by cruel humans and so I turned to my pets which didn't hurt or scar me mentally like people did over the years.
This is why I'm misanthropic.

“I don’t have pet peeves, I have major, psychotic fucking hatreds.”
— George Carlin

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frenzy

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yurble
I just don't have a romantic view of either humans or other animals.

I was curious about this as well.
Your answer makes plenty of sense.
It's different for me because of my experiences.
I grew up being picked on by cruel humans and so I turned to my pets which didn't hurt or scar me mentally like people did over the years.
This is why I'm misanthropic.

Aww, dude I could've written that!

My experience too. An animal will never pretend to be your friend just coz you've got a car or make fun of your speech impediment. Animals rule!

hankyou yurble!


Your answer contains the clue that is very likely the reason my mother feels the same way that you do! She grew up on a farm too and from what I can tell she absolutely HATED it. Her lifestyle since I have known her is as far away from rural, farming, and anything related to it that can be imagined. I think her friends and acquaintances would be shocked to learn she lived on a farm in a rural area until she was 16 years of age. For whatever reason that's a part of her life she rarely talks about, but she likely grew up with that same point of view due to the circumstances of farm life. At least now I have a clue as to her reasoning and for the life of me I don't understand why she just didn't tell me that, but maybe she really isn't aware of it herself.

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If YOU are the "exception" to what I am saying, then why does my commentary bother you so much?
I don't hate your kids, I HATE YOU!

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kidlesskim
hankyou yurble!


Your answer contains the clue that is very likely the reason my mother feels the same way that you do! She grew up on a farm too and from what I can tell she absolutely HATED it. Her lifestyle since I have known her is as far away from rural, farming, and anything related to it that can be imagined. I think her friends and acquaintances would be shocked to learn she lived on a farm in a rural area until she was 16 years of age. For whatever reason that's a part of her life she rarely talks about, but she likely grew up with that same point of view due to the circumstances of farm life. At least now I have a clue as to her reasoning and for the life of me I don't understand why she just didn't tell me that, but maybe she really isn't aware of it herself.

It's not the most common view in developed countries at this time (in the past, when more people lived in rural areas, it was more common, and it's more common in developing countries), so some people might not want to mention holding an unpopular view. Also, many people aren't prone to introspection and don't think about the roots of their views, they just hold them. Perhaps it is one of those reasons.

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yurble

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kidlesskim
hankyou yurble!


Your answer contains the clue that is very likely the reason my mother feels the same way that you do! She grew up on a farm too and from what I can tell she absolutely HATED it. Her lifestyle since I have known her is as far away from rural, farming, and anything related to it that can be imagined. I think her friends and acquaintances would be shocked to learn she lived on a farm in a rural area until she was 16 years of age. For whatever reason that's a part of her life she rarely talks about, but she likely grew up with that same point of view due to the circumstances of farm life. At least now I have a clue as to her reasoning and for the life of me I don't understand why she just didn't tell me that, but maybe she really isn't aware of it herself.

It's not the most common view in developed countries at this time (in the past, when more people lived in rural areas, it was more common, and it's more common in developing countries), so some people might not want to mention holding an unpopular view. Also, many people aren't prone to introspection and don't think about the roots of their views, they just hold them. Perhaps it is one of those reasons.

I think you are correct and I absolutely didn't inherit my inquisitive mind or tendency to analyze every little thing from her either. My mother can't, or won't, give a reason for anything she does or believes including any possible reasons for any of her phobias, which are numerous. It's not just that she won't tell you why, but she clams up and goes on the defensive when questioned and goes back and forth between being annoyed and visibly upset even over the smallest of things like with the apparent fear of most animals and the not wanting any animals around. I guess there are just some things I will never understand or know about the basis for many of her beliefs, actions, or mindset.

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If YOU are the "exception" to what I am saying, then why does my commentary bother you so much?
I don't hate your kids, I HATE YOU!

I absolutely despise breeders who use animals like fucking toys.

My brother and his...wife(?) have had more animals than they can count. At first, they got a black lab puppy just a month before she became pregnant, who they classily named "Meatball". They lived in a very small townhouse with a very small backyard, and since my SIL was pregnant, she just COULDN'T walk the puppy. So, the dog turned out to be a maniac. He chewed everything, went to the bathroom EVERYWHERE, and had no boundaries. My brother is a Marine, and was out in the field for days at a time, so he mostly got the dog as a "trophy" of sorts while my SIL had to deal with it. Of course, she never tried training him, though. They just chalked it up as being a "bad dog". So, instead of training this dog, they fucking got a chihuahua. This dog was a mess, too. She also was not house-broken, even though they got her a "bathroom mat" so my SIL didn't even have to get out of the house to house-break her. Of course, the black Labrador dug a hole in their backyard under the fence, so the chihuahua got out and was hit by a car. They tried keeping her (without getting surgery for her legs, which made her have to walk sideways) but ended up giving the un-housebroken, crippled DOG (not puppy anymore) away back to the store. After the baby was born, they also gave away the horrible Labrador dog after they fucked him up and nobody would want him since he was no longer a puppy.

Move ahead a few months (after a couple months of them having a divorce scare) and they "babysit" a friends dog for around a month. The dog randomly bit people, but was pretty relaxed. The dog being fucked up wasn't their fault this time. Then they got two kittens (for their baybee) which they kept for, like, two weeks. I don't know how they fucked them over, so meh. The next animal they decided to get was a one-year-old black lab mix. Now, this dog was mostly fucked up because of his former owner, but they did NO help. They kept the poor thing in a cage almost the entire time. So one day when the dog was out of his cage, he tore up their bathroom. My SIL was/is pregnant AGAIN, so she called us up and dumped their mistake onto us. This dog could NOT be chained up outside due to excessive barking. Not only that, but he always jumped on people. I have a giant scar that he gave me on my arm because of that habit that could have easily of been broken in a week. Of course, this dog wasn't house-broken either. After they all lived with us for about a month, they gave him away shortly before moving across country.

Now, the thing that pisses me off about how much these guys bounced around from animal to animal was their treatment of them. My SIL would constantly pull at the dogs ears, and was shocked when that didn't do anything when she did it when they actually misbehaved. My brother worked, so everytime he came home and heard of the dog misbehaving, he would give the dog a swift kick on the side, no matter what it was doing at the time. As if it fucking knew what it was being punished for. At one point, the dog fell down the stairs. My little sister informed me that it wasn't an accident, and that my brother kicked him down. Of course, I argued with them about this. Afterwards, I learned that it wasn't true, and that it was just an accident. However, during the argument, my SIL said "if you think that kicking him down the stairs is abuse, you should see what I do to him". They never walked their dogs unless it was with the baybee, kept them in cages for most of the day, and either didn't discipline them or took it way too far in a stupid manner. Instead of training their dogs, they sat on their asses and watched "Jersey Shore".

And these fuckers have KIDS. Who will probably end up being serial killers by watching their dumbass parents abuse their pets.

Now, I love my brother and SIL to death. However, loving somebody doesn't mean you have to think they AREN'T total idiots.

^^^Jesus fucking Christ on a skewer!

Did you consider calling the RSPCA (or equivilent)? These people should be BANNED from keeping animals for LIFE. And if I had my way, the kids would be taken away as well, and they'd both be sterilised. I know they're your family, but seriously, what sort of life lessons are they teaching the children? As you say yourself, they're gonna grow up majorly twisted since they've seen living creatures subjected to all kinds of cruelty as though it's acceptable.

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Puppysarebetter
I absolutely despise breeders who use animals like fucking toys.

My brother and his...wife(?) have had more animals than they can count. At first, they got a black lab puppy just a month before she became pregnant, who they classily named "Meatball". They lived in a very small townhouse with a very small backyard, and since my SIL was pregnant, she just COULDN'T walk the puppy. So, the dog turned out to be a maniac. He chewed everything, went to the bathroom EVERYWHERE, and had no boundaries. My brother is a Marine, and was out in the field for days at a time, so he mostly got the dog as a "trophy" of sorts while my SIL had to deal with it. Of course, she never tried training him, though. They just chalked it up as being a "bad dog". So, instead of training this dog, they fucking got a chihuahua. This dog was a mess, too. She also was not house-broken, even though they got her a "bathroom mat" so my SIL didn't even have to get out of the house to house-break her. Of course, the black Labrador dug a hole in their backyard under the fence, so the chihuahua got out and was hit by a car. They tried keeping her (without getting surgery for her legs, which made her have to walk sideways) but ended up giving the un-housebroken, crippled DOG (not puppy anymore) away back to the store. After the baby was born, they also gave away the horrible Labrador dog after they fucked him up and nobody would want him since he was no longer a puppy.

Move ahead a few months (after a couple months of them having a divorce scare) and they "babysit" a friends dog for around a month. The dog randomly bit people, but was pretty relaxed. The dog being fucked up wasn't their fault this time. Then they got two kittens (for their baybee) which they kept for, like, two weeks. I don't know how they fucked them over, so meh. The next animal they decided to get was a one-year-old black lab mix. Now, this dog was mostly fucked up because of his former owner, but they did NO help. They kept the poor thing in a cage almost the entire time. So one day when the dog was out of his cage, he tore up their bathroom. My SIL was/is pregnant AGAIN, so she called us up and dumped their mistake onto us. This dog could NOT be chained up outside due to excessive barking. Not only that, but he always jumped on people. I have a giant scar that he gave me on my arm because of that habit that could have easily of been broken in a week. Of course, this dog wasn't house-broken either. After they all lived with us for about a month, they gave him away shortly before moving across country.

Now, the thing that pisses me off about how much these guys bounced around from animal to animal was their treatment of them. My SIL would constantly pull at the dogs ears, and was shocked when that didn't do anything when she did it when they actually misbehaved. My brother worked, so everytime he came home and heard of the dog misbehaving, he would give the dog a swift kick on the side, no matter what it was doing at the time. As if it fucking knew what it was being punished for. At one point, the dog fell down the stairs. My little sister informed me that it wasn't an accident, and that my brother kicked him down. Of course, I argued with them about this. Afterwards, I learned that it wasn't true, and that it was just an accident. However, during the argument, my SIL said "if you think that kicking him down the stairs is abuse, you should see what I do to him". They never walked their dogs unless it was with the baybee, kept them in cages for most of the day, and either didn't discipline them or took it way too far in a stupid manner. Instead of training their dogs, they sat on their asses and watched "Jersey Shore".

And these fuckers have KIDS. Who will probably end up being serial killers by watching their dumbass parents abuse their pets.

Now, I love my brother and SIL to death. However, loving somebody doesn't mean you have to think they AREN'T total idiots.

I would have a hard time feeling love for anyone or continuing to love them if they were mean to animals. I know many might disagree with me, but I think the way people treat animals gives us a look into their true character.

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If YOU are the "exception" to what I am saying, then why does my commentary bother you so much?
I don't hate your kids, I HATE YOU!

Here's another shining example:

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3889508/Dog-drunk-on-Stella-scars-lad-10-for-life.html

Dog drunk on Stella scars lad, 10, for life

A BOY of ten is scarred for life after being savaged by a dog forced to drink Stella Artois.
Joseph Pickering was bitten in the face by a neighbour's Staffordshire bull terrier moments after it had the strong lager tipped in its mouth. so it's clearly not an alcoholic dog who demands his beer (though this has happened before, and again is all the owner's fault)

He needed a skin graft and now suffers nightmares. dyou think the dog dosen't?

The dog, called Diesel, escaped being destroyed after a court heard it was given the lager by its owner's uncle Paul Ashworth because it was "panting like mad" after a walk. what's wrong with water, you fucking retard?

Witness Julie Hind said: "He said the beer wouldn't hurt.

"The next thing, Joseph leaned over the gate and put both hands on the dog. I heard a snap and saw bleeding." because we all know that animals love a beer, right. And the kid has obviously not been taught how to handle animals. I'll bet he did more than 'put his hands on' the dog. Probably pulled his fur, look at his picture, you can see he's a little thug

Owner James Holmes, 24, of Colne, Lancs, admitted having a dangerous dog and was ordered to keep it under control after a hearing at Burnley Magistrates' Court.

Behaviourist David Gilman, who assessed the dog, said: "I can't recommend the uncle be put down but I'll plead strongly on the dog's behalf." :yr Mr Gilman, though I would have argued that you could recommend the uncle be put down

But last night Joseph's mother Carolann Dickson, 43, branded the decision to spare the dog "disgusting".

She said: "I remember Joseph shouting, 'Help, help'. I could almost see his skull — it was awful.

"He said in the ambulance, 'Mum, am I going to die?' That's not something any mother wants to hear.

"The dog should have been destroyed and that's that." How about you keep an eye on your kid, and accept that it's not the fucking dog's fault, you stupid Moo! Reserve your hatred for the uncle

All my pets have been rescues.

And to the dumbfuck troll, if they are reading this...I do not wear leather and only eat humanely raised meat. Go do your FUCKING JOB.

God bless the small ones.

The fucktard with the camera shouldn't be allowed to have pets or kids.

I want to slap the shit out of that kid and its stupid asshole breeders. Poor sweet cat.

Fucking ugly little garden gnome, and stupid asshole breeder behind the camera.

One of these days (if it hasn't happened already), the poor kitteh will get REALLY sick of having his/her hair pulled and claw the shit out of that nasty brat's face. And then get put to sleep, of course.