Dear Prudie: I don't have kids. My father thinks I'm worthless and should die. Family agrees :wtf

My nomination for Piece o' Shit Family of the Year

That person has been given a gift. They can now cut off the toxic people who have made their feelings clear and go forth to create a true family for their self.

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Q. Avoiding Family Holidays: My career has led me to go to school and get a good job far away from family. My parents and my sister, brother-in-law, and nephew still live in the same area so every holiday I fly to see them. Last Christmas, my father declared that holidays were only for people who had children and that anyone who doesn’t have children is worthless and has no reason to live. Everyone but myself at the table agreed. I was the only person at that table that doesn’t have a child and needless to say I was hurt. After the festivities were done, I took my father aside to politely express my hurt to him. He starting yelling at me that I was just jealous of my sibling and that he stands by his judgment. I’m glad my sibling is happy but I never want to be her and I love my life. Before that holiday, I thought I had a supportive family that was proud of me. Now I find myself not wanting to fly back for any of the holidays. How should I handle my family’s requests that I visit?

A: You could say something like, “After last year’s discussion, I’m afraid I simply can’t guarantee that if I fly out to see you my plane will be hit by a drone, explode, and then my worthless life will blessedly be over.” I’m glad you spoke up to your father because sometimes people say idiotic things then when called out on it, explain, “I didn’t mean you, honey!” But apparently he meant you. You say to your family that you remain shaken by the dreadful things said about your life. You don’t feel you’re being overly sensitive when you object to being told you have no reason to live. If they want to revise their stand, then you will be happy to listen, and then you will consider if you have reason to come for the holiday.

Wow. That's just horrible. :hs

What a bunch of assholes. fuck

Pfft, I would probably never speak to them again. No contact, zip, no flouncy email or anything. I'd rather spend the holidays alone, and I'd be happy as a clam for it. Doesn't matter to someone if they're blood, if they are assholes, they have no place in my life.

My dh's toxic family has been out of our lives for years now... That calm is so enjoyable. Everyone should give it a try. I highly endorse the purging of the toxic families.

I know how to fix this. A few years of no call/no show. They will be apologizing in no time.

Bet my paycheck that if any of the breeding family members committed a crime or perpetrated an act of social disgrace, they'd be excused. Choose not to breed, or refuse to commit to a schedule of when they'd expand the family's DNA pool, and they are the ostracized black sheep.

Yep, wouldn't surprise me at all.

The cruelty of breeders towards the CF knows no bounds.

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Techie
I know how to fix this. A few years of no call/no show. They will be apologizing in no time.

Whew. Not from what I've learned reading dozens of cases on this site

http://community.babycenter.com/groups/a4725/dwil_nation

What typically happens is that people like the father and family members in the OP become more entrenched, self-justified and feel an increasing sense that they are the victims. Flying monkeys from outlying branches of family - even members that are rarely seen - are asked to swoop in to bring the offending member back into the right thinking ways of the family fold. All forms of social media are deployed, black holing by the childless/childfree person usually does not work. Blocking, changing phone numbers, sometimes legal restrictions have to be used. It would not be unusual for the father to show up at the person's workplace or their home and throw a tantrum.

The subject of Prudie's column is lucky to live "far away." Hopefully they never feel pressed or have the desire to move closer to those people. The best thing they can do is just cut them off and pretend they are dead.

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Dorisan

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Techie
I know how to fix this. A few years of no call/no show. They will be apologizing in no time.

Whew. Not from what I've learned reading dozens of cases on this site

http://community.babycenter.com/groups/a4725/dwil_nation

What typically happens is that people like the father and family members in the OP become more entrenched, self-justified and feel an increasing sense that they are the victims. Flying monkeys from outlying branches of family - even members that are rarely seen - are asked to swoop in to bring the offending member back into the right thinking ways of the family fold. All forms of social media are deployed, black holing by the childless/childfree person usually does not work. Blocking, changing phone numbers, sometimes legal restrictions have to be used. It would not be unusual for the father to show up at the person's workplace or their home and throw a tantrum.

The subject of Prudie's column is lucky to live "far away." Hopefully they never feel pressed or have the desire to move closer to those people. The best thing they can do is just cut them off and pretend they are dead.

The key is to not fall for their bullshit. They should not be given any attention if they throw tantrums. Only respond to kind comments, do not respond to negatives. It takes 2 people to have a fight. 1 person can do what they want, but they cannot carry on a fight if the other party will not give them a time of day. I have seen some odd ball family members back in the day and the less attention I have given them, the better things got.

Now, I am certain there are exceptions, but as for me, I live far away from most of the family, I have pretty peaceful surrounding.

Here is another thing that I have discovered. If a family member is giving me crap, all I have to do is ask around what is going on in their life. More often than not, said family member has an unhappy life of their own and they are simply looking for anything or anyone to dump their garbage on. If they can offend someone else, they feel that much better about their miserable situation.

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Dorisan

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Techie
I know how to fix this. A few years of no call/no show. They will be apologizing in no time.

Whew. Not from what I've learned reading dozens of cases on this site

http://community.babycenter.com/groups/a4725/dwil_nation

What typically happens is that people like the father and family members in the OP become more entrenched, self-justified and feel an increasing sense that they are the victims. Flying monkeys from outlying branches of family - even members that are rarely seen - are asked to swoop in to bring the offending member back into the right thinking ways of the family fold. All forms of social media are deployed, black holing by the childless/childfree person usually does not work. Blocking, changing phone numbers, sometimes legal restrictions have to be used. It would not be unusual for the father to show up at the person's workplace or their home and throw a tantrum.

The subject of Prudie's column is lucky to live "far away." Hopefully they never feel pressed or have the desire to move closer to those people. The best thing they can do is just cut them off and pretend they are dead.

My entire adult life was the embodiment of this subject (except for explicitly wishing me dead).

Live your fulfilling life separate from all of these people who happen to be biologically related to you.
Find your personal family-by-choice to enhance your life and leave these awful people behind.

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Cassia
Find your personal family-by-choice to enhance your life and leave these awful people behind.

Funny that you said that. I have a few non-blood relatives who are very close to me.

I bet if that person didn't come for the holidays those breeders wouldn't care......

Fast forward 5 years and some aging parent or some sickly niece/nephew will call up th CF person with their tale of sorrow...... and then ask for 10000 bucks....

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"If you can't feed your baby, then don't have a baby. And don't think maybe, if you can't feed your baby."
- The wisdom of the late Michael Jackson
"The mother of the year should be a sterilized woman with two adopted children." - Paul Ehrlich

Yeah, a few years without contact and they'll behave just the same. They'll act like nothing happened at all.

That's what happened with my toxic family. I cut them off and cut them out well over a decade ago. They occasionally (about every 5 years or so) will try to contact me, as if nothing had ever happened and expect me to come crawling back. Never an apology. I've blocked them on FB and all the other ways they can contact me.

Found out that BOTH my sisters shat out 3 bratlings and are now "oh so perfect" whereas I got fixed and eloped. Hrm. Wonder who's happier?

As for the husband, his toxic family has become something we generally avoid for the most part, especially since his sister sluiced (twice). After the 1st loaf, they all became unbearably abusive towards us. I tried to warn him, but it took him experiencing it first hand before he opted to stop visiting. Mostly his excuse is financial. "We can't afford the trip. Sorry."

I was just about to say that once Daddy Asshole or Breeder Sibling needs money or somebody to care for them, suddenly the CF person's life will be worthwhile (only worthwhile in servitude). "Hey, I previously declared my child's life worthless, but now that I need somebody to sacrifice endless amounts of time and money for my benefit for little to no return, it should be the one without kids because they have an infinite amount of disposable income and time. And they should be happy to do it because I'm their father, goddamn it, and they should always be groveling to get back into my good graces when I arbitrarily dismiss them as a human being."

CF child needs to stay away from the family and create his/her new family through friends and when Daddy Asshat comes calling to demand slavery, (s)he can tell him to go call Breeder Sibling for that since he clearly views her more worthy, but oh wait, she has kids so she won't have time for him. And if his/her life has no point in continuing without children, why waste it wiping his ass because (s)he won't be breeding any sooner or at all if (s)he is doing that (not that they would be breeding at all, but just to wedge the knife in deeper).

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"Why children take so long to grow? They eat and drink like pig and give nothing back. Must find way to accelerate process..."
- Dr. Yi Suchong, Bioshock

"Society does not need more children; but it does need more loved children. Quite literally, we cannot afford unloved children - but we pay heavily for them every day. There should not be the slightest communal concern when a woman elects to destroy the life of her thousandth-of-an-ounce embryo. But all society should rise up in alarm when it hears that a baby that is not wanted is about to be born."
- Garrett Hardin

"I feel like there's a message involved here somehow, but then I couldn't stop laughing at all the plotholes, like the part when North Korea has food."
- Youtube commentor referring to a North Korean cartoon.

"Reality is a bitch when it slowly crawls out of your vagina and shits in your lap."
- Reddit comment

"Bitch wants a baby, so we're gonna fuck now. #bareback"
- Cambion

Oh whatever. Abortion doctors are crimestoppers."
- Miss Hannigan

I just wanted to add that I am so happy that my parents were always supportive of my CF stance when they were alive. I distinctly remember when my niece was born, I was around 10-11 years old. I think my mother noticed that I had little interest in the baby. When I was 12 or thereabouts, when boys started to become interesting, she had the mom-daughter talk with me. I remember one of the things that she said so clearly, it could have happened yesterday.

"You know, CH, if you don't want to have children, you don't have to. Having kids is not mandatory. We live in a time when women can be anything, not just what tradition tells them to be, like it was when I was your age. Never let anyone tell you that you have to have a child."

Did I ever tell you guys that my mother was awesome?

They should tell that "family" to fuck off. I would no longer darken their door frame. I don't understand how parents can worship the concept of family and children and then shit all over it the MOMENT that something isn't the swallowable norm that parents NEED to have (Maybe breeders are all a little autisticeyes2).

As for the leaving part? Pssh! They'll miss them.. When they need something. I say they put that education to work and start flying the CF flag as high and as proud as they can. I would rub their faces in how good my life was at all times while they were around. Get good and smug about it, JUST to piss them off. Is it mature? No. Do I care? You make the call!

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So.. We know that food and water are running out, with overpopulation and all... Yet people keep on poppin' out those babies! I guess they want to have their baby and eat it too...

My top reason is that parenting gives you a free license to be selfish based purely on the fact that you're being selfish for an emanation of your own self. The illusion that what you do to benefit your children benefits them solely is a fallacy. Every parent benefits from the benefits that their children receive. Henceforth, it gives one a license to perpetuate a dog-eat-dog mentality that I perceive to be amoral. Parents say that their children are their greatest loves, what they forget to add is that they are their ONLY loves and only because their children are a reflection of themselves. I prefer to be able to love multiple people and have lasting relationships of many types and possess the essential core value of empathy for all than to restrict myself to an echo chamber of ego-masturbation and self-serving chicanery.

In short: Not parenting makes you a better person.

Due to the distance, I imagine the only time the author would fly in to see family is around the holidays, and since Duhddy has declared holidays to be the breeder kewl klub, why is the author worried about how to respond to visit requests? Would there even be any if they are no longer welcome in the homes of relatives?

I have a feeling the famblee will sit and giggle-shit themselves and bad-mouth the author during the hellidays, but when one of them needs money or a favor, they'll deny ever having said anything cruel and hateful to the author. Then, when they get what they want out of this person, it'll be back to bad-mouthing.

This person is indeed lucky to have distance on their side. With the whole family against them, I'd straight-up ignore the family and not go to any further get-togethers, requests or not. Even if someone dies, I wouldn't even fly in for the funeral.

Let's see:

After crying because that has to hurt beyond words, OP should start to realize what gift they have been given: their absolute freedom.

Because OP now knows what assholes their family is, (s)he can now start centering their thoughts on themselves. It takes money to fly out, buy gifts ect and I can almost guarantee that OP is the only one making any effort into seeing them. I seriously doubt assholes would ever deign to darken their door.

So instead of moping during the holidays, use this time to visit with other childfree friends, volunteer, or (and my favorite) plan on exotic vacations....and make damn sure you send a post card saying *sucks to be you bitches!*. Everyone knows in a few years the assholes will be crawling back to OP saying how much they miss him/her and how bad it is can they help yadda yadda. How delicious it will be to say *sorry gotta catch my flight to sunny and warm with hot sexy buns bye!*.

Oh how wonderful that day will be

So this is what happens to those CF people who try to play the "but I lurve my nephews and nieces!" card to mollify breeders. They just have to go to more extreme lengths to ostracize you.

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jmc
I bet if that person didn't come for the holidays those breeders wouldn't care......

Fast forward 5 years and some aging parent or some sickly niece/nephew will call up th CF person with their tale of sorrow...... and then ask for 10000 bucks....

Wouldn't miss the person, will still demand holiday tribute.

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“There are three things all wise men fear: the sea in storm, a night with no moon, and the anger of a gentle man.”

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cassia
Find your personal family-by-choice to enhance your life and leave these awful people behind.

"Family-by-choice." I like that term.

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bunny
Yeah, a few years without contact and they'll behave just the same. They'll act like nothing happened at all.

I'd bet my next paycheck that the toxic family will resort to the "we don't know why s/he cut us off, we didn't do anything to deserve it!" bullshit.

In any case, this is a great opportunity for the LW. Now s/he knows how the family truly feels, and that they're not worth shit. Time to cut them off and continue to make a happy life without their toxicity.

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alana
I'd bet my next paycheck that the toxic family will resort to the "we don't know why s/he cut us off, we didn't do anything to deserve it!" bullshit.

Yep. That's exactly how my family behaves to others. They also claim that I am "mentally unbalanced" and probably a "danger to" myself and others. They even tried to convince a few of my friends to help them get me put away. Luckily, none of my friends were buying it.

I do agree with the idea that once they need someone to care for them, they'll expect the CF child to do it. I know the sibling does. When I was speaking to my sisters, they BOTH said they wouldn't care for our parents, period, and if they were forced to, they would cram them into the cheapest home available and never visit. Their words to me: "So you better take care of them!" Ha! Like that would happen. If they managed to contact me I'd say "How much longer do they have? Call me when it's less than a week. I'll show up just to watch them die. I'd like my words to be the last they hear." I'd sell their corpses to science and piss on their ashes before flushing them down the toilet.

But that's just me.

As for my husband, I know his sister will pick up for his moo just like her moo did on down the line. His duh will most likely be his job. (His parunts are separated.) I see a cheap home in his future unless he can learn to treat my husband with a little more respect.

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I do agree with the idea that once they need someone to care for them, they'll expect the CF child to do it. I know the sibling does. When I was speaking to my sisters, they BOTH said they wouldn't care for our parents, period, and if they were forced to, they would cram them into the cheapest home available and never visit. Their words to me: "So you better take care of them!" Ha! Like that would happen.

And on that note : The letter writer and other CF people, but ESPECIALLY those who are estranged from their bio family, need to google "filial responsibility laws" to make sure their state isn't one of the around 40 or so who can force an adult child to pay an 'indigent' parent's bills , including but not limited to the monthly bill for a nursing home. Cheap or not, that can get into big bucks. I believe at least some of those states make provisions for adult children who've cut themselves off from parents due to an abusive childhood, but there probably needs to be a (lawyer-drawn-up?) paper trail PROVING long standing estrangement in order to make sure the AC's own retirement funds can't be drained to support the narcissistic, abusive parent(s), such as the one in the letter writer's letter.

Imagine an abusive narcissist, like the letter writer's father, who decides not to save for retirement at all, instead blowing all his money on Fun Stuff, because he fully intends to force his victim(s) to pay his way from age 65-70 on...Makes the blood run cold to contemplate.

No idea about Canada, the UK, or other parts of the anglosphere, but I do know that at least some EUropean countries have laws like 'filial responsibility' on their books, so...

As much as my parents disagree with my life choices, I have plenty of aunts, uncles and cousins who love me for who I am, not how many parasites I hatched. I have more communications with them than my folks. My mom's sister had 4 children and will never get granbrats. She respects their wishes, thus is unlikely to get pushed aside. Many of them gave me affection once my golden penis brother was born. It irritates my folks when I visit the area, and do not spend every waking moment with them, instead choosing to check on my "loving" family members. They blame me, instead of looking back to see why I feel this way. I now live 12 hours and 550 miles away.wink