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Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong
Posted by Dorisan
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Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong October 06, 2015 | Registered: 15 years ago Posts: 6,607 |
I tend to have a prejudice toward CF people, putting white hats on them and not having much sympathy for breeders, but what this woman is doing is beyond vile. At some point, even if the abortion is never detected, it will be revealed that there is no tangible reason for them to not be fertile. What is she going to do then, after what is likely going to be quite a bit of invasive testing and money spent?
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Q. Hubby Doesn’t Know: I’ve been married to a great guy for almost three years now. The only problem is that he really wants kids, and I have no desire to put my body through that. A few months ago he wanted to start trying for kids. I agreed, thinking that I could do it for him, but when I realized I was pregnant, I panicked and got an abortion. My husband is starting to worry that we haven’t had any luck and wants to start doing fertility tests. I’m worried that seeing doctors will cause my secret to come out and my husband will leave me. What do I do?
A: The two people in your marriage need to seriously consider what you’re doing there if you are so utterly at odds about adding another person to your family. You now realize you have no intention of fulfilling your husband’s desire for a child. But instead of telling him, you secretly aborted a fetus you had agreed to conceive. That speaks to a level of deceit that sounds lethal to a marriage. It would be one thing if your letter was about how you tell your husband you have no intention of having children. But you want some way to pretend to engage in fertility treatment without his finding out you two are perfectly capable of having a child. I don’t know if you discussed the having children issue before you got married, but an urgent life goal for him is to become a father. Your urgent life goal is to not become a mother. You need to face this forthrightly, and if it ends your marriage, that will give you each the opportunity to find more compatible partners.
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Re: Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong October 06, 2015 | Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 256 |
Why would you EVER marry someone who wants kids when you're absolutely positive you don't? When I find out a a guy wants kids it's an enormous turn-off. Doesn't matter if he'd be the best father in the world because I vehemently don't want to be a mother. His wanting kids means he wants a drastic life change leading to a lifestyle which, for numerous reasons, would be detrimental to me.
My guess is that she probably clung to this guy from the beginning, even though she knew he wanted something she didn't, because she was likely terrified that she'd find no one else to marry her. Now she's going to pay with divorce.
My guess is that she probably clung to this guy from the beginning, even though she knew he wanted something she didn't, because she was likely terrified that she'd find no one else to marry her. Now she's going to pay with divorce.
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Re: Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong October 06, 2015 | Registered: 11 years ago Posts: 469 |
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Re: Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong October 06, 2015 | Registered: 10 years ago Posts: 480 |
She was smart to abort. We've all read stories of women who bitterly regretted NOT getting an abortion.
Honey, you better divorce and find someone who doesn't want kids.
______________________________________________________
Someday we'll look back on this moment and plow into a parked car.
Evan Davis
Honey, you better divorce and find someone who doesn't want kids.
______________________________________________________
Someday we'll look back on this moment and plow into a parked car.
Evan Davis
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Re: Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong October 06, 2015 | Registered: 15 years ago Posts: 6,607 |
After some thought, I'm putting her in the "ambivalent childless" slot.
She gave in once and backed out. I bet when it comes down to the wire of having a kid or losing the guy, she'll buckle.
Also
I googled several medical sites. It is generally hard to tell that an abortion has taken place, once healed, but the question will surely come up as part of the infertility investigation. So what is she going to do - lie to the doctors? And if there does happen to be an indication (scars or stretched cervix) is she going to deny it to the doctor?
This bint is just going to end up with a growing tangle of deception unless she settles the question in her mind on which direction she wants to go.
She gave in once and backed out. I bet when it comes down to the wire of having a kid or losing the guy, she'll buckle.
Also
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I’m worried that seeing doctors will cause my secret to come out
I googled several medical sites. It is generally hard to tell that an abortion has taken place, once healed, but the question will surely come up as part of the infertility investigation. So what is she going to do - lie to the doctors? And if there does happen to be an indication (scars or stretched cervix) is she going to deny it to the doctor?
This bint is just going to end up with a growing tangle of deception unless she settles the question in her mind on which direction she wants to go.
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Re: Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong October 06, 2015 | Registered: 19 years ago Posts: 9,198 |
Wouldn't it be hard to hide an abortion? Aren't you supposed to abstain from sex for a few weeks so you can heal?
Pretty hard to do when some man is intent on impregnating you.
It would make me nauseated to be with a guy who wants to knock me up who is discussing fertility treatments.
But nevertheless, she needs to own up to it. Divorce is hard, but I don't understand someone who could hide that big a part of herself. How could you get into that position?
I can understand marrying young and not really having a solidified position and having your feelings get stronger, but I don't understand screwing the guy without BC and thinking you can get an abortion. Why would put your body throught that? And why be so dishonest.
Typically people who are very non-assertive like this are paired up with abusers. I'm wondering if he's abusive and the type to pressure her and throw her BC away. Or if she's afraid to tell him because she feels controlled and doesn't have anywhere else to go.
Something's not right.
Pretty hard to do when some man is intent on impregnating you.
It would make me nauseated to be with a guy who wants to knock me up who is discussing fertility treatments.
But nevertheless, she needs to own up to it. Divorce is hard, but I don't understand someone who could hide that big a part of herself. How could you get into that position?
I can understand marrying young and not really having a solidified position and having your feelings get stronger, but I don't understand screwing the guy without BC and thinking you can get an abortion. Why would put your body throught that? And why be so dishonest.
Typically people who are very non-assertive like this are paired up with abusers. I'm wondering if he's abusive and the type to pressure her and throw her BC away. Or if she's afraid to tell him because she feels controlled and doesn't have anywhere else to go.
Something's not right.
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Re: Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong October 06, 2015 | Registered: 18 years ago Posts: 4,090 |
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Re: Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong October 06, 2015 | Registered: 8 years ago Posts: 499 |
I'm wondering if maybe she wasn't childfree from the start of the relationship, but the guy pressured her into trying for a kid or messed with her birth control?
I think it was wrong to go along with trying for kids, but I don't see anything wrong with her abortion. It's her body, it's her choice.
Lock him up or put him down.
Stolen from Shiny.
I think it was wrong to go along with trying for kids, but I don't see anything wrong with her abortion. It's her body, it's her choice.
Lock him up or put him down.
Stolen from Shiny.
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Re: Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong October 07, 2015 | Registered: 13 years ago Posts: 12,434 |
A lot of infertility (the majority, I believe) is unexplained. So she does not, in fact, need to worry that infertility testing will show no reason for the problem.
Of course she's still a wuss and I wouldn't call her CF because she seems like a fencesitter to me. She doesn't seem to know what she wants, letting someone get her pregnant and then getting an abortion. I cannot imagine a CF person doing that.
Of course she's still a wuss and I wouldn't call her CF because she seems like a fencesitter to me. She doesn't seem to know what she wants, letting someone get her pregnant and then getting an abortion. I cannot imagine a CF person doing that.
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Re: Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong October 07, 2015 | Registered: 16 years ago Posts: 3,454 |
Being CF myself, I am siding with the woman. Unless she was 100% certain that she wanted to be a moo, she has my 100% support to flush it before sitting down and thinking about it. One cannot have an unbiased discussion whether they want a kid or not if they have one inside of them. Kudos to her.
I don't know where this woman is from but if she is from a Small Town USA, she probably has been conditioned into submission by her parents. Marriage roles were never explained to her and word NO does not exist for the husband.
My advice. She needs to show her inseminator where the door is - today. As far as I am concerned, he has ZERO right to her body and even less right to her pregnancy. That fucker needs to go and find a breeder just like him. This woman has done no damages to anyone and as far as I see it, she is not in any wrong.
I don't know where this woman is from but if she is from a Small Town USA, she probably has been conditioned into submission by her parents. Marriage roles were never explained to her and word NO does not exist for the husband.
My advice. She needs to show her inseminator where the door is - today. As far as I am concerned, he has ZERO right to her body and even less right to her pregnancy. That fucker needs to go and find a breeder just like him. This woman has done no damages to anyone and as far as I see it, she is not in any wrong.
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Re: Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong October 07, 2015 | Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 951 |
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Re: Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong October 07, 2015 | Registered: 15 years ago Posts: 6,607 |
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Techie
Being CF myself, I am siding with the woman. Unless she was 100% certain that she wanted to be a moo, she has my 100% support to flush it before sitting down and thinking about it. One cannot have an unbiased discussion whether they want a kid or not if they have one inside of them. Kudos to her.
She is married to a guy who wants kids. As repulsive a feature as I find that to be in a partner, she knew going in that it was his goal to be a father. The letter doesn't state how communicative they were about the subject, but it sounds like she knew he was always sure.
I've read on a couple other boards; just lately the Invisapeep folks; where the person (man or woman) basically left the decision up to their partner. "I really don't know if I want them, but if my wife/husband does, I'm willing to go for it." It seems like this was the attitude of the letter writer ("I agreed, thinking that I could do it for him") but she found out, upon becoming pregnant, that this was something she didn't want to do. Now, she is asking how she can get away with continuing the marriage by deception. You don't do that to a person. I'm sitting here with my mouth pulled down in disgust.
As Yurble noted, fertility problems are often not explainable in the woman; at that point IVF or Clomid is usually advised. So what is she going to do then?
The letter writer is absolutely within her rights to say "bummer, Dude, I find that I just can't do this." At that point, she should leave him. But, in the letter to Prudie, there was no mention of that, just a worry that it's going to be discovered that she had an abortion and doesn't want to bear children. She cannot keep that up. I find it repulsive that she thinks it's an option.
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Re: Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong October 07, 2015 | Registered: 12 years ago Posts: 5,629 |
I am usually one to side with the childfree, but this woman hasn't even tried to have a conversation about her feelings. The LW may have genuinely thought she'd be okay with having kids when she met this guy. She is on the fence, and instead of having a difficult conversation with her husband, she's choosing to hide what must be a very difficult situation for her. Why the hell would she marry someone she can't/won't talk to about difficult things? Hell, that's what my spouse is for: to talk with when shit gets difficult...even if the aforementioned shit involves him.
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Re: Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong October 07, 2015 | Registered: 16 years ago Posts: 3,454 |
@Dorisan: here is how I see it. Regardless of what took place in the past, nobody owes anyone a child or two or three. Having seen first hand how a "CF" person can flip and want kids and seeing how much support they get, I have ZERO problems with a wanna breed flipping to CF side and say they do not want kids. Such "wanna breed" has my full support because allow me to say, they REALLY are going to need it. Because I have seen all kind of tolerance for people changing their mind and going from a hard core CF to a hard core wanna breeder, I feel it is only fair to have tolerance when things go the other way.
In my opinion this woman owes her man zero. It is her body and she is allowed to decide what to do with it and when to do it. She may have been a wanna breed all along but having the reality in her face, that made her think. My hat is off to her and I give her a high five for having the guts to do what she did, most women would instead not have the strength or courage to do what she did.
As far as her marriage, when shit hits the fan, one step at a time is sometimes all that can be done. Rid the immenent problem first then move on to the next one. She was knocked up - she had to ditch it because she simply realized it was not for her. I support her decision 100%.
In my opinion this woman owes her man zero. It is her body and she is allowed to decide what to do with it and when to do it. She may have been a wanna breed all along but having the reality in her face, that made her think. My hat is off to her and I give her a high five for having the guts to do what she did, most women would instead not have the strength or courage to do what she did.
As far as her marriage, when shit hits the fan, one step at a time is sometimes all that can be done. Rid the immenent problem first then move on to the next one. She was knocked up - she had to ditch it because she simply realized it was not for her. I support her decision 100%.
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Re: Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong October 07, 2015 | Registered: 16 years ago Posts: 3,454 |
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randomcfchick
I am usually one to side with the childfree, but this woman hasn't even tried to have a conversation about her feelings. The LW may have genuinely thought she'd be okay with having kids when she met this guy. She is on the fence, and instead of having a difficult conversation with her husband, she's choosing to hide what must be a very difficult situation for her. Why the hell would she marry someone she can't/won't talk to about difficult things? Hell, that's what my spouse is for: to talk with when shit gets difficult...even if the aforementioned shit involves him.
What was she supposed to do? Have the kid because that was the "right" thing to do? I am sure that is not what anyone is trying to say here, but that is what a person in a bind can interpret it as.
Marriages often cannot be dissolved on a whim. Maybe she needs to get her money together, maybe she feels that if she tells her bigot husband how it is, she may find herself homeless. I don't have all the answers but when someone does not want to breed, they get attacked by everyone. Sometimes, I hate to say it, they even don't get enough support from CF people. Weird, eh?
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Re: Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong October 07, 2015 | Registered: 13 years ago Posts: 12,434 |
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Re: Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong October 07, 2015 | Registered: 16 years ago Posts: 3,454 |
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yurble
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Techie
In my opinion this woman owes her man zero.
I think she owes him honesty. That's something that every person owes their spouse or partner, at a minimum.
Yes and I am sure honesty will come out. I have seen way too many relationships where the woman was not in a position to get out right away. For all I know, she may just be buying her time.
Yes, this relationship is done and the truth will be out - all is just a matter of time. But as far as honesty and relationships go in general, I have been lied to way too many times. If someone else gets deceived - common practice in today's marriage. That's just the world that we live in.
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Re: Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong October 07, 2015 | Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 951 |
We all project our experience of life into it.
I just feel sympathy for that woman.
I am married, I really do like my DH but I don't want to have chyldren.
Nobody understands it. I get to hear that I cannot love him when
I don't want to give him a chyld.
My in-laws are constantly showing me their disappointment
because "there is no baybeh".
My MIL told neighbours that I didn't want to have chyldren.
Since then, some people are openly hostile towards me.
Others look at me as if I were some kind of a freak.
My DH is sometimes in a very bad mood due to work-related things.
He works long hours, commutes. Sometimes things don't go smoothly etc...
My MIL then tells me: "He is sad because he has no chyld.
If he had chyld, EVERYTHING WOULD BE BETTER."
This woman will have to defend her CF the same way I do.
I feel for her because I exactly know what's in store for her.
I just feel sympathy for that woman.
I am married, I really do like my DH but I don't want to have chyldren.
Nobody understands it. I get to hear that I cannot love him when
I don't want to give him a chyld.
My in-laws are constantly showing me their disappointment
because "there is no baybeh".
My MIL told neighbours that I didn't want to have chyldren.
Since then, some people are openly hostile towards me.
Others look at me as if I were some kind of a freak.
My DH is sometimes in a very bad mood due to work-related things.
He works long hours, commutes. Sometimes things don't go smoothly etc...
My MIL then tells me: "He is sad because he has no chyld.
If he had chyld, EVERYTHING WOULD BE BETTER."
This woman will have to defend her CF the same way I do.
I feel for her because I exactly know what's in store for her.
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Re: Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong October 07, 2015 | Registered: 16 years ago Posts: 585 |
I'm with Techie. You can guarandamntee that if she were to have this honest conversation with her husband it would be the start of immense pressure from everyone she knows to have a baby.
Ideally, she has a job and can afford to support herself. But we don't know her circumstances. For all we know, she belongs to a religion that preaches wifely submission and/or lives in a small town where everyone would be in her business and she'd get no support. She may not be educated or even employed. I can't judge her for wanting to keep her husband and not want to have kids.
Ideally, she has a job and can afford to support herself. But we don't know her circumstances. For all we know, she belongs to a religion that preaches wifely submission and/or lives in a small town where everyone would be in her business and she'd get no support. She may not be educated or even employed. I can't judge her for wanting to keep her husband and not want to have kids.
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Re: Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong October 07, 2015 | Registered: 13 years ago Posts: 1,304 |
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mrs. chinaski
We all project our experience of life into it.
I just feel sympathy for that woman.
I am married, I really do like my DH but I don't want to have chyldren.
Nobody understands it. I get to hear that I cannot love him when
I don't want to give him a chyld.
My in-laws are constantly showing me their disappointment
because "there is no baybeh".
My MIL told neighbours that I didn't want to have chyldren.
Since then, some people are openly hostile towards me.
Others look at me as if I were some kind of a freak.
My DH is sometimes in a very bad mood due to work-related things.
He works long hours, commutes. Sometimes things don't go smoothly etc...
My MIL then tells me: "He is sad because he has no chyld.
If he had chyld, EVERYTHING WOULD BE BETTER."
This woman will have to defend her CF the same way I do.
I feel for her because I exactly know what's in store for her.
Well I'm happy to hear you really like your DH. I hope he likes you back. Maybe he should jnform HIS desires about not having kids.
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Re: Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong October 07, 2015 | Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 951 |
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Re: Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong October 07, 2015 | Registered: 11 years ago Posts: 672 |
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Techie
In my opinion this woman owes her man zero. It is her body and she is allowed to decide what to do with it and when to do it. She may have been a wanna breed all along but having the reality in her face, that made her think. My hat is off to her and I give her a high five for having the guts to do what she did, most women would instead not have the strength or courage to do what she did.
As far as her marriage, when shit hits the fan, one step at a time is sometimes all that can be done. Rid the immenent problem first then move on to the next one. She was knocked up - she had to ditch it because she simply realized it was not for her. I support her decision 100%.
I agree. A woman's body isn't less her own just because she gets married. And Prudie's self righteous "You now realize you have no intention of fulfilling your husband’s desire for a child. But instead of telling him, you secretly aborted a fetus you had agreed to conceive. " just pissed me off. This woman's "desire for a child" doesn't trump her autonomy over her own body.
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Re: Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong October 07, 2015 | Registered: 8 years ago Posts: 499 |
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stillwaters
"You now realize you have no intention of fulfilling your husband’s desire for a child. But instead of telling him, you secretly aborted a fetus you had agreed to conceive. " just pissed me off. This woman's "desire for a child" doesn't trump her autonomy over her own body.
I agree, she is being a bitch. Consent is not unlimited to all times following thereafter. She consented to try for a brat at first and changed her mind, she is not obligated to carry it because she once agreed to it. Just like if I let someone use my car on Tuesday, that doesn't mean they can take it on Thursday, and I wouldn't be obligated to let them.
Lock him up or put him down.
Stolen from Shiny.
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Re: Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong October 07, 2015 | Registered: 13 years ago Posts: 7,830 |
Yeah, after thinking about this one for a few minutes, I'm going to have to side with Techie. We don't know much about their situation, it's possible that the guy told her he was CF and then flipped sides on her after the wedding? If she hadn't have had that abortion, there would have been three lives destroyed.
My only problem with her is her continued desire to deceive her husband. That is wrong. She needs to end it as soon as possible, so he can go on to find a wannabreed wife and she can live her life as she chooses.
Could the letter be a fake? I almost have a feeling that it is.
(I hate that we don't have the avatars and emoticons yet. This emoticon looks lame, but it's the closest one I could find to express my feelings on this subject.)
My only problem with her is her continued desire to deceive her husband. That is wrong. She needs to end it as soon as possible, so he can go on to find a wannabreed wife and she can live her life as she chooses.
Could the letter be a fake? I almost have a feeling that it is.
(I hate that we don't have the avatars and emoticons yet. This emoticon looks lame, but it's the closest one I could find to express my feelings on this subject.)
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Re: Dear Prudie - Childfree and totally in the wrong October 07, 2015 | Registered: 15 years ago Posts: 6,607 |
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JoJo
I'm with Techie. You can guarandamntee that if she were to have this honest conversation with her husband it would be the start of immense pressure from everyone she knows to have a baby.
Ideally, she has a job and can afford to support herself. But we don't know her circumstances. For all we know, she belongs to a religion that preaches wifely submission and/or lives in a small town where everyone would be in her business and she'd get no support. She may not be educated or even employed. I can't judge her for wanting to keep her husband and not want to have kids.
Except that it is likely not going to be much of a marriage when she tells him or he discovers "I've decided that I can't do the kid thang." And she's not even doing that, she's trying to keep up a lie that makes him think kids will come along one way or another.
Hanging around the Dealing With In-laws Board, I find myself sometimes staring at the shits that people turn into once they find out that marriage/committed relationship is a whole new dynamic. The spouse doesn't want their in-laws to be so enmeshed, or the kid comes along and all-of-sudden it's a whole new lifestyle. Where did the love and woo go that brought them together? The couple ends up being enemies under the same roof and things can get pretty damned vindictive. Sure makes me appreciate the stability and compatibility of the person I've been with for three decades.
With the couple in Prudie's letter, I'm betting that three years in and they've done a lot of things that have bound them together in a way that it will be a mess to dissolve. The woman may have quit her job with the intent of being a SAHM, or they may live in a community or have family ties that will turn this into a shit show of "he said/she said" and everyone taking sides. The one thing that stands out for me is that this situation can't go on forever, no matter how much the letter writer might want to preserve the relationship or thinks she needs to in order to survive.
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