Spinoff of personality thread-Childfree and feminine

I did not want to hijack the personality type thread, but it brings up a CF issue I think about a lot.

Many of you are INTJ females; a personality type that is rare for women and considered to be more masculine than feminine. I have noticed on this board and others than a lot of CF people are women who have little or no interest in anything traditionally feminine. Sometimes I feel out of place because I am and always have been a much more girly type. I love dresses, jewelry, makeup and girly colors like pink. When I was little I played House and Princess with the other girls and liked it. I ended up not getting married, but I always wanted to and thought I would when I was growing up.

My mom was a housewife who wanted to be a career woman, so she pushed me to be a career woman and live out her unfulfilled dreams. She was endlessly frustrated that I did not have the aggressive and ambitious personality required for this. I don't think I was ever as passive or submissive as she believed. But it is true I'm not to type who climbs sky-high on the corporate ladder or even wants to.

So why am I childfree if I am not a typical CF woman? A lot of it has to do with being a highly sensitive person (HSP). I never heard of that term until I was in my late 20s, but I always knew I was one. When I was a teenager and thinking about what I wanted to do with my life I instinctively knew I would not do well with a frantically busy life. Women with both career and kids always have that kind of life, even if they have a partner who helps out. HSPs can go either way with children. Some are nurturing caretakers who know exactly what the kids need. Others are overwhelmed by kids and can't deal with them. I know I am the latter and I strongly suspect Mom is too. That was another thing that made her very hard to live with. Another reason I am CF is because I was bullied a lot in elementary school and middle school. I learned early that children are NOT sweet and innocent.

There are two things I'm curious about.
1. are there any other CF women here who are otherwise the feminine type?
2. Are there any other HSPs? There are just as many male as female HSPs.

There are some ways I'd describe myself as feminine, others not so much. Didn't care about anything remotely girly until I started school.
I think a big part of the caring had to do with being around other girls and trying to find a happy medium to fit in or more accurately, shoehorn myself in with peers. Became a dancer and dreamt of wearing a tutu. Had no interest in jewelry, etc. until I hit puberty. Had a friend who pretty much forced me to take an interest in clothing and my appearance right as I hit puberty. Appearance-wise I looked like I fit in with other teenage girls but that is where the similarity ended. I did always want to marry and to have a career. I'm driven to do very well in work but I wouldn't describe myself as aggressive and while I'm ambitious to a point, definitely not one of those hyper-political types who will do anything to get ahead or a title chaser. When in management I was very hands-off unless there were questions or clarification requested.

Wasn't familiar with HSP. I'm definitely that and have been considerably desensitized since being a child. Found out fairly recently I'm synesthetic and had no idea there is a term for this but became aware as a kid that other kids had no idea what I was talking about. I think I may have developed this as a way to make associations before I was able to read because I've always done this. Also associate colors with tastes and have found this is very helpful in balancing spices in cooking. Example of this was cooking a bean soup (bean = brown for these beans) and realized it needed a green/gray element to mix with the Applewood bacon (gray and pink) I was adding. Added a salsa verde (green/gray) as a thickener to achieve this.
Regular table salt that is iodized tastes chartreuse, which is sour, spikey and imbalanced to me.
I make similar associations with people, locations, buildings, etc. using multiple senses. It was very helpful when I was a little kid to have so many associations to draw from but it is still very useful and even though it can cause sensory overload perception is never dull for me.

@Freya

That sounds intriguing. I have heard of that. If you don't mind me asking, do you associate colors to sound as well? I read a post on tunblr where someone lamented that people always ask them "what color is my voice?" I wasn't sure if that particular trait - associating colors to sound - was universal or particular. Do you associate colors to sounds, or only tastes?

Sorry for being nosy. You can tell me to mind my own damn business if you'd like, I wont get offended haha.

Lock him up or put him down.
Stolen from Shiny.

I am very feminine in the sense that I love to be girlie. I wear a lot of dresses, makeup and enjoy reading chick lit and watching girl movies. However, my maternal instinct towards kids is nonexistent. While I love to nurture my pets and husband, I never had a desire to care for loaves. The only time I was pushed into it was when my mother wanted me to babysit, and I would do my very best to ensure the kids received the best care possible...other than that, I never wanted any of my own.

I'm afraid that if I sluiced, my figure would be destroyed, and part of my femininity would be gone, too. I wouldn't have time to enjoy my morning routine, I wouldn't be able to afford nice clothes and I wouldn't have the energy to look after myself. For me, it is Zen time.

I am an INTJ Advocate personality type, which is no surprise to me.

I am sick with the flu right now, but still wearing makeup, a nice dress and have my hair done. It just makes me feel better.

I am also very feminine. I am headstrong..as in... I know what I want and don't want and nobody's going to push me around... but I am a girly girl. I love dresssing up and frilly and blingy things. I am a homemaker.. and keep a nicely decorated home. I am very nurturing as far as my poodles go (and poodles are a rather feminine type of dog)

Yep.. I am all woman.... and I am CF. Just one part of my being a woman that I didn't want or feel a need to do. My life is fulfilled with my husband, my friends and my pets.

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Ondinette
I instinctively knew I would not do well with a frantically busy life. Women with both career and kids always have that kind of life, even if they have a partner who helps out. HSPs can go either way with children. Some are nurturing caretakers who know exactly what the kids need. Others are overwhelmed by kids and can't deal with them.

This stuck out to me, Ondinette, because I can relate. I simply can not do well with a frantically busy life either! When I get stressed I start to panic, which kicks my anxiety up, and I will have a full on panic attack. I also want to 'shut down' and not do anything. I don't see how people can exhaust themselves from the time they get up until they go to bed day in and day out. I also can't imagine having to look after kids and their needs, no matter what age they are.

As for feminity, I am not really overly feminine. Growing up I was always a tomboy. I loved dressing in comfy clothes and playing in the dirt, climbing trees, riding bikes etc. I am still a tomboy but I will put on a dress if I have to. Dresses still make me feel too exposed, self-conscious and uncomfortable.


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They are having children for selfish and narcissistic reasons, or are simply irresponsible. Funny... Those are the terms often used to describe the CF

~Live, Laugh, Love~

As the song goes, "I enjoy being a girl."

clicky


I always have my hair and make-up done every day for work. For my job I mostly wear pants and cashmere sweaters, but with the spouse, I get all dressed up in lacy or silk dresses, jewelry, make-up, high heels and perfume for date night.

I look very feminine, but don't think I'm submissive. I'm a raging feminist, and quite headstrong. I despise the alpha male, the machismo bravado loudmouth, and the Og Dickwerks types. Men who are sweet, gentle and loving are sexy.

I am feminine, but not overly frilly in my taste. I favor simple and understated things. For my 10th anniversary I asked for a ring like this and I think it's the most beautiful thing I've ever seen. I picked it over an engagement ring.

I have been called prissy by friends and I suppose I am. I also go to work with makeup and styled hair. (I don't pile on the makeup--Jane Iredale works for me.) My workplace is business casual and I generally wear nice slacks and blazers or sweaters, nice jewelry, etc. In the summer I wear sundresses, skirts and strappy sandals. My toes are always done and i get pedicures, but I keep my fingernails uncolored, shaped and buffed. My hair is colored and streaked and I drop some coin on that, but I'm too practical to live at Sephora. I find what works and stick with it.

On the weekends I style my hair in the morning and wear foundation and maybe a little mascara and lipstick, but I don't go crazy and I do it once, then forget it. I like being clean and presentable, even if I'm just hanging around the house.

Just this weekend I was pondering if I do it for my husband or me, but I was like this when I was single so I guess it's for me. Like Mum, I just feel better, but it's not escaped my attention that it's also courteous to one's spouse. (Probably because my husband will sometimes hang around in baggy sweats or shorts ALL DAY with a greasy hair and I catch myself thinking, fer the love of Gawd, could you get yourself off the couch and do something with yourself? We've had a snow storm and brutal cold and although he showers about 6 o'clock, it's getting old) You won't catch me like that unless I'm sick.

Anyway, I can relate to a lot here:

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However, my maternal instinct towards kids is nonexistent.

CHECK

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I know what I want and don't want and nobody's going to push me around

CHECK.

I'm particularly proud of myself that I'm with my husband, who was a 40 year old NMNK, set-in-his-ways kind of guy, yet after 15 years we have crafted a relationship that works for BOTH of us. It would have been easy to cave because I was crazy about him, but I've remained my own person.

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I am very nurturing as far as my poodles go (and poodles are a rather feminine type of dog)

CHECK. I love my pets to distraction.

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I look very feminine, but don't think I'm submissive.

I look sweet and I am introverted. When I was younger I was told I looked like the perfect "sweet" little WASPY Christian girl, but I'm anything but. I think I confused the fuck out of most men and that's fine because I couldn't end up with any old man and like Peace, I find Alpha Males (who are always Breeders) very off-putting.

I'd hesitate to call myself girly. I wear makeup, but usually only do my eyes/eyebrows and paint my nails once in a great while. I don't bother with foundation and blush and all that, mostly because I don't have the patience. I hate dresses (they do not flatter me at all), I hate heels, I hate most women's clothing, actually. I typically wear men's tops and ladies' jeans, and my shoe of choice is big clunky work boots. I don't give a shit about manicures and pedicures. I don't care for dressing up, and I'm bad at it too because of my aforementioned aversion to women's attire. I don't usually do much with my hair, partly because my hair is straight as a board and I can't do a goddamn thing with it anyway; the most I might do is bleach it or dye it, though I went back to my natural color and let my hair grow out about a year and a half ago. At best, I'll put it in a ponytail or mini-buns. It's hard to be a lardass and find flattering (and affordable) girly clothing, so I just don't bother. I can look put together, but not feminine. And I sure as fuck don't talk like a lady either.

When I was a kid, I did have some Barbie dolls that I played with, but I was definitely a bigger fan of stuffed animals. And I HATED baby dolls. Any baby doll anyone got me usually got mangled or manhandled. Meanwhile, my stuffed animals were all pristine and I still have a few from when I was a kid that are in pretty good shape after over two decades.

I think just about all humans have... not a "maternal" instinct, but a nurturing instinct. Many people want to care for something and raise something, but that something isn't always necessarily kids, or even things that are alive. Many CFers are very nurturing to their pets. Other people may see the flowers in their gardens as their "babies." Some people may find their "nurturing" instinct lies in building things or restoring cars. I hate kids of all ages, but I've always been very nurturing with pets, particularly with cats. You know how some women will coo over babies and act like total retards when they're in the presence of infants? I'm like that with cats.

I was a tomboy as a kid, and am still not overly feminine, but I'm not butch either. I have often described myself as a gay man trapped in a woman's body, because I have very gay male sensibilities. I have traditionally feminine hobbies (e.g. knitting, quilting), have cats and would rather watch grass grow than watch sports. But, I also hate shopping, romantic comedies and chic-lit. My toenails are always painted, but my fingernails are short and unpainted. I listen to Joni Mitchell and Tool. On a masculinity/feminity test I score "androgynous."

Thanks for the replies.

Freya, I did not know what synesthetic was. I looked it up and I think I might be that way a little. I associate most letters and numbers with certain colors, and every day of the week has it's own "feeling" to me.

I did not mean to say I was submissive, just that my mom thought I was. I have always been stubborn and opinionated. But the idea of a corporate job never had much appeal to me and I'm not comfortable with competition.

It's good to know I'm not the only one who likes girly things. I usually don't wear makeup at home but I always put it on to go out, even if I'm just going to the grocery store or park. Same with jewelry. There is never a reason for me to wear a dress, but sometimes I do anyway. If not I will wear a pretty top with jeans or shorts. My hair is shoulder length and naturally wavy, so all I do is try to make it as smooth looking as possible. And sometimes wear a pretty hair clip on the side. The only reason I don't paint my fingernails is because they are always breaking and peeling. There is nothing wrong with my toenails and I keep them painted in the summer. I try to wear cute and flattering clothes in the house too. For some strange reason I find this hard to do with winter clothes, but I only need them a few months where I am.

Cambion, I am like you with cats. I don't like kids at all but I go nuts over cats.

I probably did not explain too well what an HSP is, so here is a link: http://hsperson.com/

I don't think I'm traditionally feminine myself (the physical traits I was born with definitely are, but I can't say the same about my demeanor and interests), but I've always taken issue with people thinking that feminine = weak, submissive, maternal etc. Having certain traditionally masculine or feminine traits says very little about your personality and even less about the path you'll take in life.


While I find MBTI (and other personality tests) very fun, I don't take them too seriously. Personalities are far too complex to be determined by a set of often quite vague questions. You might as well tell me you're a Slytherin.

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Peace
I'm a raging feminist, and quite headstrong. I despise the alpha male, the machismo bravado loudmouth, and the Og Dickwerks types. Men who are sweet, gentle and loving are sexy.

I agree. Genuinely sweet, gentle and loving ones, mind you, not the ones who start raging about the friendzone and how women only fall for douchebags once they get rejected.

I don't have low self-esteem. That's a mistake. I have low esteem for everyone else.
-Daria

The guys who swear, "But I'm a NICE guy!" Are usually anything but. Made that mistake only once...
I've caught myself an alpha male who is actually sweet, gentle, and loving when we are home alone, it's an interesting dichotomy.


To be honest, it's odd to hear this place described as somehow unfeminine because of all the INTJs. This place is predominantly female, from what I've gathered over the years, and it sure feels like it to me. I've only belonged to one other female dominant forum, and it was only more girly because it was focused on beauty tips.

I'm not sure how many other people here view the forum atmosphere, it's funny how we all take different things from an identical situation.

The closet is open for girly fashion talk, and I appreciate it being a separate space.

I'm confused by all this alpha/beta/gamma stuff because I have heard more than one description of each type.

Some people say a true alpha male is not a jerk. Other descriptions do sound like a jerk. The omega male might be either the lowest status of all, or simply a lone wolf who does his own thing.

Most descriptions of an alpha female describe a tough and even domineering career woman type. But at least one blogger thinks an alpha female is a very traditionally feminine type. Others say a traditional woman is a beta female.

Personally I like a man who is sweet and gentle but does not have a lot of feminine interests. Nerds are usually the best.

Personally I like a man who is sweet and gentle but does not have a lot of feminine interests. Nerds are usually the best.

Well.. the thing is.... with a 'nerd' (and I dated a couple back in the day) they get scared when a woman shows her more confident side or gets angry about something. They run.... and when you need their gentle side... they're in hiding because "the ebil woman yelled at me" Eh, could have been a problem in how he was raised... but... he was weird. Needed a submissive type... and that's certainly not ME! Very sweet as long as I remained calm and never raised my voice at him. Wonder what ever happened to 'the wuss' (which is what I have refered to him as for the past... 45 years...LOL)

I'm not especially feminine. I have no real interest in makeup, dresses, and stuff like that.

Just throwing these out there:

I liked playing with Barbies, but mostly because my friend had HUNDREDS of outfits and accessories that I liked to coordinate.

I like makeup because I'm a mess without foundational help. It's a skill I wish I had learned in my teens.

I'm quiet and consider myself classy and demure, even if others see me as an aloof clod. I admire graceful women like Sade and the late Lady Di, but I respect bold, opinionated women too.

Many dresses make me look like a man in drag, but I love wrap dresses.

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"[GFG's pregnancy is] kind of like at the stables where that one dumb, ugly-ass mare broke out of her corral one day and got herself screwed by the equally fugly colt that was due to be gelded the same afternoon."- Shiny

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Miss_Hannigan
Just throwing these out there:

I liked playing with Barbies, but mostly because my friend had HUNDREDS of outfits and accessories that I liked to coordinate.

I like makeup because I'm a mess without foundational help. It's a skill I wish I had learned in my teens.

I'm quiet and consider myself classy and demure, even if others see me as an aloof clod. I admire graceful women like Sade and the late Lady Di, but I respect bold, opinionated women too.

Many dresses make me look like a man in drag, but I love wrap dresses.

Co-signed to all of the above.

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"Why children take so long to grow? They eat and drink like pig and give nothing back. Must find way to accelerate process..."
- Dr. Yi Suchong, Bioshock

"Society does not need more children; but it does need more loved children. Quite literally, we cannot afford unloved children - but we pay heavily for them every day. There should not be the slightest communal concern when a woman elects to destroy the life of her thousandth-of-an-ounce embryo. But all society should rise up in alarm when it hears that a baby that is not wanted is about to be born."
- Garrett Hardin

"I feel like there's a message involved here somehow, but then I couldn't stop laughing at all the plotholes, like the part when North Korea has food."
- Youtube commentor referring to a North Korean cartoon.

"Reality is a bitch when it slowly crawls out of your vagina and shits in your lap."
- Reddit comment

"Bitch wants a baby, so we're gonna fuck now. #bareback"
- Cambion

Oh whatever. Abortion doctors are crimestoppers."
- Miss Hannigan

I would describe myself as gender neutral, although technically a woman.

My clothing, work and hobbies are not based on gender at all.
I wear generic clothes and no makeup.

I just like interesting stuff and do all kinds of things regardless of which gender it has been traditionally linked to that interest.
(HINT TO THE WORLD: Traditionally male hobbies and work do not require a penis to do them)


Basically, I just want to get on with my life and wish people would not annoy and discriminate by get so focused on whether I am an "innie or outie" when my genitals or even my life has no impact on them what-so-ever.

What cassia said.

My typically-male interests are krav maga {though I am 2 months behind going because of work} and large dogs. I currently have a Doberman and I used to have a pyrenees. I just have never liked small purse dogs like Chihuahuas or yorkies.

My typically-female interest is baking.

I like reading, playing chess, and watching movies, which are all gender neutral. I do wear makeup, but only because I am not all that attractive as a blank canvas.

Lock him up or put him down.
Stolen from Shiny.

I am a bit of an eccentric in terms of dress. Imagine a slightly toned down female version of the Third Doctor. I am also a huge makeup addict and wear over the top eyeshadow with red lipstick. If people can't deal with it they can fuck off.

I have been described as being a dude in a female body when it comes to personality and interests. I fail at demure and domestic.

I am what happens when an incredibly intelligent person has ceased to give a flying fuck what people think. I have embraced my crazy and I am quite proud of it.