Say it loud, say it proud, they're pro-liars!

The government under POTUS Chump is now stocked with rabid pro-liars.

This just makes me so damned stabby.


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/mike-pence-anti-abortion-white-house_us_590a8914e4b05c39768623c4?section=us_politics

With Neil Gorsuch on the Supreme Court, it's only a matter of time till Roe v. Wade is overturned. Abortion rights will then go back to the individual states. Frankly, that's scary as hell. Any state with a majority-GOP government will kill legal abortion, just because they can. Wisconsin will likely be one of them.

It's ironic how the tRump "pro-life dream team" really cares only about fetal life. Once you're outside the uterus you're on your own.

Virginia passed a law years ago that makes abortion illegal the moment Roe v Wade is repealed. I'm fortunate that I can easily get to Maryland or NY/NJ if I need an abortion. I keep a separate abortion fund just in case.

Christian terrorists been targeting a clinic in Northern VA for years and recently escalated. Matter of time before they kill someone.

https://fcnp.com/2017/04/27/bomb-threat-evacuates-building/

I think that most states will get rid of legal abortion when the SC gets to R. vs. W. I have relatives in Canada who hate Justin Trudeau, the guy is a real pain when it come to letting in dangerous foreigners and endless welfare, but he would never touch abortion. They hate him for the "letting in the foreigners" thing and I think that after a while when enough Muslims get to live there with the free healthcare and their habit of driving trucks into buildings Canadians may vote a Trump like guy in who will go after abortion. People will go for this because the "breeding war" thing is in a lot of people when faced with increasing numbers of foreigners especially dangerous ones. Of course there seems to be a Muslim problem in Holland and they are still liberal.

A very good solution to cutting down immigration is cutting down welfare for breeding. It was a thread here about welfare cut after the second kid. So i just wonder how many of these people will still continue to come to a certain country or breed after welfare is cut. And 2 kids seems reasonable. The ones who are really in danger will come welfare or not but it will cut down the numbers of people coming only after welfare money.

Breeding war is the most unsustainable and stupid solution.

sorry, but I disagree with the apparently pervasive-here anti-immigrant opinions. I really do not believe that most immigrants come here or to the white European majority countries with the express intent to leech off welfare and breed wildly. For one thing, most immigrants I have known want to work and WILL work harder than most native Americans at almost anything, and for long hours. Also there are major restrictions to immigrants getting welfare or social security. Many come here to work, earn money to improve their home country/family situation, and return home to live and run businesses there, forfeiting all the taxes they have paid (yes, they have) to the US treasury.
Most immigrants I have known are fleeing hopeless poverty or war situations and/or seeking educations with more prestige and earning power than they can get in their home. In that respect, due to the current situations, they are financially propping up many small independent colleges. As we know, the social restrictions for many groups in 2nd or 3rd world countries are can be very bad. One Asian woman I knew was considered unmarriageable in her country because she was born with a bent pinky finger! She had considered suicide before she moved to the US, because she felt so damaged.This is just a small story of quite a few I have of why people come here and what they go through to stay. Some people or immigrant groups ARE big breeders, but many adopt our smaller family standards and are not . We , shamefully, have loads of trashy people/social groups who are born here who are indiscriminate breeders.
I assume I will catch flak for this opinion--just saying

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reeniebessagain
sorry, but I disagree with the apparently pervasive-here anti-immigrant opinions. I really do not believe that most immigrants come here or to the white European majority countries with the express intent to leech off welfare and breed wildly. For one thing, most immigrants I have known want to work and WILL work harder than most native Americans at almost anything, and for long hours. Also there are major restrictions to immigrants getting welfare or social security. Many come here to work, earn money to improve their home country/family situation, and return home to live and run businesses there, forfeiting all the taxes they have paid (yes, they have) to the US treasury.
Most immigrants I have known are fleeing hopeless poverty or war situations and/or seeking educations with more prestige and earning power than they can get in their home. In that respect, due to the current situations, they are financially propping up many small independent colleges. As we know, the social restrictions for many groups in 2nd or 3rd world countries are can be very bad. One Asian woman I knew was considered unmarriageable in her country because she was born with a bent pinky finger! She had considered suicide before she moved to the US, because she felt so damaged.This is just a small story of quite a few I have of why people come here and what they go through to stay. Some people or immigrant groups ARE big breeders, but many adopt our smaller family standards and are not . We , shamefully, have loads of trashy people/social groups who are born here who are indiscriminate breeders.
I assume I will catch flak for this opinion--just saying

Immigrants are not owed anything from anyone, including the "right" to emigrate to the US.

The notion of our problems being solved with ever more hoards of people is a fallacy. This is particularly true when you take the Muslim population into account. While I believe that people should have the right to worship as they choose, those who are coming from (and largely in agreement with) a culture that's entirely anti-intellectual, anti-rights for women, fiercely anti-LGBT, anti-free speech, are not needed in western democracies. Looking at Europe, their 21st Century immigrants are far different than what we Americans were bringing in during the early 20th century. These immigrants want to hold on to Islam. They have no desire to become westernized, and want to morph Europe into a place that is more friendly toward Sharia Law.

Many immigrants are good people, I am sure. But as we enter an age of job loss due to automation, we will not need tens of millions of new unskilled laborers. What will become of all of these superfluous people who were promised that America would be so good for them?

I am not opposed to all forms of limited immigration, and I don't care about skin color or religion. What I care more about are values and what a person actually brings to my country. If we need to bring a few skilled workers who want to adopts Americanized values and be productive citizens, that's great. But this notion of opening the doors to millions of young men who cling to ideas that are the direct antithesis of free societies... my answer is definitely no. We don't stone young women for adultery here, we don't throw gays off of buildings, and we have freedom of thought and speech and expression. And I don't care if that makes me an "Islamophobe."

I haven't seen open borders lead to anything but chaos in Europe and we don't need that kind of chaos here.

In the same way that we don't need more breeding, we won't need more immigration, either.

The Casey decision largely devolved abortion rights back to the states in the early 1990's. There is a reason you don't read about Congress passing new anti-abortion laws, and a reason voters in VA are worried and voters in NJ and MA are not. Roe has been hanging on by a thread for years. Roe being overturned will NOT make abortion illegal, it will just completely devolve it to the states. States like MD have already codified it.

What choice advocates will need to do is focus on building private organizations that will assist poor and younger women in getting to states where it's legal.

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StudioFiftyFour
I am not opposed to all forms of limited immigration, and I don't care about skin color or religion. What I care more about are values and what a person actually brings to my country.

I agree with the need for immigrants to fit in reasonably well with the society in which they live, and that immigration should be constrained by labor needs.

But a lot of the fuckwits in both the US are native-born. Those Christian Taliban types who seem extremely keen setting up a Christian theocracy and eliminating abortion rights aren't immigrants.

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StudioFiftyFour
I haven't seen open borders lead to anything but chaos in Europe and we don't need that kind of chaos here.

We don't have chaos. As someone who has moved freely around Europe thanks to our internal open borders, I've had the opportunity to live in multiple European countries and none of them were chaotic. The American media vastly exaggerates the situation.

This is not to say that there aren't integration issues. There certainly are. And mistakes have certainly been made. But we don't just let everyone in Europe, and we are not living in utter chaos, in cities filled with no-go zones.

I agree with yurble about the chaos thing, i also live in Europe and there is no chaos at least where i lived or travelled. And no, i'm not against immigrants because i'm an immigrant myself but my case is different as i moved within European Union and you are not entitled to any welfare just like that. I had my fair share of discrimination and nasty comments but that didn't stop me to learn the language and fit into society without problems. I do have though a big issue with people who come here and demand respect for their way of life or worse, trying to impose their (backwards) way of life. And if you say something against that then you are a racist.

We also have lots of natives who breed a lot and live on welfare, that's what i said, it would be fair for everybody if welfare is cut after the second kid.

The same political climate made our own right wing rise but they were really caught into the immigration issue and didn't touch abortion. Anyway, we do have quite restrictive abortion laws so perhaps they are satisfied for the time being.

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yurble
But a lot of the fuckwits in both the US are native-born. Those Christian Taliban types who seem extremely keen setting up a Christian theocracy and eliminating abortion rights aren't immigrants.

I am not in favor of eliminating abortion rights but there is a difference between an ideologue who wants to eliminate abortion rights versus a fanatic who wants to eliminate abortion rights, eliminate freedom of speech, eliminate trial by jury, implement Islamic law, stone women in public, hold public executions of gay citizens, etc. etc.

Clearly the majority of Muslims do not partake in extremism. What concerns me is the silence among Muslim leaders to condemn extremism, and among Muslims themselves (as a whole) to condemn such acts.

While there have been a few fanatics in the US who have bombed abortion clinics and done other crazy things, these are a microscopic portion of the population and on top of that, no mainstream sect of Christianity endorses such practices. They all come out vociferously against it, in fact.

Long story short--taking away the religious angle of things, the idea of solving problems by producing or importing more people is definitely the wrong approach and as we move into the coming decades this will lead to plenty of social, economic, and political unrest.

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StudioFiftyFour

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yurble
But a lot of the fuckwits in both the US are native-born. Those Christian Taliban types who seem extremely keen setting up a Christian theocracy and eliminating abortion rights aren't immigrants.

Clearly the majority of Muslims do not partake in extremism. What concerns me is the silence among Muslim leaders to condemn extremism, and among Muslims themselves (as a whole) to condemn such acts.

Then you must've missed the massive march against Isis by millions of Muslims last November.

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yurble
But a lot of the fuckwits in both the US are native-born. Those Christian Taliban types who seem extremely keen setting up a Christian theocracy and eliminating abortion rights aren't immigrants.

Very few members of Congress are immigrants of any flavor and immigrants are not eligible for the Presidency (though as time goes on, that line is going to get heavily blurred given how many wealthy foreigners (namely Russians and Chinese) will intentionally give birth in America and then go back to their homeland so their kids have jus sanguinis American citizenship. As long as these kids spend 14 years living in America, they'll be eligible to run for President).

------------------------------------------------------------
"Why children take so long to grow? They eat and drink like pig and give nothing back. Must find way to accelerate process..."
- Dr. Yi Suchong, Bioshock

"Society does not need more children; but it does need more loved children. Quite literally, we cannot afford unloved children - but we pay heavily for them every day. There should not be the slightest communal concern when a woman elects to destroy the life of her thousandth-of-an-ounce embryo. But all society should rise up in alarm when it hears that a baby that is not wanted is about to be born."
- Garrett Hardin

"I feel like there's a message involved here somehow, but then I couldn't stop laughing at all the plotholes, like the part when North Korea has food."
- Youtube commentor referring to a North Korean cartoon.

"Reality is a bitch when it slowly crawls out of your vagina and shits in your lap."
- Reddit comment

"Bitch wants a baby, so we're gonna fuck now. #bareback"
- Cambion

Oh whatever. Abortion doctors are crimestoppers."
- Miss Hannigan

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paragon schnitzophonic

Then you must've missed the massive march against Isis by millions of Muslims last November.

So... 20 million out of 1.6 billion.

I think it's great that 1.2% of the total world Islamic population stood up and opposed Isis and Islamic violence. Hopefully the other 98.8% jump on board soon.

I heard that China built a lot of planned cities, but the people did not come. If they're sitting there empty still, why don't we ship some immigrants there? Hmm, they would have to abide by China's population rules too, wouldn't they! I hear they are not as strict as one child anymore, but that means they've loosened up to, what, 2 children? Perfect, stay there, add immigrants, voila! Irresponsible breeding of the poor and less educated, curtailed.

There's no way. China is sitting at 1.4 billion people just within its own borders. And like with Japan and Korea, if you're not them, you'll never be fully integrated, no matter how well you speak the language and how long you've lived there (plus, it's near impossible to gain citizenship in China and Taiwan).

They should probably move their impoverished into those planned cities (like the ones they forcibly displaced for the Beijing Olympics). Although, given how slack their building codes are, maybe they shouldn't. A 2008 Sichuan-like earthquake would probably reduce it all to rubble.

------------------------------------------------------------
"Why children take so long to grow? They eat and drink like pig and give nothing back. Must find way to accelerate process..."
- Dr. Yi Suchong, Bioshock

"Society does not need more children; but it does need more loved children. Quite literally, we cannot afford unloved children - but we pay heavily for them every day. There should not be the slightest communal concern when a woman elects to destroy the life of her thousandth-of-an-ounce embryo. But all society should rise up in alarm when it hears that a baby that is not wanted is about to be born."
- Garrett Hardin

"I feel like there's a message involved here somehow, but then I couldn't stop laughing at all the plotholes, like the part when North Korea has food."
- Youtube commentor referring to a North Korean cartoon.

"Reality is a bitch when it slowly crawls out of your vagina and shits in your lap."
- Reddit comment

"Bitch wants a baby, so we're gonna fuck now. #bareback"
- Cambion

Oh whatever. Abortion doctors are crimestoppers."
- Miss Hannigan

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cfdavep
I think that most states will get rid of legal abortion when the SC gets to R. vs. W. I have relatives in Canada who hate Justin Trudeau, the guy is a real pain when it come to letting in dangerous foreigners and endless welfare, but he would never touch abortion. They hate him for the "letting in the foreigners" thing and I think that after a while when enough Muslims get to live there with the free healthcare and their habit of driving trucks into buildings Canadians may vote a Trump like guy in who will go after abortion. People will go for this because the "breeding war" thing is in a lot of people when faced with increasing numbers of foreigners especially dangerous ones. Of course there seems to be a Muslim problem in Holland and they are still liberal.

Uhh, do you have any evidence about this "Muslim problem"? And what exactly is this "Muslim problem" in Holland? Too many Muslims? Poorly integrated Muslims? Or just Muslims being there in general?

Muslims do not have a habit of driving trucks into buildings. Extremists do, but not your average Muslim who minds their own business and has nothing to do with extremism.

I think you'll find that despite the presence of "dangerous foreigners" here in Europe we have largely remained liberal because, you know, we're decent and reasonable human beings. The uneducated BS I see from Americans about Europe just boils my piss I'm afraid. We aren't living in chaos like someone else suggested, we're just fine thanks. Unfortunately there's bad apples everywhere, both home grown and otherwise. Are we to decide we hate everyone with a brown face because a few of them have done some bad things? No, in the same way that people of colour wouldn't brand every white personal a racist or a Nazi.

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yummynotmummy

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cfdavep
I think that most states will get rid of legal abortion when the SC gets to R. vs. W. I have relatives in Canada who hate Justin Trudeau, the guy is a real pain when it come to letting in dangerous foreigners and endless welfare, but he would never touch abortion. They hate him for the "letting in the foreigners" thing and I think that after a while when enough Muslims get to live there with the free healthcare and their habit of driving trucks into buildings Canadians may vote a Trump like guy in who will go after abortion. People will go for this because the "breeding war" thing is in a lot of people when faced with increasing numbers of foreigners especially dangerous ones. Of course there seems to be a Muslim problem in Holland and they are still liberal.

Uhh, do you have any evidence about this "Muslim problem"? And what exactly is this "Muslim problem" in Holland? Too many Muslims? Poorly integrated Muslims? Or just Muslims being there in general?

Muslims do not have a habit of driving trucks into buildings. Extremists do, but not your average Muslim who minds their own business and has nothing to do with extremism.

I think you'll find that despite the presence of "dangerous foreigners" here in Europe we have largely remained liberal because, you know, we're decent and reasonable human beings. The uneducated BS I see from Americans about Europe just boils my piss I'm afraid. We aren't living in chaos like someone else suggested, we're just fine thanks. Unfortunately there's bad apples everywhere, both home grown and otherwise. Are we to decide we hate everyone with a brown face because a few of them have done some bad things? No, in the same way that people of colour wouldn't brand every white personal a racist or a Nazi.

No one here came close to suggesting that they "hate" anyone, much less hate them for their skin color.

Pointing to brown skin as the problem is a convenient ad hom attack and ignores the real problem of Islamic fundamentalism which has ravaged Europe in recent years. If radical Muslims gain political power in Europe, you'll be in big trouble. Aligning yourself with an ideology that's anti-gay, anti-woman, anti-science, anti-free speech... there's nothing "liberal" about that. Organized religion in general isn't friendly toward the child free. To quote Sam Harris, Islam is the mother lode of all bad ideas perpetrated by organized religion.

Uhh, do you have any evidence about this "Muslim problem"? And what exactly is this "Muslim problem" in Holland? Too many Muslims? Poorly integrated Muslims? Or just Muslims being there in general?

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/nov/07/terrorism.religion

The murder that shattered the idea of liberalism in Holland, Theo Van Gogh's great grand son

I don't have any truck with organized religion and I'm not aligning myself with it. In my ideal world, religion and politics would be totally separate and religion would not govern countries. I do, however, have a problem with the idea that "Muslims have a habit of driving trucks into buildings" - that to me is bigotry and hate speech, I'm afraid - after all, we don't like being lumped together as one big evil childfree unit, do we? We even have a sticky thread here that says that just because we're childfree doesn't mean we're child haters. If that isn't a direct response to hatred and prejudice against the childfree community, what is it?

I'm not American, but I've spent a lot of time over there and I know full well Muslims aren't the only community getting a renewed barrage of hate - it's the Latinx community, black community, anyone non-white, so to say it has nothing to do with skin colour is naive. We've been "othering" non-white people since even before the days of slavery and segregation. Of course it's bound up with all of that and the British have had plenty to do with it, we are not without our share in that.

I don't know what the solution is - I'm very politically liberal, I don't want extremists in my country, but I do want a multicultural society and there's room for pluralism. That in my view benefits the childfree community, women, and people who wish to be free to practice their own belief system without imposing it on anyone else. My experience of living in multicultural cities, both here and abroad, is that the vast majority of people mind their own business and don't have anything to do with extremist views.

America seems to need a bogeyman, whether it's Native Americans, witches, black people, communists, Muslims...this is just the newest expression of it. Or at least it seems that way from across the pond anyway. I'm always quite stunned by the depth both of the warmth and kindness of American people, but also the depth of the hate when it comes out against whoever happens to be the bogeyman of the era. It often leaves me feeling quite confused about how I feel about the US really. To be fair, I also feel ambivalent about Islam too, because as you rightly point out S54, it's not a religion that's childfree friendly, some practices are anti-women, believe me I see the dark side of it in my work in mental health. Hatred just isn't going to fix the problem, in the same way as the CF aren't going to go away because breeders don't like us. If anything, there's going to be more of us as more people see the light, so we have to find a way to coexist with the majority of people who aren't extreme in their views about it.

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cfdavep
Uhh, do you have any evidence about this "Muslim problem"? And what exactly is this "Muslim problem" in Holland? Too many Muslims? Poorly integrated Muslims? Or just Muslims being there in general?

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/nov/07/terrorism.religion

The murder that shattered the idea of liberalism in Holland, Theo Van Gogh's great grand son

I'd say that Muslims attempting to pass Sharia law in the USA definitely counts as poor integration. They immigrate here and with immigration comes the local laws and assimilation, if they aren't comfortable go elsewhere. I say the same to any race, culture, religion that immigrates to the USA and refuses to support the laws in place and is against the separation of church and state. Also, any people born here who fight to upturn the separation of church and state are part of the problem but in this case I'm referring specifically to immigrants.

Source: http://www.inquisitr.com/2264063/muslim-sharia-law-in-seattle-islamic-interest-free-mortgage-loans-debated/
Another source, this one on family honor killings. And these are the ones reported: http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/penny-starr/iranian-american-sharia-law-here-us
Sharia Court in TX: http://insider.foxnews.com/2015/01/29/islamic-law-dallas-judge-napolitano-explains-how-sharia-court-texas-operates

Perhaps there are other races/religions who have immigrated and now have their own courts, who practice honor killings and want to receive interest free loans within the US but I'm not aware of them.

Sharia law in Britain: http://schulzkelaw.com/is-sharia-law-now-enforceable-in-the-united-states/

AIG and Sharia law: https://www.thomasmore.org/news/sharia-law-gains-foothold-us-federal-judge-upholds-government-funding-islam/

From the US Equal Opportunity Employment Commission-lots of lawsuits from Muslims suing over their religious beliefs: https://www.eeoc.gov/eeoc/litigation/selected/religion_nationalorigin.cfm

Muslims suing employers over prayer time-multi-state: https://www.bna.com/muslim-workers-allege-n57982070598/?_escaped_fragment_=

Nebraska-Muslims suing employer over prayer time: https://clarionproject.org/judge-rules-no-discrimination-meat-packing-lawsuit/

And an opinion column from Toronto: http://www.torontosun.com/2014/03/27/allowing-sharia-law-sets-dangerous-precedent
I mentioned this one because Britain spent over $100,000 so Muslim children could be called to prayer in schools.

Christians are outraged that Muslims are being allowed to pray in schools but Christians aren't:
http://www.christianpost.com/news/should-muslims-be-allowed-to-pray-in-public-schools-michigan-says-yes-98695/
(Personally I'm for separation of religion and state)

Muslims suing Hertz because they don't honor enough of their beliefs but give them prayer rooms, prayer rugs and prayer pray time: http://pamelageller.com/2015/02/litigation-jihad-muslim-workers-sue-hertz-for-islamofauxbia.html/

Muslim friendly workplaces increasing out of fear of lawsuits: http://dailycaller.com/2016/08/19/muslim-friendly-work-places-on-the-rise-out-of-fear-of-lawsuits/
Quote from article "About 1 percent of the U.S. population practices Islam, but 40 percent of religion-based workplace complaints filed with the U.S. Equal Opportunity Employment Commission in 2015 were Islam related."

More on USA accommodating Muslim religion in workplace: http://www.primerus.com/business-law-articles/accommodating-islam-in-the-workplace-a-work-in-progress-332011.htm

Another company sued for prayer rights: http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/04/angry-muslim-employees-file-lawsuit-plan-rally-amazon-due-lack-prayer-rooms/

Muslim truck drivers refusing to deliver alcohol because it is against their beliefs and then they sue: http://pamelageller.com/2015/10/illinois-two-muslim-truck-drivers-awarded-240000-for-refusing-to-deliver-alcohol.html/

Muslim employee sues Costco because she has to touch pork: http://pamelageller.com/2015/03/muslim-costco-employee-refuses-to-touch-pork-sues-after-getting-transferred-to-different-department.html/

Boston children's hospital sued over non-halal shot: http://pamelageller.com/2014/02/boston-childrens-hospital-sued-muslima-non-halal-flu-shot.html/

I have so far heard or seen no credible reports of Muslims trying to enact Sharia law that would impact non-muslims in the US. I know Rush Limbergercheese and the like always claim this, but I have never read it in, say , the NYTimes or any other non-right-wing media. I note that one of your sources is a Thomas More society publication--Catholic propaganda.
Please note that Jewish conservatives have religious court-like bodies to rule on divorces and other "spiritual" and doctrinal matters. Romany groups, I understand, have some sort of panels that enact rules upon their society, The Amish convene elders (?) or church leaders to decide on infractions and "shunning" among their group, and traditional Catholics have to appear before some church authorities to beg for marriage annulments. These could all be considered "laws" and "religious courts" also. I hear no one issuing dire warnings for our country because of these.
Fundamentalist Christian pharmacists have demanded they not be forced to sell birth control to customers, so...
Any assertion that Muslims are trying to, or in any danger of, instituting Sharia law to cover other then their believers is sloppy logic and responding to propaganda, IMHO.

The religious tribunals to which you refer are dealing with religious and community matters. They may decide to shun someone from the community but they do not insist on having their own prisons. They may rule on the religious nature of divorce or annulment, but they do not interfere with the legality of those things.

http://blog.dilbert.com/post/160447583616/wheres-my-immigration-prediction-model#_=_

Scott Adams did an interesting article on where is the Muslim tipping point and what will that mean for women and gays in the future. He points out that gay people are about 10% and laws are changing, so what will the tipping point be for Muslims and what is it now in Europe? Is France close? IDK. Maybe the future will be a place like they have in Saudi Arabia where there are compounds for non-Muslim workers to keep the cultures separate. There really is no way to predict and anyone past young adulthood today will be dead before the real effects are known. Will military have to be used against young Muslim males in the future in the US?IDK. When gun ownership by women and gays really have to rise? IDK Maybe

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yummynotmummy

I'm not American, but I've spent a lot of time over there and I know full well Muslims aren't the only community getting a renewed barrage of hate - it's the Latinx community, black community, anyone non-white, so to say it has nothing to do with skin colour is naive. We've been "othering" non-white people since even before the days of slavery and segregation.

Mainly quoting this to clear up a few old misconceptions...

How America traditionally used to 'other' immigrants was through considering them 'non-white' or anything other then 'white.' Irish used to be one of the groups considered this, also Polish, Jews, and Italians. Now it is Latinx that is the most recent group set under this 'catagory.' They were placed in it by the government in the 1960s (although it might have also meant more as an ethnic group, not race.)

Thing is though, 'othering' in these cases was meant mainly to keep these groups from being considered 'white.' Anything 'not white' could be open season for discrimination, as the old exclusionary job criterion 'Irish need not apply' once attested.

Many Latinx generally are just one of the groups of darker skinned Caucasian people, as forensic anthology shows. This is not the most sexy category obviously, so you get some people wanting/saying 'Lantinx' to be a 'race.'

Reason I mention this is because I see this misconception floating around quite a lot, and I just thought I would try to clear some of it up. :-)

You can disagree with (and even hate) an ideology and still have compassion for people who believe in it, such as Muslim refugees.

Just sayin'.