Whining SAHM on LinkedIn

LInk

Here's yet another article about how companies are being mean to SAHMs by not falling all over themselves to hire people who haven't worked in years.

The comments are the usual BS about how "it's the most important job in the world" and "they work so hard" and "their experience in wiping runny noses and acting as Snotleigh's Uber driver qualifies them for executive positions.

The only sane comment is by a CEO who pointed out that a 35 year old SAHP has the same amount of time in the workforce as a 25 year old and shouldn't logically expect to make the same salary as the average 35 year old who was gainfully employed all those years.

Check out this comment:

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How unfortunate. “Stay-at-home parents” are “unreliable”? Says who? “Stay-at-home parents” are “less skilled”? Says who? I’m a “stay-at-home mom” who has been PTA President, Chaired several positions many of them fundraisers which brought in significant $, sat on school boards, earned a college degree, volunteer with several organizations including the American Red Cross, attended conferences and professional development training, and the list goes on. I have done all this while raising three smart, top of their class, non trouble making, children. Two of my children have sickle cell disease, which extends my “stay-at-home” resume to include: medical director, schedule manager, insurance management, conflict resolution, patient advocate, customer service, record keeper, and so much more. Doesn't sound like someone who is under qualified or unreliable to me. But what do I know? I'm just a “stay-at-home parent”.

Get over yourself, Moo. Having a child with a medical condition does not qualify you to be a "medical director." People with M.D. degrees should be offended. (and BTW, why do people with genetic diseases breed, and breed multiple times in her case?) Shuttling your brats to various doctor appointments does not make you a "schedule manager." And interceding between squabbling brats does not make you an expert in "conflict resolution." I get the feeling this broad is a shitty parent if she calls herself a "customer service" person--is she indicating her kids are her customers? She's probably a gentle discipline twat who has no authority in her own home.

Um...okay. I'm doing medical terminology right now, and it's a toughie. Granted, I've learned a lot so far, but there's more to go. Some of the words are difficult to pronounce and spell. I study every day and it's a slow go at things.

How is sticking a bandaid on a toadler's finger the same as being a medical director? That is so preposterous, that it's no wonder people don't take shamoos seriously. The shit that they spew on the internet makes them look like complete idiots.

I'm over halfway through my course right now and I can GUARANDAMNTEE that this woman wouldn't know half the shit I've learned. Not only that, but even I can't call myself anything MEDICAL until after I complete my program.

Record keeper? Is she clipping coupons and putting her bills into a folder and she thinks she's a record keeper? That's another tall one.

This woman is NO MORE a medical director or record keeper than I am an avian vet because I examine my birds' poops to make sure there isn't anything wrong with them.

I think this is why a lot of them can't get hired. They are fucking delusional.

If those skills were so valuable, EVERYONE would be able to successfully use them on their resumes and get respective bonuses/jobs/etc.

But those adults don't list 'em, because they're not remarkable skills. The fact that SAHMs are listing 'em shows how they're scraping the barrel to find something to list as a qualification. Laughable.

A few years back someone here posted that at larger companies HR staff laugh at moos' claims in résumés to be able to handle various high-level skills based on dealing with kids—then the staff chick the résumé. As they should.

Perhaps mudders should try applying at a whinery. After all, they all excel at whining.

They list all these skills and job roles, but I bet if you get them into an interview and ask them what their position was in the PTA, what were their duties, what were their successes, and how that relates to the job they're applying for, they wouldn't have an answer that inspires trust in their ability to handle the position.

Nobody is going to take an idiot who has the gall to describe herself as a medical director for taking charge of her ill children's health. You're giving yourself a fancy title for doing what you should be doing as a parent that created sickle-cell children who are not yet old enough to advocate for themselves.

And they sell themselves as being the most reliable type of person, but who are the ones who use their children as shields for shitty work ethic? Who comes in late and leaves early because of their children? Who consistently takes a bunch of time off leaving their work for somebody else to complete? Who constantly laments that their employer or the government doesn't give them a fully paid year off for a completely voluntary life choice? Who threw a fit so now the people who have to pick up their slack don't get the brownie points or are able to use it as leverage for a raise or promotion? Who are the ones who then expect to be first in line for raises and promotions just because they have kids? Who are the ones who constantly threaten to sue for discrimination if their employer doesn't give them everything they demand? Who are the ones who usually cause tense work environments? It's not the childless or childfree, that's for damn sure. In fact, they're the ones who get screwed over.

They expect to come into the workforce after years of being unemployed and to be hired over recent college graduates who spent their four years at university padding their resume by getting real-world experience in their desired field and desperately need a job in order to pay off the five or six figures of college debt. But then when their kids are college graduates struggling to find work, they would scream unholy hell if some SAHMoo got a job over their precious children.

Some comments mentioned that the employer should think of the possibility that the former SAHBreeder is now a widow(er) or divorced and I'm like, that's something you should have thought of before even getting married, let alone having kids. It's not the employer's job to save you from your own lack of foresight and planning. They act like that's so impossible, but my parents fucking did. Whenever I talk with my mom, I'm amazed and pleased at the amount of planning she and my father did before even attempting to conceive. Because of their planning, my sister and I were raised in comfort and security that didn't change when my father suddenly died when I was 13. My mom, in her words, didn't get a Ph.D. to become a SAHM. In fact, she made more money than my dad. So we didn't have to move or drastically change our lifestyle and she was still able to retire on time. So I don't buy the crap breeders nowadays espouse that it's impossible to plan.

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"Why children take so long to grow? They eat and drink like pig and give nothing back. Must find way to accelerate process..."
- Dr. Yi Suchong, Bioshock

"Society does not need more children; but it does need more loved children. Quite literally, we cannot afford unloved children - but we pay heavily for them every day. There should not be the slightest communal concern when a woman elects to destroy the life of her thousandth-of-an-ounce embryo. But all society should rise up in alarm when it hears that a baby that is not wanted is about to be born."
- Garrett Hardin

"I feel like there's a message involved here somehow, but then I couldn't stop laughing at all the plotholes, like the part when North Korea has food."
- Youtube commentor referring to a North Korean cartoon.

"Reality is a bitch when it slowly crawls out of your vagina and shits in your lap."
- Reddit comment

"Bitch wants a baby, so we're gonna fuck now. #bareback"
- Cambion

Oh whatever. Abortion doctors are crimestoppers."
- Miss Hannigan

I found another sane reply here:

"Personally, I get a little sick and tired of the SAH brigade. You made a choice to have kids..then you made the choice regarding your lifestyle. Now you have less experience, you are out of the loop and maybe out of money...but you want to be hired for position s over people who have stayed in the trenches all these years? Seriously?"

The "schedule manager" thing really sticks in my craw.

Every adult has things to keep track of: medical appointments, paying bills, keeping your personal things and residence in order. You don't deserve any special credit for doing what other adults have to do. I understand having a kid or three or five adds more of this type of work. That is a self-created condition whereas every person (except Breeder women who suck off a man) has to support himself/herself.

And about the scheduling, COME ON. The difference in staying home is that you can set your own schedule to some extent. It doesn't matter whether you pay bills at 9:00 am or 2:00 am, as long as it's done on time. Someone with an average IQ can schedule "well baybee appointments" at a time that's acceptable to them. If your household has a schedule due to feeding of kids, well you picked that.

You don't have someone breathing down your neck; there isn't the constant pressure to PERFORM and HANDLE THINGS. (A lot of these Moos are slaves to their children and are not parents but that's a self-created problem due to being spineless and buying into modern martyr mother concept.)

Presumably, Moos are working on what they want to work on, i.e. their choice to stay home and raise their DNA replicants. It's supposed to be "rewarding" and TMIJITW and all that happy horseshit. Try coordinating projects that involve hundreds of people and deliverables. You didn't pick these projects and there are uncooperative people and pressures and deadlines. Try managing projects where everything is interdependent, and you have to use Microsoft Project just to keep track of it. Try doing that with someone breathing down your neck all the time, hostile co-workers and a fixed amount of time to do it all. And you are working to someone else's expectations where you will be reviewed. And because you are working, you still have all those personal things you need to take care on your own time, not your employer's time.

Yet these broads think staying home and raising brats entitle them to waltz into a job over someone who has been performing for the last 10-15 years? Blow me, you delusional twats.

The other thing I don't understand is that there are courses and programs available online now that SHAMOOS can take at home, while their DNA disasters are sleeping or at school. I'm currently taking an online course and preparing myself to start a new career.

If these SAHlosers want to keep up with education in their field, there are so many resources available now to do that. I admit that they are going to have a helluva time trying to re-enter the workforce after being away for so many years, but at least they can keep up with their fields in some way, or maybe even start something new.

Calling yourself a medical director, conflict resolver and accountant because you do menial every day household chores is NOT going to help you land anything but a minimum wage job at a greasy spoon restaurant. Hell, I could call myself an accountant, insurance specialist, groundskeeper, head chef, etc. etc. just because I basically run the house while my husband works. I just wouldn't have the audacity to put that on my resume and expect anyone to take me seriously.

It's called the Dunning-Kruger effect: when someone thinks they are highly skilled at something, because they don't possess enough knowledge to recognize their own shortcomings.

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"Not every ejaculation deserves a name" - George Carlin

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Try coordinating projects that involve hundreds of people and deliverables. You didn't pick these projects and there are uncooperative people and pressures and deadlines. Try managing projects where everything is interdependent, and you have to use Microsoft Project just to keep track of it. Try doing that with someone breathing down your neck all the time, hostile co-workers and a fixed amount of time to do it all. And you are working to someone else's expectations where you will be reviewed. And because you are working, you still have all those personal things you need to take care on your own time, not your employer's time

That's the issue with volunteers. With a paid position, you competed with dozens if not hundreds of other candidates; your resume was one of the 5 top ones chosen for an interview; you beat out the other candidates; and have periodic reviews.

Volunteers are any warm body who shows up and doesn't burn the place down. You can claim you did all these great things, but I have no way to verify that.

Also, when we see children running around like little howler monkeys on methamphetamine, breaking things, making noise for the sake of making noise, making messes, and treating the world like it’s their personal playground and their handlers are doing nothing to correct or curb their behavior, we’re supposed to take SAHBreeders seriously? It looks like they suck at all those “jobs” they claim. How are you going to take a management role where you’re overseeing tens to hundreds of employees and you can’t even keep your three children in check? How’re you going to handle multitasking several high-importance projects that have non-negotiable deadlines and yet claim that you never had time to make full home-cooked meals as a SAHB?

------------------------------------------------------------
"Why children take so long to grow? They eat and drink like pig and give nothing back. Must find way to accelerate process..."
- Dr. Yi Suchong, Bioshock

"Society does not need more children; but it does need more loved children. Quite literally, we cannot afford unloved children - but we pay heavily for them every day. There should not be the slightest communal concern when a woman elects to destroy the life of her thousandth-of-an-ounce embryo. But all society should rise up in alarm when it hears that a baby that is not wanted is about to be born."
- Garrett Hardin

"I feel like there's a message involved here somehow, but then I couldn't stop laughing at all the plotholes, like the part when North Korea has food."
- Youtube commentor referring to a North Korean cartoon.

"Reality is a bitch when it slowly crawls out of your vagina and shits in your lap."
- Reddit comment

"Bitch wants a baby, so we're gonna fuck now. #bareback"
- Cambion

Oh whatever. Abortion doctors are crimestoppers."
- Miss Hannigan

I actually think it's a sensible idea to use part time or lower pressure internships to hire people. it could benefit both parties. The employer has an intern and not a full time employee, who is more difficult to fire. There is a trial period before too much of an investment is made. The recipient gets a chance to build skills in a lower level job.

Sometimes people are out of the workforce for reasons other than caring for brats. They could be caring for an aging parent or ill themselves.

But when someone starts telling me the experience of caring for brats makes them capable of scheduling, medical directing,, etc, we have a problem. And if you've been out of the work force for a while and your skills aren't current, you will likely have a lower re-entry salary, just as everyone else in that position. Being a Moo doesn't make you special or immune to these rules. Go find a Moo who is willing to give you top dollar because you wrangled brats and stayed out of the workforce for a decade.

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How are you going to take a management role where you’re overseeing tens to hundreds of employees and you can’t even keep your three children in check? How’re you going to handle multitasking several high-importance projects that have non-negotiable deadlines and yet claim that you never had time to make full home-cooked meals as a SAHB?

QFT!

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paragon schnitzophonic
Also, when we see children running around like little howler monkeys on methamphetamine, breaking things, making noise for the sake of making noise, making messes, and treating the world like it’s their personal playground and their handlers are doing nothing to correct or curb their behavior, we’re supposed to take SAHBreeders seriously? It looks like they suck at all those “jobs” they claim. How are you going to take a management role where you’re overseeing tens to hundreds of employees and you can’t even keep your three children in check? How’re you going to handle multitasking several high-importance projects that have non-negotiable deadlines and yet claim that you never had time to make full home-cooked meals as a SAHB?

The standards are much lower, they only have to keep their kids alive until 18. Workplaces have higher standards than everyone leaving alive.

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JoJo

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Try coordinating projects that involve hundreds of people and deliverables. You didn't pick these projects and there are uncooperative people and pressures and deadlines. Try managing projects where everything is interdependent, and you have to use Microsoft Project just to keep track of it. Try doing that with someone breathing down your neck all the time, hostile co-workers and a fixed amount of time to do it all. And you are working to someone else's expectations where you will be reviewed. And because you are working, you still have all those personal things you need to take care on your own time, not your employer's time

That's the issue with volunteers. With a paid position, you competed with dozens if not hundreds of other candidates; your resume was one of the 5 top ones chosen for an interview; you beat out the other candidates; and have periodic reviews.

Volunteers are any warm body who shows up and doesn't burn the place down. You can claim you did all these great things, but I have no way to verify that.

A person who can lead volunteers is a true miracle worker. As long as the volunteers aren't related to them.

I couldn't stop laughing. Seriously? Everyone on here has or has had a job that no freaking SAHM could ever walk into. Describing your brats poo color doesn't make you a medical transcriptionist, neither does opening a can of spaghetti make you chef. Where do they get such grandiose ideas? Do they have Munchausen disease? I'm going back for another degree ( my ultimate goal in life is to make DSS cry...fuckers) in Industrial Security. It will not mean I can step into the role of VP of Security. How they think that shitting out spawn means they are now CEO material for doing what every adult does to ensure they don't lose their home is just out there.

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"It is better not to look like what you are; it is better to look like a bourgeois woman because then all the doors are open for you and then you can just go and make hell." - Marjane Satrapi

I'd love to see some SAHMoo who self-describes herself as a chef try to come waltzing in where I work. There are the non-professional cooks who are enthusiasts or hobbyists and regularly expand their skills by making elaborate meals and desserts or at least regularly follow America's Test Kitchen recipes. Those aren't your standard SAHMoos, though. At best, they're from the school of Sandra Lee or the Pioneer Woman where it's a bunch of can opening and basic meals and at least two nights a week is pure reheated frozen foods or takeout.

In my pastry kitchen, my litmus test is handing you a recipe and you should be able to discern how to make it without needing explicit instructions. I don't have time for hand-holding.

------------------------------------------------------------
"Why children take so long to grow? They eat and drink like pig and give nothing back. Must find way to accelerate process..."
- Dr. Yi Suchong, Bioshock

"Society does not need more children; but it does need more loved children. Quite literally, we cannot afford unloved children - but we pay heavily for them every day. There should not be the slightest communal concern when a woman elects to destroy the life of her thousandth-of-an-ounce embryo. But all society should rise up in alarm when it hears that a baby that is not wanted is about to be born."
- Garrett Hardin

"I feel like there's a message involved here somehow, but then I couldn't stop laughing at all the plotholes, like the part when North Korea has food."
- Youtube commentor referring to a North Korean cartoon.

"Reality is a bitch when it slowly crawls out of your vagina and shits in your lap."
- Reddit comment

"Bitch wants a baby, so we're gonna fuck now. #bareback"
- Cambion

Oh whatever. Abortion doctors are crimestoppers."
- Miss Hannigan

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paragon schnitzophonic
I'd love to see some SAHMoo who self-describes herself as a chef try to come waltzing in where I work. There are the non-professional cooks who are enthusiasts or hobbyists and regularly expand their skills by making elaborate meals and desserts or at least regularly follow America's Test Kitchen recipes. Those aren't your standard SAHMoos, though. At best, they're from the school of Sandra Lee or the Pioneer Woman where it's a bunch of can opening and basic meals and at least two nights a week is pure reheated frozen foods or takeout.

In my pastry kitchen, my litmus test is handing you a recipe and you should be able to discern how to make it without needing explicit instructions. I don't have time for hand-holding.

I consider myself an enthusiast when it comes to cooking. People I cook for often tell me that my cooking is good, and I could do it professionally. All that says is that I'm the better cook than the person telling me that, because I can see the gulf between my hobby and professionalism, which isn't as obvious to someone with less experience. I know that I am neither qualified to be nor desire to be a chef.

People who think that their hobbyist activities are at the same level as professionalism are generally lower skilled, with a poor understanding of what the professional work entails. It's certainly possible to reach a professional level with a hobby over time (generally in a less-regulated field), but it requires dedication and practice. There aren't enough hours in the day to get the expertise necessary to qualify as a medical director, schedule manager, insurance management, conflict resolution, patient advocate, customer service, record keeper and whatever else these delusional people want to claim.

If I see a CV where someone claims to be an expert in a variety of topics, I assume they are shitty at all of them. Someone with moderate expertise would know enough to rate their skills as intermediate (unless they are inflating and lying, in which case I also wouldn't want them on board).

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bell_flower
I actually think it's a sensible idea to use part time or lower pressure internships to hire people. it could benefit both parties. The employer has an intern and not a full time employee, who is more difficult to fire. There is a trial period before too much of an investment is made. The recipient gets a chance to build skills in a lower level job.

Sometimes people are out of the workforce for reasons other than caring for brats. They could be caring for an aging parent or ill themselves.

But when someone starts telling me the experience of caring for brats makes them capable of scheduling, medical directing,, etc, we have a problem. And if you've been out of the work force for a while and your skills aren't current, you will likely have a lower re-entry salary, just as everyone else in that position. Being a Moo doesn't make you special or immune to these rules. Go find a Moo who is willing to give you top dollar because you wrangled brats and stayed out of the workforce for a decade.

I am generally in favor of measures that make it easier for people to re-enter the workforce, but I do have some concerns about internships as in recent years they have been widely used to drive down wages and exploit students. I think it's detrimental to society as a whole, because not only are experienced people unable to get paid for their labor (and thus must be supported through social welfare), but only people whose families can support them can afford to take internships, which puts a damper on social mobility. If someone can do the job, they should get paid for it, and minimum wage laws should be in place to prevent a race to the bottom.

One of the reasons I advocate for universal sabbaticals paid with paycheck deductions, aside from the fairness of not treating parents as a special class, is that it would normalize taking time off work, which would potentially eliminate the scarring effect. People do end up having to take time out of work for illness, caring for others, or even economic downturns, and that they should suffer a lifetime penalty for circumstances beyond their control seems harsh.

The scarring effect is the lifetime reduction in earnings that someone can expect to experience when they spend time out of the workforce. It doesn't refer to the initial reduction in salary which can be justified from the time and effort it takes for a person to bring their knowledge up-to-date, a gap that would presumably be addressed after a couple of years. Rather, it describes how people tend to have lower salaries for the remainder of their career, compared not to people who initially started work when they did but have more years of experience, but compared to people with the same number of years of experience but no gap. In general, a 45-year-old person who took a break from work from 30-35 is going to be earning less than a 40-year-old person who didn't take a gap, all other things being equal.

I saw more then one complaint from moos who stayed home and didn't work for 16 years and seem surprised that their phones aren't ringing off the hooks. Yes, if anyone (moo or whoever) doesn't work for 16 years they are going to be lucky to make more than minimum wage.

They're competing with recent graduates who have a couple years of experience and some of the jobs are paying minimum wage. I started working during a recession and looked for an unpaid internship. The company saw my determination and offered me part time work instead and about 6 weeks later it turned into a full time position. Determination is so much better than tongue waggling about all the experience the moo has. At some point it is put up and shut up time. People who have been out of the workforce for 16 years and haven't updated their skills are going to have to take what they can get and tough it out until they have the experience for something that pays more. And if they aren't wise enough to figure out what they need to do to earn more than there is always someone else more industrious who will figure it out.

I learn new concepts and technology everyday at work and am always reading or training on something. If it is offered, I will take it every time as long as it is relevant. Staying relevant is job security and giving an example of how efficient one can make a grocery list isn't relevant to much of anything.

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freya
(snip) I started working during a recession and looked for an unpaid internship. The company saw my determination and offered me part time work instead and about 6 weeks later it turned into a full time position. Determination is so much better than tongue waggling about all the experience the moo has. At some point it is put up and shut up time.(snip)

Early in my work life, I was looking to integrate into more skilled jobs and used the offer of internship to give potential employers a sample of my work ethic.
In each case, I was in small towns where such employment was much less formal than in cities today.
It took a very short amount of time of voluntary internship before I was offered a position in the company.
After months of paid work, the employer would have an informal performance review and essentially say, " Slow down. You don't need to work so hard to keep impressing us, you got the job".
My responses were that unless it was causing a problem for them, that the intensity and amount of work I was doing was natural for me and it would continue.
I believe that my determination and work ethic have put me into jobs many times in my life.