It's gone

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nightfire
But that could change as early as 2023 should state Sen. Doug Mastriano (R., Franklin) win the November election to become Pennsylvania’s next governor.

Mastriano has said he would sign a bill banning abortion at six weeks with no exceptions for rape, incest, or life of the pregnant person.'

This is where the pro-lifers are going to mess up big time. If they try this, eventually the red states will turn blue and there will be no more abortion restrictions.

Women are half of all voters. I don't get how these pro-lifers think there won't eventually be a backlash against ever-tightening restrictions and bans.

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This is where the pro-lifers are going to mess up big time. If they try this, eventually the red states will turn blue and there will be no more abortion restrictions.

We can only hope. Any woman can be raped. Any woman could get pregnasty and have to choose between the fetus and herself. Any sexually active woman could have an ectopic pregnancy and die because of these loons.

I would hope there are sane women left in the world. Women who are not Good Kristian Mommies(TM) that seem so quick to sacrifice themselves for the Holy Fetus. Seriously, fuck that shit. What if the woman has other kids? Is it noble to die for a fetus and leave your existing children without a mom? I cannot imagine any thinking woman being okay with this, but there are plenty of morons.

The fact that we have candidates saying this means they are emboldened. We have Trump and all those other radical Rethugnicans to thank for this--and the morons who vote for them. (Some of which are female. They need to wake up.)

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kman

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nightfire
But that could change as early as 2023 should state Sen. Doug Mastriano (R., Franklin) win the November election to become Pennsylvania’s next governor.

Mastriano has said he would sign a bill banning abortion at six weeks with no exceptions for rape, incest, or life of the pregnant person.'

This is where the pro-lifers are going to mess up big time. If they try this, eventually the red states will turn blue and there will be no more abortion restrictions.

Women are half of all voters. I don't get how these pro-lifers think there won't eventually be a backlash against ever-tightening restrictions and bans.

I venture to say that over 50% of voters in the US are pro-choice:

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/06/02/roe-v-wade-roughly-55percent-of-americans-say-they-are-pro-choice-the-most-since-1995-gallup-finds.html

There is also a number of voters, myself included, that firmly believe in having abortion available at no cost to the patient, for any reason or no reason at all.

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bell_flower
I would hope there are sane women left in the world. Women who are not Good Kristian Mommies(TM) that seem so quick to sacrifice themselves for the Holy Fetus. Seriously, fuck that shit. What if the woman has other kids? Is it noble to die for a fetus and leave your existing children without a mom? I cannot imagine any thinking woman being okay with this, but there are plenty of morons.

It makes me wonder what makes them radically change their opinions on something like this, despite reading the same Bible.

What I mean by this is that years ago, they were pro-choice, even the more hard core Baptists. They didn't want big government interference into the private lives of Americans. They also used the more Jewish definition of when life begins (first quickening or when the baby took it's first breath I think) versus the more Catholic one (starts at conception.) I know it was political manipulation over substituting abortion for segregation to rally people around and that old church movie with the dolls floating in the Dead Sea, but it seemed like they can now 'find' Bible verses that 'support' their newer view, even though they were reading the same Bible before.

The anti-abortion stance simply replaced the racist stance that they could spout openly in the past, it is about control of the flock, who gives a damn if the edict falls on an 8-year-old rape victim forced to die in childbirth.

+++++++++++++

Passive Aggressive
Master Of Anti-brat
Excuses!

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Cambion
Not sure how true this is, but I got something in my email saying that the Pennsylvania General Assembly is trying to get around the governor's decision to keep abortion legal/accessible by amending the state's constitution to outlaw abortion. I'm not knowledgeable in politics, but apparently the governor cannot overrule a constitutional amendment. So PA might be on the chopping block next - I'm thankful to know that, in the event of a worst-case scenario, I am close enough to the border that I could drive to a neighboring state where abortion remains legal should I need the services of a women's clinic.

I'm sorry, I'm a dumbass, but can somebody explain to me why the president cannot tell the Supreme Court to fuck off? What the hell is the point of holding the highest authority in the country if a bunch of assholes lower on the totem pole can make a decision you can't undo? It's like the district manager having power over the CEO - that makes no sense. Why the fuck give someone authority if they can't use it? I don't understand why he can't Thanos-snap their decision into oblivion since he runs the damn country.

Biden also signed an executive order today in an effort to protect reproductive rights, including rights to abortion, Plan B and contraception. But apparently as the president, his power is limited and he is encouraging people to elect new Supreme Court justices in the fall to try and undo this bullshit so that Roe v. Wade can become federally protected.

https://www.cnn.com/2022/07/08/politics/what-is-in-biden-abortion-executive-order/index.html

According to Wikipedia, the Pennsylvania state constitution can be amended if the General Assembly passes an amendment in consecutive sessions, then it is ratified by the electorate. It looks like neither the governor nor the state senate play a role in its passage.

I don't think one person, such as a governor or president, should have the power to veto a constitutional amendment. That places too much power in one person.

Even though I don't live in PA, I believe that state's governor election is the most important one in the country this November. It is a swing state for 2024. Mastriano is a disaster, a Big Lie believer who IIRC was among the protesters on January 6th. He also gets to appoint the Secretary of State who oversees the elections, and will surely appoint a fellow Big Lie believer. God help us if the 2024 presidential election is close and the GOP cries fraud in PA. With its entire state legislature being GOP-run, there will be very little checks on the GOP to simply declare themselves the winner, even if the Dems win more votes. Maybe the state courts, although there is a case the SCOTUS will take up next term which could place even more power in the state legislatures than there is now, including on issues such as redistricting and election oversight.

The GOP is putting together a stealth coup so they won't need to start any more riots. Tyranny of the minority.

I know I already mentioned how this whole shitshow affects women, but how's about how it's going to affect all the children that are "saved" from the big bad abortion monster? Let us count the ways:

- Hospitals being overwhelmed with high-risk births because fetuses that would have otherwise been aborted will get forced into existence and there will be LOADS of preemies, micro-preemies, deformed infants, and newbors with problems that are "incompatible with life." Rather than do the humane thing and terminate these doomed pregnancies before they reach completion, they will all be forced to suffer for a few hours/days until they finally die, most likely with hospitals being required to exercise all possible life-extending resources because they probably won't be allowed to just let them go naturally. NICUs will have absolutely no room for these infants. The ER will no longer make your emergency a priority because when the whole place is packed to the brim with women in pre-term labor, uterine hemorraging and breech births, there will simply not be enough manpower to handle all those patients. Babies will be born and will die in the waiting room and the parking lot, sometimes right along with their mothers. And let us not forget all the fetuses that will be born fucked up because they survived abortion attempts. I'm sure a loaf that comes out after having a coat hanger jammed through its skull and manages to still be alive will have a terrific life.

- LOADS more babies being born with fetal alcohol syndrome or addicted to various substances. Because let's face it, you know plenty of women are going to drink and get high constantly to try and forget they have to stay pregnant. Nothing's quite as magical as a newborn screaming bloody murder because it's born in withdrawal. Withdrawal from certain drugs can be life-threatening for newborns too.

- Far more children being born into poverty because a lack of an ability to afford kids or more kids is one of the primary reasons for abortion. No longer having that option means more kids being forced to go without.

- Classes being HUGE. Schools struggle to find teachers and get them to stay as it is, but if classroom sizes double or triple due to abortion bans, nobody will want to teach. Parents will be forced to home-school and since most of them can't think their way out of a paper bag, they will be woefully incapable of educating their own kids. Not just grade school either, but also colleges will be overwhelmed in 20 years when all these precious bundles of joy are adults who want to make something of themselves. Daycares and pre-schools too - when you have two people trying to watch a hundred kids, they're going to have no choice but to turn people away. Parents will either have to bring the sprogs to work with them, or one parent will have to stay at home while the other works, and now more than ever, people often cannot afford to live on one income. Teachers will become overwhelmed by classroom sizes and I'll bet more of them will quit/retire and fewer people will want to become teachers, placing more burden on remaining teachers, who will become burned out who will also eventually quit/retire.

- The adoption/foster system becoming grossly overwhelmed. They can't get people to buy the kids they have now! Every unwanted pregnancy resulting in a live birth may end with the child being surrendered. When people prepare to thrown down five figures to adopt a child, they want a flawless white baby. Nobody's going to adopt the kids with serious defects, drug addictions, Down syndrome, inbred children, mixed race children, and if they foster them, odds are it will be for the stipend and nothing else. So they can get paid to rent a tard for a few hundred bucks a month and then just treat it like shit. Agencies will likely reach a point where they have to refuse people's kids because they simply have no room for them, forcing the parents to take the child home with them.

- More babies being abandoned - thrown into rivers, dumpsters, down trash chutes, into toilets, left on doorsteps, out in the woods, or really anywhere a desperate woman can find to stash it and hope it dies quietly. Along the same lines, I also foresee lots of women not going to the hospital if they learn they are pregnant because they plan to dispose of the resulting child and don't want anyone knowing they're pregnant. Obviously this can lead to serious consequences if the pregnancy takes a turn for the worst. I imagine we will see a slew of nationwide obituaries for young women saying they "died unexpectedly." No, they died very expectedly from the ectopic pregnancy that doctors were not legally allowed to treat.

- A sharp uptick in the number of cases of child abuse, neglect and murder. CPS can't keep up as it is, and forcing loaves to be born to people who absolutely do not want them will guarantee more kids get hurt. I'd wager many parents will straight up kill their newborns simply because they can't afford them and can't give them up.

- Increase in crime in 15-20 years. As these kids raised by unwilling, negligent, abusive, crazy, resentful, broke parents get older, you know for a fact many will turn to crime, not only because of their shit upbringing, but simply because more people = higher chance many of them become criminals. With the increase in crime will also come an increase in the number of school shootings, which I think people are already becoming blase about. Oh, someone shot up a school and killed 55 students? Shame. What were the Power Ball numbers? Judging by how things in the US have been going lately, many of these kids will wind up getting aborted at school by a psychotic classmate with Daddy's gun. But at least they weren't "murdered" in the uterus, amirite? That would be a serious tragedy.

Some other potential consequences of this bullshit are:

- People moving out of red states and fewer people moving into them because they don't want to have to travel across several states to abort. I imagine this could hurt the economy of many towns and cities.

- Steep increases in the number of women needing mental health services. It can take months upon months to get in to see someone as it is, and some women may have depression or PPD so bad that they don't have months to spare.

- Many more high-risk pregnancies because women who are sick and/or fat get and stay pregnant instead of aborting, not to mention the craploads of minor girls being forced to carry their uncle's/father's/stepfather's fetus whose bodies are in no way developed enough to handle a full-blown pregnancy. I'm sure OBs will love the shit out of this, but when thousands of women in the same town need specialized obstetric care because they are too sick to have healthy pregnancies, it will again take months to get in to see someone and many women may not have months to wait around for an appointment. If a child gets pregnant, do they go to an obstetrician or a pediatrician? That's a question a lot of parents will wish they never had to ask, but will find themselves needing to.

- Loads of women dying from pregnancy-induced illnesses such as pre-ecclampsia and hyperemesis gravidarum. I have heard plenty of stories of women who have hyperemesis so badly that they can't even keep water down, and not eating or drinking can not only harm the woman, but might also harm the precious fetus that lawmakers want to save.

Like there is literally no upside to banning abortion. Not one. I would love to know how exactly the Supreme Cunt Court figured that this would in any way be a decision that benefits anybody.

I expect that the suicide rate for women and girls will go through the roof. Pregnant and can't get rid of it? Jump off a 5-story building, boom, took care of that problem.

+++++++++++++

Passive Aggressive
Master Of Anti-brat
Excuses!

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Techie
@misskitty: what Dave Ramsey got going on is a small scale example of how corporate America can be weaponized against people in any way that a small group of people desires. They will use the idea that one "doesn't have to work here" to force people to behave in a way that forced birthers want. They can achieve 100% compliance among those who are W2 employees, with exceptions for higher level management, of course.

Corporate America offered to support employee abortions after the overturn because employees who are pregnant or have pregnant spouses won't work as much. They're definitely not controlled by government, let alone by forced birthers. Corporations the ones who control the government through lobbying, so the only way forced birthers could think about winning is to top most of the corporate ladders. The men at the top of corporate ladders are usually Chads, so the forced birthers who base their policies on sexual rejections will fail miserably at reaching the top.

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Techie
Medical marijuana can be prescribed but employers are allowed to fire for using it. Before 2020, it was happening a lot. Now there is a shortage of workers, we don't hear as much about it. But this is an example of private sector forcing the desires of the few onto many. Punishment for out-of-wedlock sex will be done in the same way. I don't think this place will turn into a prison planet but compliance will be achieved by threat of loss of income or maybe through some form of administrative measure such as very high health insurance rates for those who have been caught.

So sleeping around would be treated as smoking tobacco. Big deal, smokers still smoke. Even when abortion is available, promiscuity increases risk of an STI and injuries. My only issue is the surveillance technology that will allow insurance companies easily spy on us, but digital spying is an issue regardless of any policy.

https://www.healthcaredive.com/news/texas-sues-hhs-emergency-abortion-attorney-general/627361/

The Attorney General of Texass is suing the Department of Health and Human Services over their attempts to require hospitals to perform abortions regardless of the ban in cases of medical emergencies such as miscarriages and ectopic pregnancies.

According to the attorney general, this is an attempt to exploit a federal law to “transform every emergency room in the country into a walk-in abortion clinic.” I wish it could hurt to be this stupid.

Yes because women choose to have septic miscarriages and ruptured fallopian tubes for funsies. Though I wonder if this law could be exploited in good ways - if abortions can be performed in emergency life-saving situations, could a woman go to the ER and say either you abort this pregnancy or I will kill myself? Would that make the abortion life-saving?

I know plenty of people who work in hospitals are fuming over the abortion ban and would likely be willing to see what loopholes could help a woman abort in a state where it is otherwise banned.

yes, they are practically on the edge of the border patrols! I WISH I had copied an article I read on the net about a woman not being allowed to cross into Canada (by the US officials at the border) until she was cross-examined about whether she might be preggers!!

I see women to be rounded up into breeder farms. It will soon be illegal to be female in the USA.

+++++++++++++

Passive Aggressive
Master Of Anti-brat
Excuses!

It looks like comparisons to Gilead (from The Handmaid's Tale) may be going mainstream. I was watching the PBS Newshour last night and heard Jonathan Capehart, Associate Editor of The Washington Post, compare the recent SCOTUS rulings and subsequent actions by Red State legislatures to Gilead, as he had watched some episodes from the recent TV series "The Handmaid's Tale," and spoke about it at length during the show's weekly political wrapup segment with David Brooks, a somewhat conservative columnist for the New York Times.

oh! The article about the woman being cross examined about pregnancy is right here in this forum! Duh!

In their zeal to be extremely 'pro-life,' they'll end up killing more then they'll save. If hospitals are so intimidated by these people and the threat of lawsuits that they feel like they have to wait until the pregnant woman (or girl) is at death's door, how many will die from a hospital's or doctor's reluctance? It's going to be a lot.

Two for one deal on fatalities. Both mother and fetus die, not just fetus.

It makes me think that this 'pro-life' thing is going to backfire on the people who espouse it. Unlike many of the old timers that had pushed Roe, they were not there to see what restricting or banning abortion could bring. Many people knew (or know about) a woman or girl that had died from a botched abortion or had a baby with a condition incompatible with life.

Once women start dying, people will get angry. They won't be some stranger, but wives, mothers, daughters, aunts, nieces and friends. Coworkers, that friendly face at the counter, your horse riding instructor or a painter whose paintings you like.

It's going to get ugly.

It's like dealing with idiot clients - they think they know what's right and swear up and down that it MUST be their way and no other way, no matter how much you explain that it won't work and it's a bad idea. They don't want to hear any other opinions because theirs is clearly correct. So you have no choice but to do it their way and let it turn into an absolute dumpster fire and hope that they see for themselves how huge of a mistake it is. And you hope they understand they were dumb and make the more rational choice when they see how terribly the original decision turned out.

The only bad thing with this comparison is what's already been described already: the only way for people to see how awful this all is is for them to see the carnage first hand - losing female loved ones to treatable pregnancy complications because a clump of cells has more rights than a sentient woman/girl.

Or maybe they won't. Look how people treated COVID - everyone was told what to do and how to stay safe (isolating, vaccines) and so, so many people shirked that advice because "it's just a cold!" or "vaccines cause autism!" or they just didn't care. Then when everyone started dying from it, survivors screamed about why isn't anyone doing anything to stop all this and why didn't anyone tell them it was that bad??!?

If you are in favor of someone dying for any reason, you are NOT pro-life. Anyone who supports the overturning of Roe is in favor of death because the loss of abortion rights will sound the death knell for many women and girls.

"It's like dealing with idiot clients - they think they know what's right and swear up and down that it MUST be their way and no other way, no matter how much you explain that it won't work and it's a bad idea. They don't want to hear any other opinions because theirs is clearly correct. So you have no choice but to do it their way and let it turn into an absolute dumpster fire and hope that they see for themselves how huge of a mistake it is. And you hope they understand they were dumb and make the more rational choice when they see how terribly the original decision turned out"

I remember watching a thing on tv about terrorists who took over a plane and demanded the pilots take them to wherever it was. The pilot attempted to inform them that they only had so much fuel, but of course they insisted on the course. The plane fell into the ocean and that was that.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/arizona-man-suing-clinic-provided-193627099.html

Translation. Abusive manipulator lost control of his third wife who realized what a manipulative loser he really is and aborted hitting the road. Guy is pissed that she cut a permanent connection with him as control is only way any woman would stay with this a-hole. Uses the idea of "loss of fatherhood" to make it look she is the bad guy in all this.

Imagine having to go to these lengths to hang on to wife #3.

I'm surprised he's not also suing his ex-wife for aborting without his express consent. If abortion does regain some legal availability, I imagine this could open the door to requiring women to get written consent from the father of the fetus to terminate, and I know plenty of men will not give that consent because they won't want the woman eliminating the little ball and chain that keeps her shackled to him physically, legally and financially.

The woman said they weren't happy and were discussing divorce, so it was senseless to bring a kid into a situation where the parents could not provide it with a loving and stable relationship.

Some men are very weirdly angered by women aborting pregnancies caused by them. Like how dare this cow NOT be honored to carry my precious seed! I don't intend to take care of it or help pay for it or be involved in its life, but HOW DARE SHE MURDER MY SON!1! Because they always assume it's a male, and if they learn it was female, they often care a little less.

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The clinic did not obtain her "informed consent because they did not tell her of the immediate and long-term medical risks associated with abortion that a reasonable patient would consider material, including the loss of the intense and emotionally satisfying maternal bond and relationship inherent in birthing and raising that child," the lawsuit says.

How about the long-term medical risks of giving birth? Uterine rupture, hemorrhage, various kinds of prolapses, pelvic floor dysfunction, incontinence, and about 500 other possible complications? There are no long-term risks associated with abortion, especially medical abortion. There are a couple short-term risks - bleeding too heavily, blood clots, infection and retaining fetal tissue that must be surgically removed. But abortion of any kind doesn't impact a woman's long-term reproductive well-being or even her ability to get pregnant again. I'm guessing the Duh's attorney must also be a man with zero understanding of human female anatomy.

And how exactly does this shit stain know that giving birth and raising a child would be "intense and emotionally satisfying?" How long has he been a woman? How many children has he birthed and raised? My guess is being a mother is not on his resume, so how the fuck would he know how his wife would feel about being a mother, or any woman? I can't believe he found someone to represent him because this shit is so stupid.

How could he prove it was his fetus? I'm not saying the woman was unfaithful, but it's not like they could do a paternity test. Couldn't she just say she's not sure the fetus was biologically his? I wonder if that would get the case thrown out. What a fucking waste of time this case is.

A woman who could have easily gotten a safe, 15-minute-long abortion to terminate a doomed pregnancy was forced to endure hours-long induced labor, lost a liter of blood after hemorrhaging during said labor and had to deal with the emotional trauma of being forced to give birth to a dead fetus. But hey, at least she didn't get an abortion, right??? Wouldn't want anybody killing any dead clumps, now would we?

https://www.insider.com/doctor-louisiana-abortion-ban-affidavit-patient-miscarriage-2022-7

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Doctor
"There is absolutely no medical basis for my patient, or any other patient in this state, to experience anything like this. This was the first time in my 15-year career that I could not give a patient the care they needed. This is a travesty."

Frankly I'm surprised they were even allowed to induce her because 16 weeks is earlier than the 20-week cutoff when fetuses can be minimally medically viable. I figured induced labor at 16 weeks would be considered abortion and she would have had to just carry around the dead fetal tissue for another month before being induced (if she didn't go septic and die first).

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Article
That wasn't Williams' only horror story. Her affidavit also described a patient who became pregnant despite using birth control and sought an abortion the weekend after the Supreme Court's decision came down.

"She told me that she hoped the pregnancy was ectopic so she could get treated in Louisiana, rather than having to leave the state," Williams said, referring to a pregnancy in which the fertilized egg implants outside the uterus and must be removed.

"It is horrific that patients are hoping to have a life-threatening health complication so that they can get appropriate care," Williams said.

It's even sadder to think that women in Louisiana are "fortunate" enough to be able to get abortions for ectopic pregnancies because plenty of places do not want to make exceptions for tubal pregnancies and would rather women just bleed out and die.

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Cambion

It's even sadder to think that women in Louisiana are "fortunate" enough to be able to get abortions for ectopic pregnancies because plenty of places do not want to make exceptions for tubal pregnancies and would rather women just bleed out and die.

To Republicans, women are nothing but farm animals. And because Republicans are basically sadistic, they have no concern about the pain of dying women and female children.

And they WILL fuck a sheep if the urge takes them.

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Passive Aggressive
Master Of Anti-brat
Excuses!

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/because-faith-walgreens-employees-allegedly-175926046.html

I guess Walgreens is denying BC and not selling condoms. People who have bought pregnancy tests are getting samples of formula in the mail. There is a call out to boycott Walgreens

https://www.yahoo.com/news/walgreens-cashier-wouldn-t-sell-211527218.html

A guy tried to buy condoms in a WI Walgreens and they stopped selling them, so he is getting a vasectomy

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cfdavep
https://www.yahoo.com/news/walgreens-cashier-wouldn-t-sell-211527218.html

A guy tried to buy condoms in a WI Walgreens and they stopped selling them, so he is getting a vasectomy

Very smart puppy, although a little late.

+++++++++++++

Passive Aggressive
Master Of Anti-brat
Excuses!

I've seen a few things come up in the media lately about more and more younger guys getting snipped and going on to describe the process to help dispel any fears surrounding it. I know there will always be the men who are too insecure to get snipped because they allow their fertility to define their masculinity, but I wonder if the Supreme Court thought there'd be men flocking to their doctors for vasectomies in response to killing Roe v. Wade. Who would have thought punishing women for being women would elicit a response from the gender who is expected to shoulder zero reproductive responsibility?

Good, I'm glad to see so many more guys taking responsibility for their sex lives. I don't care if someone like to have sex with tons of people or they're monogamous or anything in between, but in the words of Carlin, not every ejaculation deserves a name.

Meanwhile, it'll still be nearly impossible for unchilded women to get sterilized because You Might Change Your Mind^TM. Funny how a 20-year-old man who is probably still doing dumb shit with his buddies like jumping head-first off bridges into frozen rivers is mature enough to make a permanent reproductive decision, but a 39-year-old woman with a career and a stable life and a mile-long list of reasons she doesn't want kids is just a dumb little girl who doesn't know what she really wants (and somehow, doctors all magically know what she really wants is babbies).