response

my twin brother and i were two of five children that my prostitute mother threw away. i have never seen my siblings except for my twin.
we were put into an orphanage and lived there for twelve years which is considered to be an extremely long time considering we weren't really orphans, but then, neither were the 150+ kids there either.
you might think i would never want to have kids, but really, it was the only thing i ever wanted in life.
imagine you were forced to live with say, oh, i don't know, let's say 3-4 children, even though you NEVER wanted, or planned to have them. a lifetime sentence. same thing here. you believe you're entitled to be cf? (does God OWE you something?) i just found this website today. i never would have believed something like this existed, if i had not seen it myself. no attacking here, my friend.....i have been married 17 years to the same man with no previous fooling around on either side...we have three boys. we still hold hands. i stay home with the kids, it was both of our decisions' for me to stay home. my husband works for an honest living.
when my husband isn't working, he is with us.
i don't send my kids to public or any other school and expect the american tax dollars to educate them. i educate them MYSELF,with the money that the boys and i earn selling cookies or odd jobs.
(I purposely am not always using caps because of debilitating pain) the result? they are so far ahead, i couldn't put them in school if i wanted to. and i don't want to. they get their socialization from the many friends that are constantly coming over to visit them. this "fambly" does not at all resemble what i am reading about on your site....we don't complain how hard things are, even when it is hard. life is hard even without children. people complain about life being hard and ask for handouts even when they don't have children. from what i've seen on these posts, i'm actually glad none of you people have children. it doesn't sound very much like cf is a lifestyle choice to you, but more like you hate children with all the nasty names you can think of to call them, when they are totally innocent and have done you no harm. sure, they have annoyed you, irritated you in public, that is a result of poor parenting. bad behavior is a result of bad parenting, but it isn't the child's fault, and when you degrade children by flaunting your decision to be cf, and ranting about every incident of poor behavior, you only instill in people (adults and children) a sense that you are more important, or better,
because you decided not to have children and they did. Nothing could be further from the truth. It's nothing more than blowing out the candle of others so that yours may burn brighter. My five year old can see through that.

first of all, there are parents not breeders, and you fall into that category, they do the best they can and bring up decent kids..

now apart from that, there are so many badly behaved kids, taught by bad parents, these are the ones that annoy us, this is the site where we get our anger out, so we dont go round murdering the little monsters..

you are making judgements about us from what we read, some of us most dont mind kids,

but how dare you judge us, this is a site for those cf people, there is nothing for you here.. so why dont u go back to your "perfect ickle " fambly.. 17 years how do u know he hasnt strayed, are you with him 24 hours a day, would he tell you.. get a clue woman..

you dont send kids to public school, ok, but you get child welfare, you get all sorts of bonuses, like tax breaks, or ur hard working hubbie does (sometimes).. you are claiming you are better coz you, are a stay at home moo, how come your duhd hasnt stayed at home and u went out to work, eh..

i am not your friend, you have a closed mind, to think we are all child haters, if you for one moment take your head out of your childs arse.. you will see out there there are kids murdering, killing, raping, taking drugs. and kids running wild, with no manners, and you wonder why we hate kids, and we hate self justifying women like you..

your visit here is only a publicity job for your "perfect" life, apparently you beleive your better coz u did something natural, better than a person who has decided either through personal reasons not to have kids, i know i would be the worst father coz i dont like kids.. what if one of your sons decides not to have kids.. would u say he was a loser. thats the reason why ur here not to discuss things with me, but to publicise that you are a selfish, (to the world) egotistical PERSON.

so go back to your perfect house with perfect kids, (if they were so perfect why are u looking for CF sites) and leave us to our lives

ACTUALLY,i found this website quite by accident because it is powered by the same mechanism as my pain foundation's phorum's website that i was having some problems with earlier, and i was looking for a way to solve the problem with PHORUM, and came across this website.....anyway, i am going away...as you wish....i have no desire to hang around here....there is no perfect family out there anywhere with or without children, mine included...i have been asked alot how i know whether or not my husband has cheated on me, suffice it to say that he could never lie to me....never could he look me in the eye and lie to me...he has tried with other issues, but he just can't do it...we are too close....i do not think that anyone there is going to go out and murder or molest children just because they choose to not have children...it's a choice that i wish some people would have thought of sooner rather than later...we waited four years, which nowadays is considered a long time....since my post i checked out the childfree? website, and i do respect the fact that some people are not just going out having kids, and are thinking about what kind parent they would be, etc...so i am offended when you say i am close-minded...i am very open-minded.....my children aren't perfect, i am not perfect, my husband isn't perfect, our family isn't perfect, no one on this earth is perfect....if you had seen one of our boys in the grocery store the other day, maybe you would have written about him on your website, but our kids are in training, they make mistakes, and i would hope that if someone catches them on a bad day, they wouldn't presume that that is their usual behavior, because we think they are pretty good kids,(not perfect), but we do the best we can, considering that we are like alot of parents out there with no role model or example before us and are "winging it".....here in alaska, we don't get any tax breaks...nor do we receive any kind of welfare...we did before when i was hit by a teenage driver at a red light at eight months pregnant and thrown into labor and the guy wouldnt help me or call an ambulance or anything, i had to go get help, and my car was totalled......then it caused alot of medical bills that was beyond my control....but that would of happened even if i wasn't pregnant......
it caused us to go bankrupt because of it and the medical bills are still not paid now and that was thirteen years and two days ago......
regards,
tammy

Tammy, why do we threaten you so much? Nobody is telling YOU what to do! If you want to have 3 kids, fine! Go ahead!

Why can't you RESPECT our choice not to have kids and not to want them? I admit the first part of your life story was interesting, but when you started attacking us in your first post, all my sympathy for you evaporated.

The fact that you came here a second time to attack us is pretty pathetic. Don't you have anything else to do than posting on CF sites and attacking people? I don't go to your favorite website and attack YOU!

Your gross generalizations about us are very offensive. Some CF people hate all kids. Some CF hate bratty kids. Some CF hate bad parents, whom we call "breeders" because they take no responsibility for their own kids once they're born. And some CF love kids, but just don't want any.

And what do you mean, you don't get any tax breaks because you live in Alaska? Alaska is part of the U.S.A., isn't it? Then you get FEDERAL tax breaks when you file your income taxes every year! You know, an IRS Form 1040, 1040A, 1040EZ? It's called a DEDUCTION per child! Any of this ringing a bell? If you don't know what any of that means, then maybe your husband can explain it to you.


Finally, what is the point of you complaining about your medical bills here? DO you expect us to feel sorry for you or have any sympathy for you after you came here and attacked us? We all have problems.

That agirl TROLL. Shit your opinion and leave. Who the fuck cares what you think anyway. YOU don't know any of us. Take your broom you have for making sweeping generalizations and shove them up your loose ass CUNT.

Usually I am very calm, cool, and collected, but since you have shown no real interest in understanding, and only want to vomit your hatred towards us, I will greet you in the same way.

FUCK OFF YOU DIMWITTED BITCH!

those who use so much profanity do so because of a limited vocabulary. as far as me *&^%$ my opinion and leaving, isn't that what you consistently do and what this website is made for? if you go to the irs, you can do away with your social security card altogether, of course you have to have an occupation making so little money like farming or some such, that it wouldn't make any difference to the irs if you didn't pay any income taxes, and it has to be an occupation that makes little to nothing. this can be done in tennessee and alaska, and for farming on small acreage, but i don't know about any other states or occupations. you must be careful about where you get your information as well, the irs won't give you this information on the phone. so no, my husband won't be explaining any tax breaks to me anytime soon.
after seeing so many kids thrown away while growing up, i am continually taking in 5-10 children on a regular basis, no questions asked. (against my doctor's advice). if i don't, no one else will, and our community will end up with a new generation of even worse children running around....but, when i go to the grocery store, i try to leave the older ones with as many of the younger ones at home as i can, because of all the dirty looks and harrassment i know i will be getting when i get to the store. people will come up and even ask "do they all have the same dad?" or "are they all yours?"...so i DO understand exactly where you guys are coming from with all the harrassment you have to continually deal with every day just for choosing to be cf....being cf i don't even think is a lifestyle, i believe it is something you ALREADY ARE....why would it be anyone else's business? i personally have never even thought about it or considered it, or have asked a friend when they will be having kids, unless i knew they wanted kids....
as far as if my son said he didn't want to have kids....my oldest son has stated repeatedly that he isn't going to have kids and doesn't want them...he wants to do other things with his life...i must admit that it did sting to hear that...i was looking forward to having grandkids after having to have a hysterectomy 1 and 1/2 yrs ago due to medical problems...we had tried to have another kid with no success, and couldn't bear the pain anymore....but, i respect my son't wish, i don't pressure him with my desire for him to have children. it's a personal choice. having children is a lifetime committment that even the best of parents are suprprised at the work. i would hate to live with the knowledge that i pressured him to have kids to satisfy my need to nuture a child and he had to live with it....so i respect his decision, and tell him even now, at 13, that if he doesn't want children, i understand and support him.
i will state again that i found this site by complete accident, it is powered my the same mechanism as my pain chat phorum that i was having problems with and i was trying to sort it all out, and came across it. so, i have never trolled a site ever in my life. you have a right to your opinion, but i also have a right to mine. but all i am saying, by reading the posts, like you said, i am making sweeping generalizations...well, there is nothing in the posts that ever says anything good about any parent or child out there anywhere....have any of you guys out there EVER seen a parent or child do anything RIGHT? ever? it just seems from reading the posts, that you guys hate children and the parents that bring them into this world no matter what. i didn't come on this site to complain about my medical bills or profess to be perfect....to the contrary, but to say that there are some of us, (be it few, yes, i admit) that DO try do raise their own and take in others that don't care at all about their own, that DON'T complain, that DON'T live on welfare, that DO educate their children on their own without anyone else's help, and that DON'T give their children free reign in public places, etc. the site does welcome raves as well as rants, but i don't see any raves....though i must admit myself there are few parents out there deserving of a rave when it comes to their children in public places....at least some of us without a role model or example and are having to "wing it" are making the best of it, is all i am saying.....seems like that should be worth at least something when so many mothers are out there dumping their kids on me, and then calling from their boyfriend's house a hundred miles away two weeks later to find out what junior wants for his birthday after we already had the birthday a week ago. look, i am not asking or looking for sympathy, just some respect, i look after MY kids, and others on top of that...we have only three bedrooms, but we should have ten....we don't get a thank-you, we don't get paid, we don't even get any money for their food or their clothing or the gas it takes to haul them around...their parents just figure that's what we are here for.....i don't complain because i was a throw away kid too...and i believe in GOD...he will not forget me, or these parents who are just having kids as if they are just nothing more than dogs...GOD says that "whoever shall offend one of these little ones...it would be better that he would have never been born"..that's just for OFFENDING,not abusing, abandoning, dumping them with someone else.....in the meantime, I would appreciate some open-mindedness with the cf's when they see me in the grocery store, i am not allowed by law to spank other people's children as i would my own, (like when jesse is running down the aisle like an idiot and i am calling after him to come back and people are staring at me thinking i am his mom), give us a break, i am doing the best i can with these kids, teaching them some respect and manners, so they won't grow up to be criminals and such, i don't like to be harrassed for "having so many kids" any more than you like to be harrassed for being cf

Tammy, you sound like a nice person, and because of that, I wouldn't post here anymore because you'll just get more verbal bashing.

Personally, I just come here for the trainwreckity goodness. I've never seen so much unbridled aggro in my life and it's a great freak show.

Tammy, your post is rambling, incoherent and tiresome. It makes my head hurt.

The FAQs are but a click away. It says volumes about you that you couldn't take time to read them before you posted. Nor are you interested in reading what anybody has to say about your posts. You are here to be hateful, and it isn't even interesting.

I'm a parent. May I post here?
A Yes and no. Because there are so few childfree sites, I want to make sure that this is another place for support and discussion for the childfree. []If you're going to bingo us, troll/flame, or tell us what a good parent you are, no you may not. [] If you do post here, try not to mention your parental status unless it is absolutely essential to your post/comment.

As best as I can tell, your badly-written posts say this: "I had a bad childhood. I am living through my children now to correct it. I am resentful as hell that some of you have chosen not to have kids. I'm going to tell you repeatedly what a good parent I am in the hope you will suck my ass and appreciate my great *sacrifices.*"

Why don't you go back to your parenting boards where you can get everyone to tell you what a good job you are doing. You'll get all the validation in the world there. You won't get it here.

You signed up to be a parent, now you can do it and Quitcher Bitchin'.

but if those kids parents who you take in were cf, or even decided to keep thier dicks in their pants, or even take birth control.. then they wouldnt be born and therefore they wouldnt need to be with you, and you wouldnt get the aggro..

having kids for the sake of having kids.. is stupid, there are millions in need of a good home, adopt them if you must..

its called self control. i dont want to bring a kid into a world like this, terrorists all over the place, people being forced to alter themselves to "FIT IN".. people actually killing themselves coz they are too fat.

if some people have some self control.. half of the problems now wouldnt happen.. (re reading your first or 2nd post you go out basically begging for money ok you make cookies. and stuff, but to me thats just plain (maybe with choc chip) begging.. are u licensed to sell stuff, do you have the health and safety in the workplace certificates.. i doubt it..

this site is about bratty kids.. we dont talk bout good ones as 1 they are few and far between, and 2, thats not what this site is about

this is a place where when we have the most awful day, like being woken up at 7 am, on a sunday, by 6 and 7 year old kids, kicking a football with their parents shouting kick the fucking ball son.. kill him, kick his ankles.. every weekend, i work during the week, but they have to kick the ball directly by the hedge in our garden, their parents urinating in the hedge..

so dont forgive me if i only moan about kids, i see, if i saw a site about how well behaved a kid was it would be rare for any of us here to put anything, coz nice kids are rare.. its selfish brats that run the country now.. i seriously wouldnt come back here, or you will find we are actually being pleasant in what we said before..i know i was

I knew the selfish cunt would be back.

And for you who is reading because of trainwrecky goodness, babycenter is a much better site for that.

I don't have a limited vocabulary, it just feels good to cuss out the stupid sometimes so I don't have to do IRL when I come across people like you.

The thing is, we ARE your CF neighbours, your CF coworkers, your CF best friends that you would think NEVER have a need to rant. Ha Ha! My friends IRL, say the same things about me. IF I didn't have a place that I could let loose, I would go crazy because there really ISN'T anyone who truly understands. I am really tired of parents demanding that we understand, make concessions for them, and basically shut up and put up with them. It is a two way street babe. Sure, you may be perfect, your kids may be perfect, but even if that little bit were true, 80% of the parents display breeder tendencies some of the time, and I would say about 60% of the childed population are outright breeders. NO OTHER segment of the population is it acceptable to be a controlling asshole, but if you have kids, you are "entitled".

I call bullshit on that. IF you can't understand, then move along. WE don't need your "support", your pat on the head, or your experience. Got that?

Sincerely,
anoon.

"there is nothing in the posts that ever says anything good about any parent or child out there anywhere....have any of you guys out there EVER seen a parent or child do anything RIGHT? ever?"

This is a RANT site. It is NOT a place to rave about kids or breeders, and if it were, you'd hear nothing but crickets chirping anyway.

"when so many mothers are out there dumping their kids on me, and then calling from their boyfriend's house a hundred miles away two weeks later to find out what junior wants for his birthday after we already had the birthday a week ago."

See, you're doing it too! This is exactly the kind of breeder behavior CFs rant about!

Why do you stick around here and take so much time to write such long posts? I don't get it, especially because one minute you seem to be understanding of the the CF choice but the next you resort to attacking us like any other breeder. Much of what you write is irrelevant to the CF/parent issue anyway. Weird.

***at least some of us without a role model or example and are having to "wing it" are making the best of it***

Interesting, because all I am hearing is how haard being a mother is. It all sounds very depressing and uninspiring. Tammy, for all of your longwinded posts, you sound very, very TIRED.
I don't hear about the joy, the inspiration, the love you give and receive from your family. Where is your energy and passion for life?
I hear parents say over and over how's it's worth it, then offer up nothing to prove it. They talk about sacrifice and having to stay home, put off travel, exercising, going out to eat, having meaningful conversations, etc.
No verve, no light, no inspiration. The walking dead.

Tammy has the biggest case of Martyr syndrome that I have ever seen. Look at me! Look what I am doing! I had a shitty life, and now I have made it my life passion to do the work of GAWD, and take care of everyone else's crotch droppings. It is so hard. Nobody thanks me. Blah fucking blah blah blah. SOunds so incredibly altruistic no? GMAB Tammy.

How very clever to pull a sentence or two out of context and use it to your advantage to serve your "purpose". That's exactly how cults like those of Charles Manson and Rev. Moon got started and thrived. Seems that most of you will spew hate like a volcano when anyone disagrees with you, and are determined to get even with your words if it's the last thing you do. The last thing you will do is stand in judgement of the living God along side all the parents and child-free, without any titles of any kind, whether you believe it now or not. You will be judged for every deed and every word. On- that note, some of you will have hell to pay, and eternity to think about it. And WE won't even remember YOU.
Respond with all the bashing you want, we won't be back to see it.

You won't be back to read it? Sure you will, just like your wife was and then she sicked you on us. So funny that you want to talk about Cults and judgement. Like I said, you know NOTHING about any of us so take your high horse and keep on riding.


**Sung to the tune of Tracy Chapman's Fast Car**

I emailed Space Cowgirl to notify her about the latest attack of the trolls. Hopefully she'll come back here and ban Tammy & Joseph soon, so we don't have to put up with their crap anymore.

Just for the record, I don't get Joseph's cult analogy. The two cults he mentioned had charismatic leaders with very strong personalities who basically told everyone what to do. The CF movement has no such people. I can't even think of any CFers known to our entire community besides Jerry of NK and Turtle, and neither one of them ever acted in such a role. So what the hell is this guy talking about? Why are we a cult? We have no leaders, we have no rituals, we have no rules we follow, we have no cult headquarters, we have nothing that a cult has!

Joseph Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> How very clever to pull a sentence or two out of
> context and use it to your advantage to serve your
> "purpose".


Geez, Joseph! It's not like we have a choice! Your illiterate wife Tammy just rambles on and on and on with no sentence structure or punctuation breaks, poor syntax, bad spelling, and lousy grammar.

Who has the TIME to respond to every single nutty thing she says? And what do you mean by "out of context" anyway? What is the context you refer to? The context is that you two are Fundie Xtian CF-haters who are posting here to harrass us. So in that context, we take nothing out of context.

I usually don't even waste my time on people who only want to see one side of the CF lifestyle, but sometimes you just like to sharpen your claws on a hapless troll.

If you guys are still lurking, and I know you are, and if you are really interested in understanding, there are several websites devoted to CF support. I recommend staying away from here, ascf (most hard core) because they are basically only for RANTING. You could check out ezcf, but you are only allowed to lurk, not post, but do check out the variety of forums they have, NOT just the rants, to get a better feel. If you feel compelled to interact with the CF in a coherant, and mannerly way, there is Tanglewood. There you will be surprised to see parents and Childfree getting along very well even through some hardcore debates. Who knows, you just might open your mind a little more and learn something about yourself, and the big wide world around you. Trolling will not be tolerated at Tanglewood either though, so if you can't come in with guns ablazing, then please refrain.

argh, argh, a god botherer, i really dislike their holier than thou attitudes,

the living god isnt that mentioned in Psalms 84:1-2 RSV

yes i have studied the bible, and i can out bible you m8..if god didnt want us to be CF, with your argument, he wouldnt allow it, so since he does.. then tada.. we are doing what we are doing with gods favour.. so yah book sucks to you..

i think they may be lutherans..

I am not going to go into why or why not.. you posted why you have kids, you've done an excellent job in raising them.
If you do post again, I would recommend using the 'enter' key to create paragraphs. makes your missives a tad more readable.
Also, why are you so stung that one of your kids decided not to want kids? The classic response.. you want grand babiess.. That is what angers a lot of cf'rs who are subjected to the same kind of pressures. Maybe you don't think you are but I'm sure there will be constant subtle little hints and suggestions, (escalations??).. Ultimately you have other kids, why the focus on this one??
You mention other people dumping their kids on you.. Maybe YOUR child is tired of having your attention distracted by all these 'dumps'. That may very well be the reasons he doesn't want kids.. over exposure to these throw outs.
On the other hand, you are to be commended to try and help them out. Unless, however, there is some sort of legal reason for them being there (foster care, written agreements signed by lawyers) you may very well be opening yourself to all sorts of horrors. If the little whores that produced these throw away children are of the moral fibre you hint at, they very well could manufacture false and phony charges of abuse, molestation, etc.
Finally, most of us became child free because of over exposure to kids, watching the family interactions of parents and children which seldom jive with the propaganda of 'glorius parenthood' and 'innocent children'.
For one, I have rarely been criticised for my decision. Very rarely. Some people, for whatever reason, are hounded unmercifully by relatives, other parents caught up in 'the baby trap', and commercial society which demands children, so they can sell all sorts of baby products ad nauseum.
I do wish some of the language around here could improve, but it does tend to be the reaction of people who would like to be assured of some places not over run by children.

two cents ¢¢

Reply Quote

You all are so mean that she had to get her husband to come and let us know about the wrath of his made up god? Well, scary scary...aren't we scary.

One question, why the hell is she complaining about taking in these foster kids? Is someone forcing her to? As far as I know, not one single state in the US requires you to take in 10 foster kids.

"The last thing you will do is stand in judgement of the living God along side all the parents and child-free, without any titles of any kind, whether you believe it now or not. You will be judged for every deed and every word. On- that note, some of you will have hell to pay, and eternity to think about it. And WE won't even remember YOU."


Yeah, I can see Jesus saying that to someone. Maybe someone should tell Mr. and Mrs. Good Christian that pride is one of the seven deadly sins.

isnt it my god is a compassionate god too.. so he wouldnt let u burn in the fires of hell coz he is compassionate

Tammy, this is NOT the place for parenting advocacy or stating your point about your bad childhood or why you chose to have kids or to blast the CF or whatever your reason is for being here. I suggest you go on google.com and seek out other sites that are more appropriate for you. Here are some quick links for you to click on:

http://www.babycenter.com
http://www.parenting.com
http://www.annegeddes.com

Please leave us alone. Thank you.

It never ceases to amaze me how breeders keep butting in on childfree message boards.

Kinda like, for example, Harry Potter haters who go around flaming HP fans. Or fan1 sees that fan2 dares to like a character on a tv show or movie that fan1 hates, so fan1 starts a flame war.

Really childish.

Oh, and Joseph? For all of your talk about cults, you seem to fail to realise that breederism can be considered a cult. You're rather quick to slander us and preach the conformity of popping kids out. Gee, isn't that what cults do?