Home
>
The Living Room
>
Topic
Hypocritical religious leader
Posted by mercurior
|
Hypocritical religious leader February 19, 2008 | Registered: 19 years ago Posts: 4,402 |
We have a sort of pick n mix, of catholicism. We dont have to follow every word some out of touch pope says, and a lot of us dont. So we are not all like the Negative idea of catholics as some like to portray us. But as an individual he is a stupid idiot. (i do have to ask why the women involved chose to have sex without protection not that i am totally blaming them i blame both equally. more him than the women.) everyday Normal catholics just nod and ignore what is said by priests and popes, its only the new ones the reborn catholics that are so stupid (or the ones who have the power to preach stupidity). the Most radical of all are the Newly converted.
as i say again, most catholics dont follow every word vomited from the pope, so dont blame all catholics when its a minority who "beleive".
he is a hypocrite, i admit that, and he shouldnt be spouting the church line if he didnt beleive, or if he did beleive he shouldnt have did what he did. (he spouts this crap because it was his job and he got paid for it so he spuots it)
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=515997&in_page_id=1770
I'm not an abortion hypocrite, insists Catholic adviser accused by girlfriends
By BETH HALE - More by this author »
Last updated at 00:06am on 19th February 2008
Denial: Austen Ivereigh yesterday
The former spokesman for the leader of the Roman Catholic Church in England yesterday denied being a hypocrite who, having made two girlfriends pregnant, "drove them to consider abortion".
Austen Ivereigh, once one of Cardinal Cormac Murphy-O'Connor's closest advisers, was a post-graduate student in Oxford in 1989 when the first of the women became pregnant.
She told the Daily Mail two years ago how Mr Ivereigh, now 41, "manoeuvred" her into a position where she had no choice but to abort their baby.
The ex-girlfriend told the Mail in a 2006 article read out in the High Court yesterday: "This man is a hypocrite. He can't condemn abortion, and the women who have an abortion, but then get women pregnant and absolve himself of any responsibility to support them or their child."
More recently, while working as head of public affairs for the cardinal, Mr Ivereigh got another girlfriend pregnant with twins.
This woman was contemplating abortion and, after their relationship floundered, she suffered a miscarriage, the court was told.
Speaking in court on the first day of a libel case against Associated Newspapers, publishers of the Daily Mail, Mr Ivereigh - a practising Catholic - fiercely denied he had been hypocritical.
With both women sitting in court, his lawyer Ronald Thwaites QC told the jury that there were some women who "bitterly regretted" having an abortion and "seek to blame others for what was their decision".
He added: "That may be a factor you find was present in this case, you must await the evidence."
Mr Ivereigh - who admitted to struggling with church teaching against sex before marriage - claims he lost his job as head of public affairs because of the Mail article.
Mr Thwaites said the story had robbed Mr Ivereigh of his moral authority, destroyed his credibility and ruined his reputation.
"It falsely alleged that he was a hypocrite for not practising what he preached in relation to the issue of abortion," he said.
He added that Catholics would have read into it that Mr Ivereigh - who admitted paying half of the cost of his girlfriend's abortion - was guilty of procuring an abortion and should be excommunicated.
"For this man few things could be more serious or devastating than that," he told Mr Justice Eady.
Mr Thwaites said that when the first woman became pregnant they were prepared to have the baby, but did not want to marry.
At the heart of the libel action are the words of the former girlfriend, who told the Mail in 2006: "I wanted to keep the baby. I hoped Austen and I would get married.
"But he made it clear that he would not support me and would play no part in the child's upbringing.
"I was devastated. He manoeuvred me into a position where I felt I had no choice but to have a termination."
Yesterday Mr Ivereigh said: "I found it very hard to believe she was saying this."
He had been "utterly opposed" to the abortion and had offered support. Despite his grief, he supported her after the termination, he said.
In 2005 he began a relationship with a divorcee with two children - named as Miss X in court.
Mr Ivereigh proposed when she became pregnant, the court heard. He said: "I believed this was really God saying to me - come on, time for marriage, time for commitment."
But "problems arose" and he felt he could not marry her.
He insisted he had offered to help in any way possible with the twins. But Mr Ivereigh claimed she told him "you have left me with no choice but to have an abortion".
He said that after he had sent Miss X a letter offering help and saying his family would bring up the twins, he rang her to ask if he could know when the abortion was happening.
He choked with emotion as he told the jury: "She said 'What? So you can get on your knees and beg for mercy like the hypocrite that you are'."
He added: "She had obviously dismissed my letter. I was determined to fight for those children."
Mark Warby QC, for Associated Newspapers, said the first woman had accused Mr Ivereigh of failing to support her, acting hypocritically and that drove her to consider an abortion.
He added: "Miss X says you didn't offer her any practical or realistic support and she said it at the time.
"She says you forced her into considering an abortion . . . She has accused you of being a hypocrite."
Mr Ivereigh denied having "vindictive feelings" towards both women.
He agreed that it was a sin in the eyes of the church to have sex outside marriage, but denied being hypocritical, saying: "This is one area of church teaching that I have always struggled with and failed to live out. It doesn't mean I don't believe it."
The hearing continues.
*********************************************************************************************************************************
I just post the stories, for interest.. for everyone
Lord, what fools these mortals be!
- A Midsummer Night’s Dream, Act III, Scene ii
Voltaire said: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
H.L.Mencken wrote:"The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.â€
Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. Albert Einstein
as i say again, most catholics dont follow every word vomited from the pope, so dont blame all catholics when its a minority who "beleive".
he is a hypocrite, i admit that, and he shouldnt be spouting the church line if he didnt beleive, or if he did beleive he shouldnt have did what he did. (he spouts this crap because it was his job and he got paid for it so he spuots it)
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=515997&in_page_id=1770
I'm not an abortion hypocrite, insists Catholic adviser accused by girlfriends
By BETH HALE - More by this author »
Last updated at 00:06am on 19th February 2008
Denial: Austen Ivereigh yesterday
The former spokesman for the leader of the Roman Catholic Church in England yesterday denied being a hypocrite who, having made two girlfriends pregnant, "drove them to consider abortion".
Austen Ivereigh, once one of Cardinal Cormac Murphy-O'Connor's closest advisers, was a post-graduate student in Oxford in 1989 when the first of the women became pregnant.
She told the Daily Mail two years ago how Mr Ivereigh, now 41, "manoeuvred" her into a position where she had no choice but to abort their baby.
The ex-girlfriend told the Mail in a 2006 article read out in the High Court yesterday: "This man is a hypocrite. He can't condemn abortion, and the women who have an abortion, but then get women pregnant and absolve himself of any responsibility to support them or their child."
More recently, while working as head of public affairs for the cardinal, Mr Ivereigh got another girlfriend pregnant with twins.
This woman was contemplating abortion and, after their relationship floundered, she suffered a miscarriage, the court was told.
Speaking in court on the first day of a libel case against Associated Newspapers, publishers of the Daily Mail, Mr Ivereigh - a practising Catholic - fiercely denied he had been hypocritical.
With both women sitting in court, his lawyer Ronald Thwaites QC told the jury that there were some women who "bitterly regretted" having an abortion and "seek to blame others for what was their decision".
He added: "That may be a factor you find was present in this case, you must await the evidence."
Mr Ivereigh - who admitted to struggling with church teaching against sex before marriage - claims he lost his job as head of public affairs because of the Mail article.
Mr Thwaites said the story had robbed Mr Ivereigh of his moral authority, destroyed his credibility and ruined his reputation.
"It falsely alleged that he was a hypocrite for not practising what he preached in relation to the issue of abortion," he said.
He added that Catholics would have read into it that Mr Ivereigh - who admitted paying half of the cost of his girlfriend's abortion - was guilty of procuring an abortion and should be excommunicated.
"For this man few things could be more serious or devastating than that," he told Mr Justice Eady.
Mr Thwaites said that when the first woman became pregnant they were prepared to have the baby, but did not want to marry.
At the heart of the libel action are the words of the former girlfriend, who told the Mail in 2006: "I wanted to keep the baby. I hoped Austen and I would get married.
"But he made it clear that he would not support me and would play no part in the child's upbringing.
"I was devastated. He manoeuvred me into a position where I felt I had no choice but to have a termination."
Yesterday Mr Ivereigh said: "I found it very hard to believe she was saying this."
He had been "utterly opposed" to the abortion and had offered support. Despite his grief, he supported her after the termination, he said.
In 2005 he began a relationship with a divorcee with two children - named as Miss X in court.
Mr Ivereigh proposed when she became pregnant, the court heard. He said: "I believed this was really God saying to me - come on, time for marriage, time for commitment."
But "problems arose" and he felt he could not marry her.
He insisted he had offered to help in any way possible with the twins. But Mr Ivereigh claimed she told him "you have left me with no choice but to have an abortion".
He said that after he had sent Miss X a letter offering help and saying his family would bring up the twins, he rang her to ask if he could know when the abortion was happening.
He choked with emotion as he told the jury: "She said 'What? So you can get on your knees and beg for mercy like the hypocrite that you are'."
He added: "She had obviously dismissed my letter. I was determined to fight for those children."
Mark Warby QC, for Associated Newspapers, said the first woman had accused Mr Ivereigh of failing to support her, acting hypocritically and that drove her to consider an abortion.
He added: "Miss X says you didn't offer her any practical or realistic support and she said it at the time.
"She says you forced her into considering an abortion . . . She has accused you of being a hypocrite."
Mr Ivereigh denied having "vindictive feelings" towards both women.
He agreed that it was a sin in the eyes of the church to have sex outside marriage, but denied being hypocritical, saying: "This is one area of church teaching that I have always struggled with and failed to live out. It doesn't mean I don't believe it."
The hearing continues.
*********************************************************************************************************************************
I just post the stories, for interest.. for everyone
Lord, what fools these mortals be!
- A Midsummer Night’s Dream, Act III, Scene ii
Voltaire said: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
H.L.Mencken wrote:"The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.â€
Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. Albert Einstein
|
Re: Hypocritical religious leader February 19, 2008 | Registered: 19 years ago Posts: 4,402 |
same story from another newspaper
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2008/02/19/nabort119.xml
Cardinal's aide cast as a 'cad' in abortion row
By Caroline Gammell
Last Updated: 12:30am GMT 19/02/2008
A senior aide to the head of England's Catholic Church was portrayed as a "man without honour" after being accused of putting pressure on a former girlfriend to have an abortion, the High Court heard on Monday.
Austen Ivereigh, 41, was left "maligned, misrepresented and humiliated" by press allegations that he had ''manoeuvred" one former girlfriend to have a termination and then failed to support another partner when she became pregnant.
He launched a libel action against the Daily Mail after claiming the newspaper had made him out to be a ''cad" and "seriously defamed" him by twisting the events of his past in an article in June 2006.
Mr Ivereigh, the director of public affairs for Cardinal Cormac Murphy-O'Connor, the head of the Roman Catholic church in England and Wales, resigned from his £46,000-a-year post a month after the story was printed.
The article, which coincided with the archbishop's bid to get the Government to reduce the abortion limit from 24 to 20 weeks, distorted the facts "out of all recognition", the court heard.
Ronald Thwaites QC, representing Mr Ivereigh, said his client had been "humiliated, misrepresented, maligned, ridiculed and exposed to contempt". He said the practising Catholic was strongly opposed to abortion.
The barrister told the jury that the Daily Mail, part of Associated Newspapers Ltd, still maintained that the story was true. Mr Thwaites said: ''As a result of that article, we say, he lost his job."
The court heard Mr Ivereigh had a girlfriend at university who became pregnant six weeks into their relationship in 1989 and went on to have a termination.
Two years ago, his then girlfriend - known only as Madame X - also discovered she was pregnant, this time with twins. There was talk of abortion, but she miscarried both babies, the court heard.
In June 2006 the Daily Mail published an article based on an interview with Mr Ivereigh's girlfriend at Oxford University. She was quoted saying he had left her with "no choice" but to have an abortion.
The article also referred to his more recent relationship with divorcee Madame X, stating he had not supported her and that she had miscarried shortly afterwards.
Mr Thwaites said the newspaper had presented Mr Ivereigh as a "man without honour".
Giving evidence on Monday, Mr Ivereigh insisted he had never been in favour of abortion. Although he did not want to marry the girl from university, he said he had offered to stand by her.
Mr Thwaites said: "Is there any truth in the suggestion that you manoeuvred her into having an abortion? "Absolutely not," he replied.
"You forced her into having an abortion?" asked Mr Thwaites. "I was utterly opposed to it," Mr Ivereigh said.
He added: "When I saw the article, I was just horrified, astonished. My blood froze."
The trial continues.
*********************************************************************************************************************************
I just post the stories, for interest.. for everyone
Lord, what fools these mortals be!
- A Midsummer Night’s Dream, Act III, Scene ii
Voltaire said: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
H.L.Mencken wrote:"The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.â€
Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. Albert Einstein
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2008/02/19/nabort119.xml
Cardinal's aide cast as a 'cad' in abortion row
By Caroline Gammell
Last Updated: 12:30am GMT 19/02/2008
A senior aide to the head of England's Catholic Church was portrayed as a "man without honour" after being accused of putting pressure on a former girlfriend to have an abortion, the High Court heard on Monday.
Austen Ivereigh, 41, was left "maligned, misrepresented and humiliated" by press allegations that he had ''manoeuvred" one former girlfriend to have a termination and then failed to support another partner when she became pregnant.
He launched a libel action against the Daily Mail after claiming the newspaper had made him out to be a ''cad" and "seriously defamed" him by twisting the events of his past in an article in June 2006.
Mr Ivereigh, the director of public affairs for Cardinal Cormac Murphy-O'Connor, the head of the Roman Catholic church in England and Wales, resigned from his £46,000-a-year post a month after the story was printed.
The article, which coincided with the archbishop's bid to get the Government to reduce the abortion limit from 24 to 20 weeks, distorted the facts "out of all recognition", the court heard.
Ronald Thwaites QC, representing Mr Ivereigh, said his client had been "humiliated, misrepresented, maligned, ridiculed and exposed to contempt". He said the practising Catholic was strongly opposed to abortion.
The barrister told the jury that the Daily Mail, part of Associated Newspapers Ltd, still maintained that the story was true. Mr Thwaites said: ''As a result of that article, we say, he lost his job."
The court heard Mr Ivereigh had a girlfriend at university who became pregnant six weeks into their relationship in 1989 and went on to have a termination.
Two years ago, his then girlfriend - known only as Madame X - also discovered she was pregnant, this time with twins. There was talk of abortion, but she miscarried both babies, the court heard.
In June 2006 the Daily Mail published an article based on an interview with Mr Ivereigh's girlfriend at Oxford University. She was quoted saying he had left her with "no choice" but to have an abortion.
The article also referred to his more recent relationship with divorcee Madame X, stating he had not supported her and that she had miscarried shortly afterwards.
Mr Thwaites said the newspaper had presented Mr Ivereigh as a "man without honour".
Giving evidence on Monday, Mr Ivereigh insisted he had never been in favour of abortion. Although he did not want to marry the girl from university, he said he had offered to stand by her.
Mr Thwaites said: "Is there any truth in the suggestion that you manoeuvred her into having an abortion? "Absolutely not," he replied.
"You forced her into having an abortion?" asked Mr Thwaites. "I was utterly opposed to it," Mr Ivereigh said.
He added: "When I saw the article, I was just horrified, astonished. My blood froze."
The trial continues.
*********************************************************************************************************************************
I just post the stories, for interest.. for everyone
Lord, what fools these mortals be!
- A Midsummer Night’s Dream, Act III, Scene ii
Voltaire said: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
H.L.Mencken wrote:"The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.â€
Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. Albert Einstein
Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.