Will YOU die alone?

"You'll die alone" is probably one of my favorite bingos. It's just so patently ridiculous, I'm always amazed when people utter it in the hopes that I will suddenly pop out a kyd just so I won't "die alone". And we hear it everywhere from people we know and even from those we don't. I was surfing through articles about childless and childfree (I have Google set up to email me when new articles with these keywords are published) and found an example of this bingo:

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What should I do if after 3 years my boyfriend is not ready to make plans for future?

You want marriage, you want children and if he's not going to do this for you, then you can find it with someone else.
It wouldn't hurt to tell him he'll probably "die alone" when you leave this time...

Well, I hope the lady who posted the question high tails it to the sperm bank!

Now we all know that having kids doesn't guarantee that you'll have someone to take care of you when you need it. Money does, lol! But seriously, kids aren't the only people who can be there for you when you need it. That's why it's more likely IMO that we, the childfree, will have someone to take care of us in our old age. For example, in addition to my enormous family, I also have lots of close friends who have already been there for me when I desperately needed them to be. And we all know that many breeders will toss their friends and other family by the wayside when the kids come along. And how do those kids repay that dedication in their parents' old age? Usually by putting them in a nursing home and becoming "too busy" to visit.

So what about the childfree people who don't have close friends (people you could call on without feeling you're imposing on them) or are too shy to socialize? Well, check out the Caring Collaborative article in the NYT:

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Well, while some of us have been worrying, others are working to create a community-based model for people, particularly those who live alone, to band together and take care of each other. It’s called the Caring Collaborative, piloted in New York City last fall with plans for replication, and it’s the latest innovative project of The Transition Network, a membership organization of 5,000 women crossing the Rubicon from careers to retirement and from youth to old age.

-snip-

Reluctance to ask for favors, according to many fiercely independent people, whether they live alone or with a partner, is the biggest obstacle to getting help when they need it. But the experience of caring for elderly parents, in a health care system that counts on a huge cadre of family caregivers, makes them open and eager for a solution that accounts for their particular life experience.

A few years back, after a diagnosis of thyroid cancer, surgery and unexpected complications, one of T.T.N.’s founders, 73-year-old Charlotte Frank, a former executive at The Port Authority of New York and New Jersey, had friends step forward to pick up her prescriptions, accompany her to doctors’ appointments, put casseroles in her freezer and drop off smoothies. But, Ms. Frank said, “if I had had to ask for help it would have been difficult.” At around the same time another Transition Network member had her own health scare, breaking a leg and lying in bed without help for 24 hours rather than bother her daughter or her neighbors.

Cool, yes?! I think this is awesome. I want to get involved and I haven't felt that way since I volunteered at a hospital about 10 years ago. I just wish I lived in NYC so I could start now. I'm going to send this link to our local news blog and see if the editor knows of anyone who'd be interested in setting this type of thing up where I live.

And PS - Happy New Year!

Yeah I wouldn't mind getting in on this myself. I think it's great!

I don't think I have to worry about dying alone. I have a very devoted husband I KNOW will be there for me when the time comes. If I had not married him and had had kids from a previous marriage, I couldn't count on them being there for me--I was in health care for 25 years before retiring and I can tell you that I witnessed scores of people over the years just dumped in a nursing home and left to die.

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MerlynHerne
I don't think I have to worry about dying alone. I have a very devoted husband I KNOW will be there for me when the time comes.

D'oh! How could I forget spouses?! Yep, those CFers who have spouses will also have them in addition to friends and family when they need someone to help them out.

Unless a person dies of a long, extended illness and their kyds can be called in enough time, most every childed person will "die alone", which I take to mean with no kyds present. Heart attack while jogging? Drown while on vacation surfing? Fall overboard on a cruiseliner? Car accident on the way to work? Buried alive by an avalanche? Trapped in a fallen mine shaft? Airplane crash while traveling on business? I think that in all of those examples that a childed person would "die alone", aka sans kyds. If taken literally, that's just a STUPID statement. If someone is so incredibly ill to be on a terminal ward of a hospital or being attended to by hospice at home, they are likely drugged on pain medication and won't even know if anyone is around ANYWAY. I suppose it has several meanings such as you will "grow old alone", but that's ludicrous. CF will no sooner "grow old alone" than a childed person would, with most people having famblee members, friends, neighbors, spouses, etc........in their lives. Besides, isn't it wee bit selfish to WANT your kyds to actually witness you croak? The process of death is not a pretty sight and certainly not something that anyone wants to have etched into their memories as the last time that they saw their loved ones.

I don't WANT anyone I love to have to watch me die.These breeders are going to be just as selfish in death as they had been in life, I suppose. The WORST part is that they are pre-meditating it too.

Love your avatar!

I think it is important, though to remember single or widowed/divorced CF and make sure that they are cared for as well. I would do anything to assure that no bingo of this sort thrown at a CF person ever becomes reality. But a devoted spouse is a wonderful thing I must admit.

I also love KK's hilarious avatar.

I was thinking the same thing KK wrote; most of us will die alone. And that isn't necessarily a bad thing. People get all wonky about death because they are afraid of it. They feel better about thinking about death if they think that there will be loved ones there to be with them. That is understandable.

Just to look at myself for an example, DH is away from home from 7 a.m. till 9 p.m. 3 times a week and from 7 a.m. till 6:30 p.m. two nights a week. Sometimes on Sundays we'll go to the nearby library from 1 p.m. till around 5 p.m. but will be in different sections for most of the day. We usually sleep from about 11 p.m. till 6:00 a.m., and if I die in my sleep, that's dying alone since I'm not conscious. The odds are greater that I'll have something like a heart attack or accident during the day (when he's usually not around) because I'm up and doing stuff and moving around in the world.

So, given the 168 available hours in a week, I'm alone or asleep for about 118 hours, or 70% of the time. Even with a good husband, odds are good that I'll die alone.

That's not important. The 2 especially close friends that we host dinners for, and our families, and living a good and happy life, regardless of one's child/financial situation, is what's important.

Will I die alone? Big Freakin Deal! I live alone and have for the last 22 years. I have had a steady ladyfriend for the last few years but we don't live together. What a stupid bingo LOL!

if i was evil i would say i would take as many people as i could with me so i wouldnt die alone.

but i really want to go out hard and fast, just vanish one day..

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I just post the stories, for interest.. for everyone

Lord, what fools these mortals be!
- A Midsummer Night’s Dream, Act III, Scene ii

Voltaire said: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."

H.L.Mencken wrote:"The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.”

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. Albert Einstein

1. Great Aunt had 7 kids, she died alone. Not one of her kids, grandkids, or great grandkids had been to visit her in over 6 months. My grandma ( her sister) found her dead.
2. My great grandma died when I was 10, she had 6 kids and numerous grandkids and great grandkids, she died alone.
3. My neighbor, his wife died and none of his kids were around.

My list could go on and on.
Breeders build this imaginary world up in their minds, it is like they are still playing house at the age of 35.

T wo
H ousehold
I ncome
N o
K ids
E arly
R etirement

I am unimpressed with the "you'll die alone!" argument. When you are dying, you are alone, in the sense that having someone else around you doesn't mean you won't feel pain and you won't die. You have to go through dying by yourself.

This stupid "argument" makes as much sense to me as another nugget of Breeder "wisdom:" "You'll live on through your children." Er, no. Your children will be alive, but you'll still be in the ground, dead, whether you had them or not. I'd rather make a mark while I am here. Helping animals and the less fortunate, planting trees, not being part of the Earth-raping that is overpopulation.

Do I worry about being old and alone? Sure, sometimes. I'm taking steps to make the process better, such as, saving money (easier to do without brats) researching long-term insurance, staying healthy, etc. Oh, and I don't intend to be a pain in the ass now or when I'm old. I'm choosy about my friends, but I am a good friend to have.

Even if I had a guarantee that any brat I had would take care of me, I see no reason to do something I would hate (child-bearing and child-rearing) just to make that happen.

Does it really matter whether you die in a crowd of people, surrounded by weeping loved ones or alone in your easy chair? You're going to die, and you don't generally get to pick how or when, and that's the inescapable fact. Personally, I'd much rather live a life I enjoy and then be allowed to die when the time comes, there's no use in worrying about death because it's going to happen no matter what.

From Mr. William Shatner's fine song "You'll Have Time" from his equally excellent cd "Has Been"

Live life/ Live life like you're gonna die/ Because you're gonna/ I hate to be the bearer of bad news / But you're gonna die

Maybe not today or even next year / But before you know it you'll be saying / "Is this all there was? / What was all the fuss? / Why did I bother?"

Now, maybe you won't suffer maybe it's quick / But you'll have time to think / Why did I waste it? / Why didn't I taste it? / You'll have time / Because you're gonna die.

Yes it's gonna happen because it's happened to a lot of people I know / My mother, my father, my loves / The president, the kings and the pope / They all had hope / And they muttered just before they went / Maybe, I won't let go / Live life like you're gonna die / Because you are

Maybe you won't suffer maybe it's quick / But you'll have time to think / Why did I waste it? / Why didn't I taste it? / You'll have time / 'Cause you're gonna die

I tell you who else left us / Passed on down to heaven no longer with us / Johnny Cash, JFK, that guy in the Stones / Lou Gehrig, Einstein, and Joey Ramone / Have I convinced you? / Do you read my lips? / This may come as news but it's time /
You're gonna die / You're gonna die

By the time you hear this I may well be dead / And you my friend might be next / 'Cause we're all gonna die / Yeah, oh maybe you won't suffer and maybe it's quick / But you'll have time to think / Why did I waste it? / Why didn't I taste it? / You'll have time / You'll have time cause you're gonna die / Yes, you're gonna die / You're gonna die, I tell you / You're gonna die / You are gonna die

'Cause maybe you won't suffer maybe it's quick / But you have time to think / Why did I waste it? / Why didn't I taste it? / You'll have time 'cause you're gonna die

Live Life / Life life like you're gonna die / Because you're going to / Oh yes / I hate to be the beater of bad news / But you're gonna die

Maybe not today or even next year / But before you know it you'll be saying / "Is this all there was? / What was all the fuss? / Why did I bother? / Why did I waste it? / Why didn't I taste it?" / You'll have time, baby / You'll have time / 'Cause you're gonna die / You are gonna die / Oh yeah

"It truly is the one commonality that every designation of humans you can think of has, there's at least one asshole."
--Me

Has anyone saw this link that BratfreeGirl showed. This is an answer from this Vicky69.

"What should I do if after 3 years my boyfriend is not ready to make plans for future?

---------- Vickey69 wrote ----------
I am so sorry you have found "Mr Batchelor"

He doesn't want to get married & have kids...are you prepared to face that?

I'd leave and tell him not to contact you unless he's holding an engagement ring..and makes it a SHORT engagement.
You want marriage, you want children and if he's not going to do this for you, then you can find it with someone else.
It wouldn't hurt to tell him he'll probably "die alone" when you leave this time...and this time..no contact..no calls...no visits...
IT'S OVER! Unless he brings an engagement ring! Be firm!

Don't give up your dreams of being a wife & mother because he can't commit. There is a perfect man out there for you..he isn't it!"

Oh this is good 'Vicky69' what a stupid answer. Is because the Baby-rabid's BF decide not to have a kid so your solution is to let the breeder-wannabe to dump her BF. Dump him for good and say "it's over". For all that commitment that the man did for his GF. He should get dump because he doesn't want a damn kid, he maybe doesn't want to be a Dud or a wallet and advise the moo-wannabe that her BF should die-alone. This is some evil bingo, worse than a "human insurance policy" bingo which means "who look after you when you go old".
I think that is an insult answer also for Mr Bachelor to get dump because he doesn't want to go to breeder-hell.

[o/t] William Shatner is a hoot. He's still extremely active, does a ton of charity work, and pokes fun at himself, even in his old age. I subscribe to his newsletter.

Youtube soundtrack (with silly visuals) to the song Feh mentions: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h9eQ8_T1ytU
[/o/t]

Hey, if you have kids, you won't die alone! Really! Ask Chris Benoit! Er, nevermind.

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Gigabyte
I think that is an insult answer also for Mr Bachelor to get dump because he doesn't want to go to breeder-hell.

Seriously? She'd be doing the guy a favour. I got dumped because I didn't commit to breeder hell, and believe me, I didn't waste too many tears over it.

I have two personal experiences regarding dying involving the same accident and neither time was I alone. I vividly remember the ten seconds or so before (and upon realization) that a freak and unavoidable car accident that should have resulted in immediate death was impending. My"last" thoughts in those seconds immediately preceeding my presumed death were not what I would have imagined. The second time was shortly thereafter when I suffered a burst blood clot in the brain from the head injury sustained in that accident and I actually did "die" (no pulse, no heartbeat) a few days later. I recall my immediate thoughts as I took what I thought were my last breaths. The first time I was with my now ex husband and I had NO thought of if he was going to be "ok", NOR did I think about the stepchild that I had been raising, nor of anyone else. My thoughts in the seconds before what I thought was going to be my certain death was:OMG! My cats will not understand why I never came back! Those poor little things, I hope they will be ok.

The next time, my father was present because it happened at our office and I remember looking at his face and hearing him say, "She''s gone". If I hadn't have been near dead and on my way to where ever it is that dead people go, I probably would have cried as it brought me immeasurable grief ( only momentary, although it seemed like an eternity) to see and hear him experience such horrific sadness. I remember wishing that he had not been there to have to witness that and I was in NO WAY comforted or glad that he was there with me and had to suffer like that. So, no I do NOT want anyone who I care about any where near me when I die and if I have a say in it, then they won't be. It is VERY selfish to desire loved ones to watch you die, IMHO. Hence, I am not the least bit surprised that breeders are so gung ho about not "dying alone", with their grieving children helplessly watching on the sidelines.

I'm with you all on the fact that everyone dies alone -- everyone.

I was in the room when my ex's father died after a lengthy illness. It was, for want of a better word, stupid of us to be there. Dying is a very private thing (not to mention quite undignified). If he'd been able to communicate in those last 24 hours I believe he would have said to us "Would you please get out of here?! Stop fuss-assing, stop fluttering around, stop hovering over me, stop wringing your hands and for fuck's sake stop staring at me." But of course he couldn't communicate all this stuff because his brain function was shutting down. He was very much on another plane and it was in no way a glorified Hollywood 'hold my hand and I'll smile at you til I go' Terms-of-Endearment style scene.

Alone is the best way, frankly.

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"The death of creativity is a pram in the hallway"
- Cyril Connolly

Don't forget that many breeders die alone because they were miserable people who no one wanted to be around in the first place. All that crap about people in nursing homes and their kids who never visit...well, I've learned lately not to assume that it's the kids who are the bad guys. There just might be another side to the coin. In either case, it is why the whole "breed so you won't die alone" thing is so f-ing ridiculous.

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MerlynHerne
Yeah I wouldn't mind getting in on this myself. I think it's great!

I don't think I have to worry about dying alone. I have a very devoted husband I KNOW will be there for me when the time comes. If I had not married him and had had kids from a previous marriage, I couldn't count on them being there for me--I was in health care for 25 years before retiring and I can tell you that I witnessed scores of people over the years just dumped in a nursing home and left to die.

I sometimes wonder how many of these dumps are a form of revenge on shitty parent(s).

Wow, Kim, that's really powerful stuff.

What you and Amethyst say resonates very much with me right now. My mom passed away just this last Wednesday. My dad and brother and I watched her suffer during those last few days. It was horrid. I'm not sure the reality of that or of her being gone has really hit me yet...but knowing her I can see her saying something like what Amethyst said of her ex-FIL's death. But she couldn't. Once she went into an unresponsive state that last day, it was more of a relief, but the couple days before that were the hardest of her entire year-long illness and decline because she was struggling to speak and tell us things. She died shortly after my brother and I left the hospice facility. You hear of that happening a lot...she probably didn't want us to see the actual moment she stopped breathing.

It just points out yet again that breeders don't think for two seconds about what they are really saying, and those who do obviously have not witnessed what many of us here have. "Selfish" doesn't begin to describe these idiots.

I would hope so, and certainly not in any hospice. because once you go into one of those places you know you are on your way out and could well give up fightin to stay around.

II would want to do what I wanted right up to the last minute. and plan what I want to do when I come back again. No one can chose when it happens to you but you can say how you want it to happen. No people you haven't seen in donkey's years turning up like ghouls , just in case you have something to leave them.

I believe in if you can afford to buy your family and friends things they would like whilst you are still around and you can see the pleasure they have from your gifts.

Sorry to hear about your loss, Louise! I think you are right, that you're just at the beginning of your cycle of grieving right now. But I also think that you are not living in denial -- you know nature takes its course whether we like it or not.

I think most parents - being self-centred - think ahead to their own dramatic scenarios and believe and wish that, when the time comes, their deaths will forever wreak havoc in the lives of all those around them. How 'loving' is that?! They imagine dozens of people will be gathered around their bed, wailing and pleading. After they go, they think their children (at any age) won't cease weeping for decades, their spouses will shrivel up and die too, and they will achieve legendary status amongst the family stories. Maybe there will be a family shrine built and dedicated to them, with a glossy 8x10 photo of themselves at the centre of it. And everyone will come and light candles at it, every week, for generations.

What a load of selfish bullshit.

Because when it really does happen, and the time really does come for dying, people drop all that hyperbolic, selfish drama. They realise it's not a game anymore and it's not about winning. It's not about garnering special attention and trying forever to be at the centre of everyone else's lives. It's a time for modesty, humility and privacy -- three things that selfish parents aren't particularly good at and probably haven't displayed since they became parents.

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"The death of creativity is a pram in the hallway"
- Cyril Connolly

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Amethyst
Sorry to hear about your loss, Louise! I think you are right, that you're just at the beginning of your cycle of grieving right now. But I also think that you are not living in denial -- you know nature takes its course whether we like it or not.

I think most parents - being self-centred - think ahead to their own dramatic scenarios and believe and wish that, when the time comes, their deaths will forever wreak havoc in the lives of all those around them. How 'loving' is that?! They imagine dozens of people will be gathered around their bed, wailing and pleading. After they go, they think their children (at any age) won't cease weeping for decades, their spouses will shrivel up and die too, and they will achieve legendary status amongst the family stories. Maybe there will be a family shrine built and dedicated to them, with a glossy 8x10 photo of themselves at the centre of it. And everyone will come and light candles at it, every week, for generations.

What a load of selfish bullshit.

Because when it really does happen, and the time really does come for dying, people drop all that hyperbolic, selfish drama. They realise it's not a game anymore and it's not about winning. It's not about garnering special attention and trying forever to be at the centre of everyone else's lives. It's a time for modesty, humility and privacy -- three things that selfish parents aren't particularly good at and probably haven't displayed since they became parents.

This is a good post on this subject and I agree with it.


I also believe that breeders, or anyone really but especially breeders, who have this Hollywood mental versions of death bed scenarios have yet to experience the death of someone who is close to them. I am speaking of a LIVING human who they have come to know and love, not a lifeless clump of cells that are expelled by nature onto a sanitary napkin. I believe that a miscarriage can feel like a great personal loss to those who connect with their unborn, but it can NOT compare to the loss of someone who they actually knew or grew to love over a period of time. This is the only decent explanation as to HOW they could actually wish for their children to watch them die; that they just don't have an accurate idea of how ugly death and dying can be, in real life. I don't want to get into the which death trumps which, but the death of a living human ALWAYS trump a miscarriage "death". So, I would guess that this is the only "death" that they have ever experienced, or perhaps a distant relative's death when they were a child. This is the only logical explanation to how they could possibly desire their kyds to be present at death, and I am giving them the benefit of the doubt here. If I am wrong, then their level of selfishness simply and undeniably is beyond the comprehension of anyone who has ANY compassion or the ability to truly love or care about anyone more than themselves.


They seem to envision a tidy room with newly cut wild flowers artfully arranged in a crystal vase, and displayed on a nearby antique oak table alongside a recent famblee vacation picture of happier days together. A picturesque window frames nature's wonders of willowy trees and lucious flower gardens filled with butterflies and bumble bees hovering just above the honeysuckle vines. Glowing rays of gentle sunshine cast a warm glow throughout the room as the soon to be deceased lay peacefully awake, alert, and in a state of painless serenity. They are freshly bathed, hair coiffed, and they are wearing silken lounging pajamas as they lay cozily tucked away under crisp white sheets and overstuffed comforters and pillows. Wafts of lightly scented and freshly laundered linens linger in the air as they look for one last time upon their gathered famblee, hold their childrens' hands, see the pure love in the eyes of their docile and respectful grand baybees, and gently pass on to Heaven. They die with a smile upon their pink lips, their now relaxed eyes closed, and with a hint of rose in their cheeks as they quietly release their last breath on this earth.

This is what I think that they believe, because otherwise WHY would they want their kyds to witness their deaths? I have trouble believing that anyone can be THIS selfish, but people are always surprising me.

I might, but I'm ok with it.

as long as the cats don't eat me.

I heartily agreed with Cheese Louise. I'm an example of someone who will probably not "be there" for my parent when the time comes. Both my parents were shitty (very SHITTY) parents. I'm not grateful to them for dragging me into the world (my mom oopsed my dad so she could stay at home for another 5 years--thanks for using me that way, Mom!) and treating me horribly (my dad resented us all throughout our childhood and showed us by beating the shit out of us, often for no apparent reason--oh, and my awesome mom never lifted a finger to protect us or get us out of there). So, I have ZERO sense of duty toward my parents, and I refuse to go out of my way to honor them or make their lives more comfortable. That includes not making an effort to "be there" when they die. Sorry, but that's the way it goes.

I don't think that kids should be off-handedly demonized for not visiting their parents in nursing homes, because maybe the parents were shitty and don't deserve the devotion of their children. I'll take it one step further and propose that, even in the case of good parents, children don't necessarily OWE their parents. If the kids do choose to devote time and effort to looking after their feeble, elderly parents, then that's great. It shows a lot of character and goodwill on their part, but I don't view offspring as being obligated to do so. Certainly they're not as obligated to their parents as a parent would be to his/her minor child. It's an asymmetric relationship, let's not forget.