Entry 1904 - Foley is a good christian republican

You know what I hate about the republicans, I mean aside from their fundamentalist, oppressive, lying natures? Their complete and total hypocrisy.
1. They're the party of "personal responsibility". You are responsible for yourself and your actions, and if you can't pull yourself up by your bootstraps and be as successful as some trustfund baby from a rich family who grew up in a wealthy neighborhood and went to an ivy league school, well then you deserve to lie in a gutter and die like the worthless dog you are.
2. When they are found to be doing something obviously illegal, like spending the last 11 years sending inappropriate messages to underaged boys, all of a sudden "WAHHHHHHH! I am gay!! Booohooooo! I'm an alcoholic!! Pity me! I was molested as a child and don't know what I'm doing!!"

Please remember, being gay and being a PEDOPHILE are two vastly different things. Being alcoholic and TRYING TO TALK YOUNG BOYS INTO SEXUAL RELATIONS are also two vastly different things. They, infact, have nothing to do with one another.

I can only hope this will be the final nail in the coffin of lies and deceit that the republican party has spent these past 5 years building, and people will finally see that the party in power doesn't care about THEM, their religion or their precious children. They care about making more money than fucking god and doing anything they can possibly get away with to stay in power.

"It truly is the one commonality that every designation of humans you can think of has, there's at least one asshole."
--Me

Foley's a gross old man, and I have no idea what an attractive gay 16-year-old boy would see in him. But I don't care if 18 is the age of legal adulthood, most kids are having sex by the age of 15 these days, and they are old enough to know what they are doing. I think "underage" should be more like 14. I was 17 myself, with a guy in his 20's, and I wasn't being "taken advantage of." I knew EXACTLY what I was doing. Guys in their 20's had nice cars and talked about books and politics instead of stupid stuff like the boys my age did. And yes, I went to PP and got myself protected, too. I get sick of infantilizing 16-year-olds and pretending they're too young to have sex or know what they are doing when they do. That's just a knee-jerk reaction by parents who can't accept the reality that their kids are growing up.

What bothers me more in the Foley case is that he was their BOSS. Which is a whole 'nother can of worms, and doesn't relate to the age difference.

Republicans and Democrats both make me sick. We already know that Democrats think a government program is the solution to every problem. They mean well, but they simply have no grasp of economics or the reality of how badly socialist government programs work when it comes to solving problems.

Republicans, on the other hand, always marketed themselves as advocates of limited government. The fundienutters among them were always annoying, but abortion was the only issue they wanted to bring into the political forum, and they'd already lost that battle with Roe vs. Wade.

Most people think the government is too big and that their taxes are too high, and they are right, so they put Republicans in power, only to be betrayed when the Republicans started increasing the size of government even faster than the Democrats had. The federal government grew more slowly under Clinton than it has under Dubya. Plus, the current administration panders to the fundienutters on all SORTS of issues now - the Terri Schiavo case, stem cell research, abstinence education - the list goes on.

Personally, I think the first thing that needs to happen is that the chokehold on government by Democrats AND Republicans needs to be broken. Throw all the bums out. They are convinced (as the Foley case demonstrates) that they can get away with anything. I'd vote for any third party candidate at this point just to get the two major parties out of power.

Thus endeth the Civics 101 lesson.

I totally hear both of you, Feh and Pirate Jo!

Republicans talk about limiting government but then wants government and religion to take women's bodies and lives hostage. Get abortion and contraception into the mix. The right-wingers are then trying to get government to end our choices. Dems want socialism only for moos and babies but want to tax the h*ll out of the rest of us to pay for it all.

I read a letter in USA Today from a moo who was braying how these scandals would not happen if a MOTHER was elected as President. I am like, "Say what???" Moo went on how she knows right-from-wrong because she is a muuuuuthhhhhhhhheeeerrrrr. Give me a break!

Guess what, all you moms? Foley had a mother. She may have been an excellent parent but it did not stop HIM from trying to get sex from underage boys. I cannot believe that the paper would actually print this moo's letter of how only moos can save this country from disgrace.

In my sophomore year of high school, I knew a boy who "came out". D**ek was 15 at the time. Immediately, he got a lover who was something like 40 years old. I was like, "Ew!!!!" I did not see the attraction except that this pedophile had his own home and was able to give him presents & $$$$. It is still yucky!

Pirate Jo Wrote:
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> Most people think the government is too big and
> that their taxes are too high, and they are right,

Huh? This may be your opinion, but it is not fact. Do you have a statistic (i.e. percentage of people who think government is too big) to back up the first part of your statement?

And the second part of your statement is purely subjective opinion rather than fact.

There is a statistic, but I can't get my hands on it right now, and it was maybe five years ago. The response was overwhelming, though - more than 80%.

As to the second part of my statement being opinion rather than fact, well ... that's pretty obvious, isn't it? Just as the statements that "the government is too big" or "we need bigger government" are also expressions of opinion. That would be why I started my statement out with, "Personally I think ..."

My theory is supported, however, by the incredible backlash Bush is getting from conservatives right now. Sure you have those people who line up religiously along party lines, no matter what, but a lot of people who consider themselves conservative or Republican are horrified by the current administration. How else could his popularity be so low?

If you don't agree with my views, disagree all you want - it's no skin off my nose. If you think government should be bigger, support bigger government - it's a free country. You'll have a lot of company with those mothers who want the government to provide free preschool, daycare, and mandated six-month paid maternity leave.

I couldn't find anything on "big govt." but this is a compilation of statistics about how people feel regarding the current issues:
http://people-press.org/reports/display.php3?ReportID=275

I personally wouldn't have a problem with the amount I paid in taxes were it not for the fact that corporations and the very wealthy pay comparitively little in taxes. If everyone, corporations included, paid the same percentage I do, then I wouldn't mind at all. I do believe what we pay in taxes is misallocated in some of the worst ways possible, and wouldn't mind what I paid in taxes at all if there were also programs that benefited single, child free people as well as corporations and breeders.

"It truly is the one commonality that every designation of humans you can think of has, there's at least one asshole."
--Me

I'll add that I still think there should be a tax credit for people who choose not to breed, since we use fewer resources, and no tax credits for people who choose to breed beyond their "replacement person".

Feh Wrote:
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> I personally wouldn't have a problem with the
> amount I paid in taxes were it not for the fact
> that corporations and the very wealthy pay
> comparitively little in taxes. If everyone,
> corporations included, paid the same percentage I
> do, then I wouldn't mind at all. I do believe
> what we pay in taxes is misallocated in some of
> the worst ways possible, and wouldn't mind what I
> paid in taxes at all if there were also programs
> that benefited single, child free people as well
> as corporations and breeders.


I agree with this completely. I don't mind paying some taxes for the common good, but why the hell should multi-million dollar corporations get away with huge tax breaks while we struggle?

You guys might be interested in reading about this, if you haven't heard about it already.

http://www.fairtaxvolunteer.org/smart/faq.html

Just throwing this out there for your reading enjoyment ...

Pirate Jo Wrote:
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> Foley's a gross old man, and I have no idea what
> an attractive gay 16-year-old boy would see in
> him. But I don't care if 18 is the age of legal
> adulthood, most kids are having sex by the age of
> 15 these days, and they are old enough to know
> what they are doing. I think "underage" should be
> more like 14. I was 17 myself, with a guy in his
> 20's, and I wasn't being "taken advantage of." I
> knew EXACTLY what I was doing. Guys in their 20's
> had nice cars and talked about books and politics
> instead of stupid stuff like the boys my age did.
> And yes, I went to PP and got myself protected,
> too. I get sick of infantilizing 16-year-olds and
> pretending they're too young to have sex or know
> what they are doing when they do. That's just a
> knee-jerk reaction by parents who can't accept the
> reality that their kids are growing up.

I totally agree. In many countries, teens of that age are already married. In the UK, teenage girls tend to have sex earlier. I read in one European women's magazine while overseas how many 15/year-old girls in England do go clubbing and have one-night stands. Not that I feel this is really a healthy thing to do at a younger age; however, these "girls" are very willing and will are practically adults. The UK girls, at least, protect themselves as you did rather than take chances and get knocked up.

Most parents cannot accept their teens growing up and having sexual feelings. Funny thing is that one of the young women (I read about) who started her one-nighters at age 15 and is still doing so in her 20's is so typical meaning that she does not tell long-term boyfriends and will not tell a husband of having so many sexual partners. I guess this English woman is not so progressive after all if she has to make it seem that she maybe had five lovers before marriage rather than up to 100 men.

in the UK, you can get married, join the army, but you cant drink at your own wedding.. thats at 16, the age of consent is 16, but its pretty loose when it comes to 15 year old boys and girls.. its when people see a 30 year old and a 15 year old, thats when people say its coercion..

and yes you do see 14 and 15 year olds wearing slut wear, so if you do go out and you ask, and they agree, they could go the next day claim rape and under age sex.. i have seen 15 year olds wear stuff that hookers would be too ashamed to wear ... then you have parents who when their kid is pregnant at 13 say its ok.. and are sort of proud. which has happened in this country..

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I just post the stories, for interest.. for everyone

Lord, what fools these mortals be!
- A Midsummer Night’s Dream, Act III, Scene ii

Voltaire said: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."

H.L.Mencken wrote:"The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.”

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. Albert Einstein

Yes, teens are having sex. That's not actually a new thing.
The problem is when adults in power, like your congressmen, priests, fast food managers, teachers, or whatever, start having sex with the teens under their care, or in their employment. There is a vast power difference between the two parties where it may very well be that a teen feels like they HAVE to comply, because this person is their employer, mentor, confessor, or whatever. It's not the age thing, but the power thing.

"It truly is the one commonality that every designation of humans you can think of has, there's at least one asshole."
--Me

Feh, that is another sore point with me among many other things. I can see a 17/year-old dating a fellow who is three to four years older. Fast-food managers, clergy, teachers, politicians, and the fathers of the kids that teens babysit for are truly predators. Even if the girl is seventeen and the father where she babysits is 34, I still see it as exploitation despite the teen coming into "adulthood" at age eighteen. It IS a power thing.

When I was in college, at the ripe old age of 18 I somehow managed to get placed in an advanced philosophy class. It was a small class of mostly junors and seniors, and me, a second semester freshman. The professor of that class invited me into it after I was in his introductory philosophy class. I felt extra special to be hanging out with all those "old" people, and to have been invited out of all the other kids. I really was a terrible brown noser because of it. I very often volunteered to do menial office work for him, stapling tests, filing papers and whatnot.

I state right here with all honesty that I knew I was a big ugly dork. I had stupid glasses, stupid hair, and was a blimp like size 12. I have a hard time with colors and patterns, and in the 80's I had many opportunities to combine colors and patterns in inappropriate combinations. I'd never had a boyfriend, still wanted a pony, and had just discovered that if I went to the letter writing events for Amnesty International, people would talk to me! To have been actually invited into a super cool advanced philosophy class was just about the height of my social life right there.

One day he said he was considering a "special project" and was inviting people from class over to his house (ohmygod! I'm totally going to a PROFESSORS HOUSE) to discuss it. Indeed, many of my classmates were there. He served an awesome asian meal (how worldly!), and wine in wine glasses(how sophisticated!) and played music I'd never heard before (ooh! so cool!). The wine flowed freely, and we talked about philosophy and listened to jazz. After a couple hours a few people left and there were about 5 of us, and then the joints came out. I passed the first couple times, and then the professor asked why I wasn't smoking. I didn't know what to say except that I really hadn't done that sort of thing. Well we all talked about how people should try new things, and eventually I figured that it was the thing to do, being drunk helped. Anyway, we all left a while later.

The next weeks were awesome! I'd staple papers, or file stuff, and we'd chat and I just felt so cool and sophisticated to have a Professor to talk to. Eventually he asked me to come over to his house to talk about "the project" some evening. I showed up, with my bookbag, in all my awkward, dorky splendor, figuring it would be the same sophisticated event as before....or not. No one else showed up and I discovered he had made a full meal for the both of us. Midwesterners are polite and never turn down food. Thanks to him, I'd already discovered my enjoyment of wine and pot, so I figured I could hang out for a while, because we were friends, right? Or not. Eventually the evening became an uncomfortable, awkward makeout session with my professor, that ended in me making a quick exit when he brought out the "Kama Sutra" and I realised that I wasn't drunk enough, or ready enough, to lose my virginity. I beat a heasty retreat, spent the rest of the semester feeling confused, and put off when he stopped being my sophisticated professor friend. I ended up doing quite poorly in class, mostly because I just felt like I couldn't be honest in my assignments any longer.

Yes, I was 18 and legal. I was also a sexless, brownnoser away from home for the first time. I was easy prey for a professor, who I eventually learned, had a new freshman every semester.

That may have been a TMI moment up there, but what I'm saying is that not all teens are "asking for it" with their clueless sluttyness, and it's pretty easy to get manipulated into situations when you just never even thought that people would ever have "intentions" like that. These kids nowdays (geezer voice off) have access to media that is way more informative about human interaction than lots of us older folks did, I think. Which is pretty interesting to think about...do you think one of the reasons kids seem alot "older" for their ages is because of the way people are nowdays in the mass media? I had to learn alot of things personally that I can just see depicted nowdays on television in a very realistic manner. I wonder if that lack of learning via human interaction has an effect. Does that even make sense?

"It truly is the one commonality that every designation of humans you can think of has, there's at least one asshole."
--Me

but there are also teenager who do it on purpose, there is nothing wrong if its love, does age matter no.. they say love is blind, its when it becomes one sided thats the problem, if both feel the same, then why not.. gay straight or mediocre. it doesnt or shouldnt matter.

LOVE IS..

when a person uses their own power like the prof did, thats wrong, thats what i object too, but i dont know if anyone has spoken to the "victim" and asked what they felt.. this is politics now, not helping people but demonising others. putting others down.

Love is blind, and should be, race, sex, religion, should all be secondary when it comes to love. but using your position just to have sex is totally wrong..

*********************************************************************************************************************************
I just post the stories, for interest.. for everyone

Lord, what fools these mortals be!
- A Midsummer Night’s Dream, Act III, Scene ii

Voltaire said: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."

H.L.Mencken wrote:"The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.”

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. Albert Einstein

Feh, I am glad you were able to get away from the professor. Most women under the influence of liquor or other mind-altering substances would not be likely to leave without first having sex. Being inebriated would encourage the person to just go along or not be able to do anything about her surroundings & the people involved.

The aftermath of what happened to you was just as bad: doing poorly in the class and feeling you could no longer be honest with your assignments. It would not surprise me if there are not even more professors who just wait for the young freshmen females to arrive solely for exploitation.

Feh, I have a novel by Joyce Carol Oates called Beasts that deals with this exact issue. This book was not an easy read in the least. *I* was even shocked by the exploitation of the freshmen girls by a popular professor and his wife. The ending was pretty explosive.

Thanks to all who wrote that.

I don't have a problem with making age 18 the cutoff. I don't approve of foam-padding measures, but I recognize there has to be a line where statutory rape starts, and I'm okay with it being 18.

Maybe some kids are sexually experienced at age 16 by choice. I'm okay with that, but they had better be fucking their peers.

The problem with Foley is that he was in a position of POWER and AUTHORITY. At one time I was an instructor at a military college. Remember when some Army dude got in trouble for boinking his students? I knew a lot of people who said, so what, it's consentual.

They didn't get my point, which was that the instructors shouldn't be regarding their students as potential sexual partners. It's unprofessional and it's not honorable, period. Why? Because you can affect that person's grade. I never boinked a student. Believe me, someone would have loved seeing a young woman screw up in a very male environment, but that's now why I didn't do it. (Believe me, men hit on me all the time. I took to wearing a wedding ring because some students figured I was fair game.) I didn't do it because it would have been wrong and inappropriate.

And who was the ranter who wrote on the main page that "it has never been documented" that Foley touched an underage kid. Well, give it a while. Mark my words, someone will come forward. The man has a penchant for underaged ass and a history of preying on younger boys. He's a predator and his stupid buddies in Congress shouldn't have covered for him. He should have found someone of legal age who wanted some dick and not preyed on someone whose life he could affect.

As an aside, if you are 45 and you want to fuck an 18 year old, it's not illegal but it sure is tacky. There are exceptions. Some people fall in love with someone who is substantially older/younger.

But when I see a Demi Moore/Ashton Kucher pairing or I see Jack Nicholson with someone 25 years younger, I think, gee, why don't you fuck someone your own age? The answer is, someone their own age wouldn't put up with their shit.

bell_flower Wrote:

> But when I see a Demi Moore/Ashton Kucher pairing
> or I see Jack Nicholson with someone 25 years
> younger, I think, gee, why don't you fuck someone
> your own age? The answer is, someone their own
> age wouldn't put up with their shit.

How true, how true! That is what my late-grandfather told me when I was a teen and I mentioned that an older fellow liked me. No one Jack's or Demi's age would tolerate them. The young fellow is with Demi for his career. I am sure he will take off when he is doing better than he is already doing. As for Old Nasty Jacko, the young hotties are with him for the $$$$ and the fame. Does he think these younger, pretty ladies actually like his ugly @SS? I also believe that Old Foley has touched someone. Just give it time...

I heard on the news the other day that someone did come forward and said he had sex with Foley. However, in this case, he was 21 and no longer a page.

But, as was said above, why would any young gay man want to have sex with that creepy dude? Wanting to forward his career is the only reason I can think of.

I still think he DID touch underage boys in his employ. As India said, just give it time!

Hello, everyone. It is me...india_darshan...but with a new ID name. I felt it was time for a new name. This is a Tai Chi routine I am learning along with my yoga stuff. I was also born in the Year of the Dragon: 1964.

Back to the topic now...

A lot of people have others living in their homes but do not know what is going on when the other person is there alone. This is a touchy subject. What consenting adults do should be their business as long as no crime is committed.

The ethics are what gets iffy. Employers having sex with very young adult employees is an abuse of power. Same goes for physicians, therapists, attorneys, clergy, etc. being sexual with their clients or patients. Most adults in the patient/client setting are extremely emotionally vulnerable.

I do not advocate making laws stating that a lawyer and his/her client cannot have a relationship or a doctor should get the license revoked for a consentual sexual relationship outside of the office. Or, a professor on the make with a student into a crime. We cannot make women into victims who are unable to make their own sexual decisions.

However, our society needs to empower all people -- males and females -- to understand that sexual contact does not automatically mean a "love" relationship or that the intitiator even likes the other person. Young women and men on their first jobs or away at university also need to be schooled of how many professors and employers are "on the make" to have no-strings sex with a person who is very socially and sexually naive.

In my traditions, it is considered highly unethical for a yoga or Tai Chi instrctor to have sex with his/her students. Yet, this still happens and often with the woman feeling very emotionally bruised after being cast off after one to three encounters. In this setting, the lady often feels there is this big "connection" because of the spiritual aspect to these kinds of discipline.