Testing the waters

I`ve been in Florida with my grandparents for Christmas, and so far, I've been having a blast. However, my grandma got on the subject of of abortion. She's Catholic, so you can easily guess what she thinks.
I said that i saw nothing wrong with it. I said that a baby is simply a parasite who feeds off the mother, and is incapable of truly loving its mother. She told me that abortion is wrong because a baby is alive. I wanted to say, so`s a tick, what`s your point? I also mentioned later that "I haven't had any problems with squalling spawn at movie theaters". She was shocked, told me that was rude, and said that "I don't where you heard that, some people think its cool to say that, but its rude."
I apologized, since i didn't want to go out of my way to offend her. I was just stretching my wings, seeing how far I could go. I don`t want to to be rude to her, i just have a completely different viewpoint from her. When she talked about how they kill the baby in an abortion, it didn't faze me. I think it`s gruesome, but I can't feel sorry for something that uses its mothers body as a parasite would a host. What say you?

Never apologize for being CF and stating your view.

No matter who you are talking to.

~~~~~~~~~~~
I miss my little feather baby.

Quote
drake
Never apologize for being CF and stating your view.

No matter who you are talking to.

Amen. It`s fun to push the envelope. Also, I'm recovering from years of stupidity and laziness, and I can't wait to get out on my own and be my own man! I wanna wear a black trench coat and gas mask, dye my hair red, buy a `59 Cadillac hearse, and blast heavy metal as I rip through dark suburbs! But first, I gotta get through college. I'm getting a Bachelor`s degree in computer science.

Speaking of pushing the envelope, has anyone gotten into trouble for using CF/BF lingo with people?

For my part, I LOVE the term Fuck Trophy smile

Breeders and pro-lifers don't censor themselves, why should we?

Quote
keeper of traken
Speaking of pushing the envelope, has anyone gotten into trouble for using CF/BF lingo with people?

For my part, I LOVE the term Fuck Trophy smile

Breeders and pro-lifers don't censor themselves, why should we?

Like i said before, I called kids spawn once, I'm surprised that my grandmother was that shocked by it. I`ve always been a pretty nice sheltered guy, so it felt goodto be a bastard for once. My family wants me to stay on the normal side, but I love being weird. I`ve been in the Army, hung out with rock`n`rollers under a bridge, took a joyride in an offroad dump truck, and I listen to bands like Creature Feature and Abney Park. When I hear normal, I think suburban, bland, Disney, and fambly values.

My approach is to consider if it is someone I care about, who will be hurt by what I say.

I never expressed my opinions to my grandparents when they were alive because it would not have served any purpose I wanted to achieve. It would have hurt them and it would not have changed their opinions. I've never been pressured to breed by my family so I expect they were keeping the same kind of bargain. If they had pressured for breeding I doubt I would have retaliated, I would have just chosen to distance myself from them.

I have spoken honestly with my mother, my close friends, and others about my views on natalism, overpopulation, and my distaste for being around children. They're all people who can be counted on to think about what I've said rather than dismiss it as hurtful. I've let them take the lead on harsh language because I believe that it diminishes my argument to be crude and makes people less inclined to listen to the content.

But when dealing with a rude stranger who tries to pressure me about breeding, I have no hesitation with being rude back, using whatever slang I like. Offending such people is enjoyable, and they're always the ones who started it.


A bit of advice, as you sound rather young, and appreciative of the joys of shocking staid relatives:

When you have any characteristic which is outside of the norm you have to think carefully about how much you're going to tell relatives, friends, co-workers, and strangers. Don't be goaded into saying more than you want to say to a particular person, think about what kind of relationship you want with this person (and, if you're activist-minded, about what impact it will have on others if you speak up). When you do speak up, don't be prepared to back down unless you completely misjudged the situation. There's really no benefit in appearing to be an asshole unless your objective is to sever that relationship. An apology only provides a veneer of social acceptability; your grandmother knows that your opinions have not changed unless she's deep in denial, and that does change your relationship with her.

I am generally pleased to share my views on being CF. I'll happily proclaim that I don't want children to pretty much anyone. But I do it for a specific reason. The more people that are open about it, the faster it will be accepted as a lifestyle choice. I feel that I'm actually doing people a favor, especially since I won't turn around and pop out brats like SOME people.

I usually keep the slang to a minimum, but if I am asked I will share any opinion I want without mercy, regardless of the individual. If a person is seeking knowledge, it wouldn't do anyone well to mislead them. I won't lie to make someone feel better, but I also won't shove my views in the face of another person who may not wish to know. I have only gotten in trouble for using the word breeder. And that was because my ex was a breeder-pleaser.

(I own a "smug childfree person" t shirt, I love to wear it at fairs an other breederific events. Pisses people right off and I find it HILARIOUS)

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
So.. We know that food and water are running out, with overpopulation and all... Yet people keep on poppin' out those babies! I guess they want to have their baby and eat it too...

My top reason is that parenting gives you a free license to be selfish based purely on the fact that you're being selfish for an emanation of your own self. The illusion that what you do to benefit your children benefits them solely is a fallacy. Every parent benefits from the benefits that their children receive. Henceforth, it gives one a license to perpetuate a dog-eat-dog mentality that I perceive to be amoral. Parents say that their children are their greatest loves, what they forget to add is that they are their ONLY loves and only because their children are a reflection of themselves. I prefer to be able to love multiple people and have lasting relationships of many types and possess the essential core value of empathy for all than to restrict myself to an echo chamber of ego-masturbation and self-serving chicanery.

In short: Not parenting makes you a better person.

Quote
yurble
My approach is to consider if it is someone I care about, who will be hurt by what I say.

I understand, I love my grandmother, and I'd never deliberately hurt her feelings. I just wanted to present my views. She disagreed with me, and I didn't push the subject further. She's a good person, and I'm not going to be rude to her because we think differently. Also, I'm 24, I've just been living with my parents for a while because of my bad decisions, and I'm looking forward to being on my own.

I use the lingo to my hubby when discussing his nephew and this fuck buddy wife...who only married him for breeding stock. Hubby can't believe some to of the terms I come up with. He'd never use them... but I have no problem with using them ...espcecially with those two. They've been married 7 months now... and no new yet. When the news comes.. and it will... Oh will the CF slang start flyin' LOL I'm in my 60's. I say what I want. The fambly doesn't speak to me anyway... so.. what do I have to loose?

I have begun using the term CF all over the place. When people used to ask if I had kids... I'd just say 'no' but now I proudly say 'No I am Childfree by choice' I am trying to get the term out there.

Quote
catharsist
I am generally pleased to share my views on being CF. I'll happily proclaim that I don't want children to pretty much anyone. But I do it for a specific reason. The more people that are open about it, the faster it will be accepted as a lifestyle choice. I feel that I'm actually doing people a favor, especially since I won't turn around and pop out brats like SOME people.

I usually keep the slang to a minimum, but if I am asked I will share any opinion I want without mercy, regardless of the individual. If a person is seeking knowledge, it wouldn't do anyone well to mislead them. I won't lie to make someone feel better, but I also won't shove my views in the face of another person who may not wish to know. I have only gotten in trouble for using the word breeder. And that was because my ex was a breeder-pleaser.

(I own a "smug childfree person" t shirt, I love to wear it at fairs an other breederific events. Pisses people right off and I find it HILARIOUS)

Catharsist's post represents my views and behaviour for the most part.

There are times when I'm at an extended-family event and invariably someone brings up the fact that, "Studio you will soon be pushing 40 years old and are unmarried, so it's time for you to settle down and have a famblee..." (clearly you see where this conversation is heading...) eyes2


I've learned through the years not to get hostile with the person, but rather to stay very matter-of-fact. And so I advise you to stay cool, express your feelings but keep your emotions in check, no matter how much you want to bash in the other person's skull!

So what should you say when you are asked the usual questions of, "When are you having children? WHAT? Why don't you want children? Why are you choosing not to have children? Who will take care of you when you are older? Don't you know what you're missing out on?... etc., etc."?

Here are my personal points of emphasis:

• I have no interest in children. If you do, you should have more of your own, or adopt.
• I have interests outside the realm of caring for children that would have to be sacrificed if I had any.
• I am hoping to retire by age 60, not figure out how to pay for college for an ungrateful 20-something at that point in my life.
• Enough about me. What is your take on... {insert topic here: current events, politics, philosophy, books, music, film, etc.}?

If they're STILL being a complete asshole and harping on about my non-parent status, I simply walk away or declare that the conversation has ended. It rarely gets to this point, fortunately

Quote
keeper of traken
Speaking of pushing the envelope, has anyone gotten into trouble for using CF/BF lingo with people?

For my part, I LOVE the term Fuck Trophy smile

Breeders and pro-lifers don't censor themselves, why should we?

I need to be very careful about CF/BF language in breederland here, as I'm dependent on my often breeder community for my needs.

If a brat is driving me bug guts, I will slip an MP3 player in my ears. If there's no MP3 player in my purse I'll move, using my disability as an excuse. I've a handy excuse in case I catch shade: Everyone knows what Autism is, (there's enough fucking flappers about!) and can understand auditory issues. For those idiot enough not to know Autistic from Artistic, 'migraine onset risk' will do the trick too. Many of my anti-migraine meds are used for seizures.

+++++++++++++

Passive Aggressive
Master Of Anti-brat
Excuses!

Quote
keeper of traken
Speaking of pushing the envelope, has anyone gotten into trouble for using CF/BF lingo with people?

For my part, I LOVE the term Fuck Trophy smile

Breeders and pro-lifers don't censor themselves, why should we?

The only times I have gotten into some trouble with the lingo have been on some of the other message boards and forums and the topic of kids arises. One message board pertains to early retirement (I am an early retiree, 51, retired for 6 years mainly due to being CF), a forum which has a pretty large number of CF people BTW.

Anyway, here is what typically happens on one of those message boards:

(1) Someone (not me) starts a thread about having kids, sometimes phrased as a question.

(2) All the parents chime in saying "how great it will be", "go for it", "they are all worth it" blah blah blah blah.

(3) I chime in with an alternative viewpoint, saying it's a bad idea, how it will cost you money and/or an early retirement, all the other negatives everyone here knows, etc. etc. etc.

(4) I then get bingoed left and right by all the parents.

(5) I then point out that all those attacks are simply tired, old, overused insults which demean the CF and are called "Bingos." A few times, I posted a link to a "Breeder Bingo Card" to support my position.

(6) Moderators of the forum then attack me (privately) for using the term "breeder" and remove my post (or at least link) to the "Breeder bingo card" because "it makes the parents feel bad to use that term." I don't actually use the term, "Breeder" in any of my posts but because I hooked my train to the title of the bingo card, I was responsible. I actually tried to find a link to a "bingo card" which did not include the term "breeder" in it but couldn't find one.


For those of you here long enough, you probably know that I am a moderate when it comes to my posts about CFdom. I am far less intense and strident than most of you here, as I have not been subjected to many of the attacks from family, friends, and coworkers about being CF. I do volunteer work in several area schools which acts as a good shield from the "ebil child-hater" stereotype we often hear from parents. My beefs with parents are more on the business and government policy aspects of being CF, not the social and familial aspects. I have never been bingoed by friends or relatives, thankfully. Instead, they envy me for having been able to retire at 45.

I love the term "fuck trophy", it`s accurate and highly offensive. Maybe it`s because I`m a man, but I've never been bingoed the way you guys have. I`m looking forward to it though, just to see the look on some bovine`s face. The weird thing is, most of the moos where I live are q:-):-)uite young and good looking. I mean, I know it`s the South, but it`s such a shame all the pretty girls have to spawn.
Oh, and speaking of autism, I`m on the high end of the spectrum, and I have Asperger`s. I apparently don`t have much of a clutch between my brain and my mouth, and I`ve said a few pretty insulting things by accident.
For example, I met my neighbor`s grandmother, and said "Wow, you look really old!" Needless to say, she was pretty offended and my poor mom was horrified. I`m worlds better now, but I still haven`t forgotten those moments. I had to learn a lot of things the hard way. Ugh.

im so all for abortions, although i'd rather the mistakes not happen at all, I remember reading something on this site that went something like this: accidental pregnancy's exist but there's no such thing as an accidental birth.

I've used it a few times to shut up breeders that wanna joke about how great it would be if I accidently got knocked up or went into labour never knowing I was pregnant to begin with since im so fat.

I love using some of the little gems I've become accustomed to from here in real life, ive always used the terms, breeders and spawning since I was a teen, but not I love trying to use crotch stain or cunt fruit around people that also hate kids because they've never heard of it and seem to also find it amusing, I love reading out some of the posts to my partner since he cant be fucked reading through the site himself, but finds some of the topics unbelievable and aligns with the CF point of view, he dosnt much like the language thinks were all very werid, but some of my gay guy friends whom I also read out topics to for discussion, love the language used, and frequently say they need to remember that phrase next time there near an annoying little brat.

I find myself having to be carful not to call female breeders moo's, and I do watch my mouth around familys I actually like - for again the same reason as most others here, its not worth bringing up the topic to them if I still want to be friends with them.

I relished in the time I got to have a sit down talk with my mum about my child free views, and stopped her short everytime thanks to everyone who helped prepair me on the bingoed page, like her trying to divert it into guilt about what if my partner wants kids had I even thought of him, yep, we talked it out and agree no kids is best, if he changes his mind we break up and he moves on to have a family with someone else, blew her mind that I would even think of doing such a thing.

point is, pick who it is that is in the need to know circle of your world, people who will forever either pester or support you in your choice, and get it out sooner than later so they cant think you've just changed your mind or will. as for everyone else, unless there seriously blunt and rude about your lack of breeding status, they never need to know, if they are rude, sock it to them with the most vile wording you can come up with, its great fun.

Quote
exile
im so all for abortions, although i'd rather the mistakes not happen at all, I remember reading something on this site that went something like this: accidental pregnancy's exist but there's no such thing as an accidental birth.

I've used it a few times to shut up breeders that wanna joke about how great it would be if I accidently got knocked up or went into labour never knowing I was pregnant to begin with since im so fat.

You may have heard it from me. I use that phrasing for the most part, but someone else may have said it. I mean, how the fuck do you not notice being pigged up? I mean Jesus, you can act within 20 weeks. You can't really be like OOPS when the contractions are 5 secs apart, sorry but true.

On another note, don't you fucking hate how breeders love to throw people into nightmarish scenarios? They just relish the thought of a CFer's life being royally fucked up. That is the one time where I simply do not care who says it, I will put a sorry fucker in their place over forced birth fantasies involving me. It just goes to show how mentally fucked breeders are. I've had to deal with the pig at my job who swore up and down that I would somehow accidentally birth a child like a mindless vermin. THIS ISNT THE FUCKING SIMS. I assured her that abortion is a thing, but she's so stupid I would be surprised if she didn't process it.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
So.. We know that food and water are running out, with overpopulation and all... Yet people keep on poppin' out those babies! I guess they want to have their baby and eat it too...

My top reason is that parenting gives you a free license to be selfish based purely on the fact that you're being selfish for an emanation of your own self. The illusion that what you do to benefit your children benefits them solely is a fallacy. Every parent benefits from the benefits that their children receive. Henceforth, it gives one a license to perpetuate a dog-eat-dog mentality that I perceive to be amoral. Parents say that their children are their greatest loves, what they forget to add is that they are their ONLY loves and only because their children are a reflection of themselves. I prefer to be able to love multiple people and have lasting relationships of many types and possess the essential core value of empathy for all than to restrict myself to an echo chamber of ego-masturbation and self-serving chicanery.

In short: Not parenting makes you a better person.

Quote
catharsist

You may have heard it from me. I use that phrasing for the most part, but someone else may have said it. I mean, how the fuck do you not notice being pigged up? I mean Jesus, you can act within 20 weeks. You can't really be like OOPS when the contractions are 5 secs apart, sorry but true.

I've had to deal with the pig at my job who swore up and down that I would somehow accidentally birth a child like a mindless vermin. THIS ISNT THE FUCKING SIMS. I assured her that abortion is a thing, but she's so stupid I would be surprised if she didn't process it.

I'm pretty sure it was you based on the coworker bit, best phrase I've ever seen thank you.

And I agree, I would notice if my period acted strange let a lone stopped, notice how in movies when a woman is unsure about going through with it, she dose nothing at fuckin all! She's like oh noes I'm preggers, then starts oggling larva and buying shit for the future it, without ever once seeing a doctor for an abortion.

Also related to Sims, I personally love making a living hell for my Sims, I get 3 chicks knocked up to the 1 guy, kick him out, and kick out the mothers after each one deliveres, leaving one woman in a hell of like 5 baby's, and just watch her either almost die, or the brats get taken away. Its seriously amusing, good stress relief to watch :yeah