and so it begins

not been able to post on main page so i put it here

tinyurl.com/9sj8n

02/10/2006
SD House Approves Abortion Ban
The South Dakota House has passed a bill that would nearly ban all abortions in the state, ushering the issue to the state Senate.

Supporters are pushing the measure in hopes of drawing a legal challenge that will cause the US Supreme Court to reverse its 1973 decision legalizing abortion.

The bill banning all abortions in South Dakota was passed 47-to-22 in the House.

Amendments aimed at carving out exemptions for rape, incest and the health of women were rejected.

The bill does contain a loophole that allows abortions if women are in danger of dying. Doctors who do those abortions could not be prosecuted.

ok, this is a nail in the coffin to all CF in america.

this chimp in charge, he is a religous nutter quite frankly, but he listens to the feminists, it used to be women had to have the choice of aborting or not, thats their choice, but the new breed of feminists they want women to have kids, have a job, have everything, without thought of population or standards of living.

this is going to make so many women take the extreme measures of coathangers, and suicides and by not regulation the clinics then, you get back to the backroom clinics where the mortality rate was very high. and we all know people dying isnt as bad as a few cells.

i feel sorry for the americans to have this kind of person in charge. there is no choice anymore, these feminists have said you can do it all.. all at once. so you will get more single parent families, more problem children, who have more kids, who are more problematical. and so on and it gets worse when the government bribes these single women, into having kids (as in australia) with tax breaks and so on.

the decline of civilisation (but then again bush's friend beleives in the rapture and has stated that they dont need to do ecology as when everyone gets the rapture it will all be fixed.) damned fundie, breeders, religious nutter.

(sorry for the massive rant but i feel strongly for this topic

well i agree with mercurior, but write to you senators, your representatives everyone and anyone, and say this is not on where is the choice, where are the rights you gave us, all this ban means is backroom clinics will open and people will die all for the precious clump of cells.

there are women who would kill themselves rather than suffer this, its time we CF start to fight for our rights. show them that we are a voice.

"but he listens to the feminists, it used to be women had to have the choice of aborting or not, thats their choice, but the new breed of feminists they want women to have kids, have a job, have everything, without thought of population or standards of living."

Rubbish. Feminism may well have turned backwards in terms of attitudes toward the domestic gendered division of labor and it may well have bought elements of pro-natalism. But very few feminists and feminist organizations either support forced birthing or advocate for it. The vast majority of feminists are as worried about the turning of this tide as are liberals and the CF.

But it seems that there are some CF men who will do anything to have a dig at women, and feminists in particular.

The forced birth movement is not fueled by feminists - it is fueled mostly by the religious right - both Protestant and Catholic. These are NOT synonymous with feminism.

"there are women who would kill themselves rather than suffer this, its time we CF start to fight for our rights. show them that we are a voice."

No. This is not just a CF issue. Pro-choice movements include mothers, grandmothers, the CF and childless women. They also include many men - even fathers. They include feminists, liberals and some Christians. This is a time for unity not sectarianism.

Just because a woman is a mother does not mean that she suddenly supports forced-birthing. In fact a sizeable number of abortions are carried out on mothers who do not want any more children.

it isnt just a cf issue, but we have to fight for our rights too, without abortions some of us cf's would be in a bad position right now, and the professor i know some women, who just the thought of breeding, even accidentally, would make them suicidally depressed so i agree with you.

the feminists had a good idea, equal rights, i agree with that, but look at the news, look around you, there is more and more pressure on women, to have a kid, to go to work, to be everything, this is the problem, let someone else look after bratley and snotleigh, i dont have to interact with my kids now i am a senior VP, its not so much concern about their kids, its what can be gotten for them, kids are now a fashion accessory, i am so wonderful i have 2 kids and i work, dont i deserve more in way of holidays, and time off. i am not talking bout the first wave of feminists, i am talking bout the 2nd wave this new breed, that can have it all.. havent you seen tv adverts shows showing that women can have it all (most of the time without men) it happens.

its not so much the forced birthing this is i beleive a step to the total abolition, which has been much touted by bush and his cronies, i can see if this goes further, more and more conditions for abortions until.. all pregnancies must happen.

From the point of view of an older woman whose generation started off this downward trend of womanhood, I find the present day young women to be selfish totally incapable to knowing how to bring up a child, they seem to think that once they have popped it out anyone can be responsible for looking after it so long as it isn't them.

This unfortunate trend started in the 1960's and has gone downhill ever since.

There is a big responsibility bringing children into the world you should want to look after them yourself.

The present day feminists, do not simply want equal pay for equal work, they want more than that and don't care how they go about getting it either.

People in the workplace are sick and fed up of having to do all the extra work because of these so called feminists having to take time off to go on holiday with the kiddiwinks in school holiday periods, and when the little darlings are sick or school functions, someone has to do their work whilst they still get paid may I add.

Then we have the ludicrous situation in the UK that they can now have 12 months maternity leave, leaving small firms and businesses in the situation where they have to pay them and their replacements and it simply is not good enough they cannot afford to do it. Large companies can absorb this to some degree, this is what the feminism has brought to the workplace and all the of CF people as well. whether it be younger CF people or older generation that have properly brought up their children before going back to work.

"the feminists had a good idea, equal rights, i agree with that, but look at the news, look around you, there is more and more pressure on women, to have a kid, to go to work, to be everything, this is the problem, let someone else look after bratley and snotleigh, i dont have to interact with my kids now i am a senior VP, its not so much concern about their kids, its what can be gotten for them, kids are now a fashion accessory, i am so wonderful i have 2 kids and i work, dont i deserve more in way of holidays, and time off. i am not talking bout the first wave of feminists, i am talking bout the 2nd wave this new breed, that can have it all.. havent you seen tv adverts shows showing that women can have it all (most of the time without men) it happens".

You know - this pretty much describes FATHERS generally. Women 'want to have it all' - men have always had it all.

There are more than a few feminists out there arguing that instead of making companies 'pay' for leave taken by parents that the work of childcare and indeed all housework should be split 50/50 between men and women in heterosexual households - even where children do not exist.

This is an old feminist platfform - argued particularly I know by feminists in the UK in the 70's and 80's.

Oddly enough very few childfree men make this argument.

yes men had all the choices, like working, or working, they couldnt stay home if they wanted, men have always worked and paid, men could choose to go and die in wars, yes men have it all, i dont think so.

men have always been the most expendable in the world, it is a false myth that men had it all, if childfree men argue it isnt it possible that they could be true..

it is all about the idea that women can have it all, a house a job, a kid mostly without a man. thats what feminism has bought, feminism is a power now, and what better way for the government to have new voters, more political power as a lot of women will follow the feminist line even when its wrong because of so called abuse that happened 300 years ago. we cf are the ones on the edge of the line, if we dont say stop this it will be even harder if there is an accident which could happen to us.

Ih8kyds - you sound very much like mercurior. Certainly you had the same language teacher...... maybe you are twins, eh?

Why do feminists whinge and moan about how men 'have always had it all' without doing their research? One example is Titanic: 'Women and children first', with the implication that IF there is room, some men can live, too. To me, there is nothing noble about this. Men were actually needed more than women, and CERTAINLY more than children. Men were the ones who went to war and died for the freedom and safety of their countries, including the women in them.

You may think men have had all the choices, but they also had ALL the responsibility. If their wives did something bad, the MEN got punished. Feminists want all the choices, but none of the responsibilities.

I'm a woman, and I resent this 'you can have it all' BS. I don't want it 'all', cos I know that I can't handle the responsibilities and consequences that are inherent. I'm sick and tired of being looked down upon by women for this. They always say,'well, you can leave Snotford with granddad, hire a nanny, housekeeper' blah blah, putting the responsibilites on others. Believe me, feminists have their own bingos. No, you CAN'T have it all, suck it up, and deal with it. These stupid maternity policies at workplaces, such as Northern Star mentioned, are in place because of women who 'want it all'. Look how it makes people and companies suffer. There is no father in the past who was allowed 12 months paid leave to be with Snotford. Even now, in the UK, paternity leave is 6 months UNPAID, whilst the moo gets 12 months all paid for.

Contrary to popular belief, it's rubbish that men have 'had it all'. I don't consider the draft in America, or beingpunished harder for the same crimes as 'having it all'. I've never seen any women asking for equal punishment, or a draft of females into war. Look at these stats:

'The Bureau of Justice Statistics found that on average, convicted wives received prison sentences that were about 10 years shorter than what husbands received. Excluding life or death sentences, the average prison sentence for killing a spouse was 6 years for wives but 16.5 years for husbands.'

This is from:
http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/pub/ascii/spmurex.txt

I'm a female who's an EQUALIST and I think the special rights that females are given (i.e. not having to participate in the draft, lower physical qualifications to join the police force) are the reason why we aren't taken seriously.
With rights and privledges comes responsibilities. For example: I have the right to drive a car IF I can prove myself a safe driver by passing the written test and the actual driving test at my local DMV. And after that, I can lose my right to drive if I am found to drive unsafely by obtaining too many and/or severe driving violations.
If someone wants to have a baybee, then they have to accept the consequences that baybees are not toys/fashoin accessories and that they are required to take care of them. And if some stupid moo or duh gives the excuse "It just happend. My baybee wasn't a choice.", ignore them. They chose to have sex. When I have sex, I choose to make my partner wear a condom so I don't get knocked up. And if he don't comply, I'll hand him some lube and point to the bathroom door and tell him to go fuck himself.
What the feminists forgot is that in order to have the same rights and privleges as a man, you must have the same trials and tribulations as a man. Equal rights are NOT speical rights!

exactly fattie, you said it best. **What the feminists forgot is that in order to have the same rights and privleges as a man, you must have the same trials and tribulations as a man. Equal rights are NOT speical rights**

i have seen an increase in the pro breeder feminist partly because i am a male, men see things that affects them that women may not see not that theres anything wrong with that, you see what affects you i see hat affects me, the idea that feminists have worked towards having it all comes from all those stories of women who meet a man, then change him, then have a kid all while working, then dumping him and getting him to pay. i see this more that should happen.

true feminists, should as you said be equalists.. at first they were but now they expect special considerations. if you had to choose kids or work, some women would choose work overkids, but its beneficial financially at the moment, look at austrailia, to have a kid and work and to have a walking wallet.

that does a disservice to women in general and cf women in particular. men are getting more dismissive about women as they see that they are only a walking wallet.. this ban in south dakota only gives more ammo for them to oops men it will happen if it isnt curtailed all birth control will be banned.