Charity People = CHEAP + STINGY

We were out to dinner with some friends this weekend and I wanted to share the story here a little bit.

On of our friends is a contractor that deals with many types of businesses. We got into this conversation about businesses that pay their bills on time, etc.

Well it seems that our friend that has been doing business with some for profit businesses that brag about their "thousands of dollars of donations to family and children charities" have a real hard time doing the following:

1. Paying the bills on time

2. Not being such cheap and stingy idiots that whatever job they are contracting for can be done, yes in a frugal manner, but not so fucking cheap and stingy that it ends up a real mess because there aren't enough $$ to get the job done right, which can cause a legal issue for the contractor

I commented during this conversation that in our business, one of the first things I look for before doing a job is how much "charity" work someone contributes to. If they can afford $50,000 to a charity, they can afford to pay our rates. But, each and everytime we get hired or asked to do a job by anyone involved in these level of contributions to charity, they almost inevitably pay late or haggle the bill. I've seen it time and time again, and when we do get contacted by businesses like this (unless it is some huge corporation, mostly these are smaller businesses) I usually quote the most outrageous rate and then let them haggle me down to the higher rate. Also, I require deposits and pay on delivery, we will not offer credit terms because it always ends up that we will not get paid for 90 days or more if I give them 30 days to pay.

I don't believe this applies to the animal charity people, although I don't know because we've never had any people that are major animal charity contributors asking us for work, it's always breeder charity people that do this shit.

The other thing is getting contacted by a breeder charity directly. They always want a discount for being a charity. Oh they'll go on and on their websites and literature about how "caring" and full of "social justice" they are, but when it comes to paying a fair compensation to someone providing a service to them or paying on time it's like pulling teeth.

I hate charity.

I don't know from breeder oriented charities, but the non-profit organzations I work with are just that...non-profit. There is no extra money to spend on nice things, or even needed things as all monies basically cover things that can't get donated, like rent and staff. Nearly everything we have is used, donated, found or purchased 3-4th hand from swap shops; computers, desks, printers, lobby furniture, water coolers, carpeting even coffee and toilet paper sometimes. One of the non-profits I work with is a radio station that gets a lot from other community businesses through the barter system, basically you scratch our back and we'll promote your business. Were it not for the good relationships the non-profits have built with businesses in the area, there would be no community radio or sexual health agencies here.

"It truly is the one commonality that every designation of humans you can think of has, there's at least one asshole."
--Me

Feh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I don't know from breeder oriented charities, but
> the non-profit organzations I work with are just
> that...non-profit. There is no extra money to
> spend on nice things, or even needed things as all
> monies basically cover things that can't get
> donated, like rent and staff. Nearly everything we
> have is used, donated, found or purchased 3-4th
> hand from swap shops; computers, desks, printers,
> lobby furniture, water coolers, carpeting even
> coffee and toilet paper sometimes. One of the
> non-profits I work with is a radio station that
> gets a lot from other community businesses through
> the barter system, basically you scratch our back
> and we'll promote your business. Were it not for
> the good relationships the non-profits have built
> with businesses in the area, there would be no
> community radio or sexual health agencies here.

Feh, I know you are probably a nice person in real life and all that good stuff.

And I'd be willing to bet that the organizations you work with are just as you say here.

But I've never seen this. What I've seen is a bunch of greedy rich fucks running "charity" organizations and how they'll try to rip off, cheap out, anyone doing a job for them. Mind you now, these are all breeder non profits.

Actually my post wasn't so much about the non-profits themselves as it was about FOR PROFIT businesses that brag about how much they give to charity, or individual people that brag about how much they give to charity, and then turn around and be cheap as everlivingfuck and slow when it comes to paying their bills.

THIS is a real problem, and I'm not the only contractor that has this problem.

How can someone afford to give $50,000 to "Save the Breeders" or whatever stupid charity, and then pay slow on their bills or try to cheap down the contractor so fucking much, that it could cause a legal problem with the quality of work a contractor is about to do at that price?

I've had businesses open up their first phone call to me "We give a lot of money to charity (breeder charities) do you have a discount rate?"

No you FUCK. If you can afford $50-$100k to some fucking charity, you can afford to pay your workers and contractors fair wages you goddamned FUCK.

Trust me, neither of the non-profits I work with has a rich benefactor, or even a middle income benefactor. Then again, most of the non-breeder non-profits in my town were started by commies who consider having close working relationships with the rich to be tantamount to "Sucking off The Man". Again, I do not know from child centric non-profits...except United Way, which is kind of a scam.

For profit businesses should not get discounts. They work FOR PROFIT and a smart business person will put most of that back into the business. A smart business person will also want to develop good relationships with other business people. Whether or not a business gives to charity should be irrelevant to what they pay for services from other businesses. Depending on the business, when they say they've donated X thousands of dollars to charity, they've probably actually just donated supplies or whatever they weren't using, or forced their staff to volunteer their time, and just estimated the monetary costs so it looks better on their annual report.

"It truly is the one commonality that every designation of humans you can think of has, there's at least one asshole."
--Me

I may have misinterpretted nowhigger's post, but I thought he meant that for profit businesses who DONATE a lot to charities are cheap assholes and deadbeats who don't pay on time, not the charities themselves. If that's the case, then I will be inclined to agree. My husband's slowest and worst paying clients are hospitals who NO DOUBT treat welfare people at a greatly reduced cost, outright give FREE treatment to the mass of illegals we have around here, and they publically are donating VAST amounts of money to local "disadvantaged" kiddie functions all of the time.

Then there's your chain places like wallyworld and k-mart who are ALWAYS "proud sponsors" for crippled kids, or abuse shelters, and donate space and money to the bell ringers and any other number of charities. Yet, they are ALWAYS the ones who demand discount rates and have to be pestered to death to pay their damned bills. They don't seem to give a SHIT about the independent contractor's family though, when it comes time to test their true charity. I think that's because it is'nt publicized so they are in no big hurry.

Feh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> For profit businesses should not get discounts.
> They work FOR PROFIT and a smart business person
> will put most of that back into the business. A
> smart business person will also want to develop
> good relationships with other business people.
> Whether or not a business gives to charity should
> be irrelevant to what they pay for services from
> other businesses. Depending on the business, when
> they say they've donated X thousands of dollars to
> charity, they've probably actually just donated
> supplies or whatever they weren't using, or forced
> their staff to volunteer their time, and just
> estimated the monetary costs so it looks better on
> their annual report.


I really do not care how they gave, what they did, etc.

They're cheap. They don't pay the bills on time. And they love to brag about how much they give to charity.

Charity starts at home, after you take care of paying your bills on time, paying a fair wage, etc, then you can start giving away to charity.

I only donate money to animal charity, period, end of story. I throw some dollars at the humane society at christmas time and a couple of bird rescues, and that's it.

In general, I hate charity because of the experiences I have had with charity assholes (in our own family) and also in business. Nothing but trouble.

kidlesskim Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I may have misinterpretted nowhigger's post, but I
> thought he meant that for profit businesses who
> DONATE a lot to charities are cheap assholes and
> deadbeats who don't pay on time, not the charities
> themselves. If that's the case, then I will be
> inclined to agree. My husband's slowest and worst
> paying clients are hospitals who NO DOUBT treat
> welfare people at a greatly reduced cost, outright
> give FREE treatment to the mass of illegals we
> have around here, and they publically are donating
> VAST amounts of money to local "disadvantaged"
> kiddie functions all of the time.
>
> Then there's your chain places like wallyworld and
> k-mart who are ALWAYS "proud sponsors" for
> crippled kids, or abuse shelters, and donate space
> and money to the bell ringers and any other number
> of charities. Yet, they are ALWAYS the ones who
> demand discount rates and have to be pestered to
> death to pay their damned bills. They don't seem
> to give a SHIT about the independent contractor's
> family though, when it comes time to test their
> true charity. I think that's because it is'nt
> publicized so they are in no big hurry.


B I N G O

You nailed it perfectly.

I hate charity assholes and this is why.

nowhiggers,

My dad owns a business and is an independent contractor too. He has a GREAT comeback to the assholes when they start up on the first contact about wanting lower rates because THEY so open heartedly donate to charity. He says, "I realize you do and I think that's wonderful! However, I donate to my favorite charities as well, and if I start giving discounts I won't be able to continue to support them and they really count on my businesse's contribution each quarter. I'm sure you understand".

I'm just saying that a lot of times, "charity" donations from businesses are just stuff that they're not using, have written off already, or are forced labor from their staff. It's not like they're taking money out of their profits to donate, they're just donating stuff they want to get rid of. They have no reason to be cheap about the bills because their donations don't come out of their profits.

Without "charity" organizations, at least in my city there would be no free condoms/std testing, no no-kill animal shelter, no golden retriever rescue, no small animal/reptile rescue, no local non-commercial radio, no services for adult mental health, no elder day care and no services for single homeless people that aren't associated with a church. Oh, and we do pay our bills on time.

"It truly is the one commonality that every designation of humans you can think of has, there's at least one asshole."
--Me

kidlesskim Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> nowhiggers,
>
> My dad owns a business and is an independent
> contractor too. He has a GREAT comeback to the
> assholes when they start up on the first contact
> about wanting lower rates because THEY so open
> heartedly donate to charity. He says, "I realize
> you do and I think that's wonderful! However, I
> donate to my favorite charities as well, and if I
> start giving discounts I won't be able to continue
> to support them and they really count on my
> businesse's contribution each quarter. I'm sure
> you understand".


Hey that's a great comeback for these assholes! I'll use that next time!

BTW, regarding those hospitals, I would bet my next paycheck that if your cf husband was without health insurance and asked the hospital to treat him for free via the charity they love to give to the illegals and breeders, they'd tell him to go die in a ditch.

I have a funny hospital story. A few years back I injured my eye pretty bad and had to go to emergency, we had no health ins. Later on we get the bill, it was like 3 grand, and I called the hospital to ask to make payments of $20 a month because we are cf and can't qualify for any medicaid (this was back when we were super broke). Basically, they wouldn't even give me enough charity to allow me to pay them back in full with monthly payments, and turned me over to a collection agency a month after I sent in my first payment to them and told me "We don't have the capability to accept payment plans." They have the capability to give away free shit to everyone but the cf, but couldn't even allow a payment plan for us.

So about 2 months later, I get a call from the collection agency. You know how they are on the phone. I told the bitch straight up... look, when the illegal alien fuckers pay their hospital bill, I'll be happy to pay mine. The collection agency was trying to add some kind of ungodly interest on this bill and I just wasn't going to pay it, period, because I would have been paying it off for the rest of my fucking life. Well the idiot on the other end of the line GASPS and then hung up on me. lol. never heard from them again.

Banks can be cheap assholes too, when it comes to paying their bills. I have had bank clients in my past profession, and would sometimes have to just go to their office and SIT there, until they would write me a check for services rendered, since phone calls and letters had failed. The bad part is that my service was required for them to close refinance and real estate sales loans, and many times the loans would have been closed for MONTHS, but they wouldn't pay me or other vendors who had a hand in the transaction, but THEY financially benefitted and got THEIR slice of the pie because they had the proceeds checks in their grubby little hands.

Yet, they publically donated cash to every welfare mom who became homeless after a trailer fire, they donated cash and coerced their employees to donate cash to United Way and March of Dimes, and they had a Christmas tree that reached the ceiling every year with HUNDREDS of little handmade ornaments which were basically testaments from orphanage kids who they had donated their whole "santa claus" to each year. Then they always had at least one, usually two, crusades going on where they would donate dollar for dollar for all contributions made by the public, for some kid who won't see tomorrow without an emergency operation of some sort.

I don't begrudge their charity to the community, but I think they need to pay their damned bills too, especially when it is owed to individual contractors who are self employed. Many of the contractors they owe would probably like to be able to provide their families with at least a bucket of chicken for Christmas, and perhaps a gift or two under the tree, just like the orphans or any number of the welfare people they so eagerly help.

I don't give to childrens' christmas charities. EVER.