WHY don't these people get it...infertility is a SIGN you shouldn't be breeding!

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It took us almost three years, three doctors, months of daily temperature charts, economy-sized online orders of ovulation predictors and pregnancy tests, four sessions of IUI, and thousands of dollars to conceive our first child. We progressed from hopeful to conscious to timed to hopeless intimacy, and eventually to a separate and ironically “sterile” fertilization. By the time I took the last pregnancy test, the positive one, I had completely lost hope.

So after finally conceiving James, then discovering all his complicated medical problems, it didn’t seem likely that we would be able to have another baby. We didn’t have the money to pay for the fertility treatments; I didn’t even have insurance that covered maternity, let alone another c-section. In March John said the only way we could afford another child in the next few years was if we could get me and the baby on Medicaid while he was still making below the wage requirement of $39,000 a year. That salary would increase on James’s first birthday. So we had a two-month window if we wanted to give God something to work with.

Long story short, little James was born with some bizarre brain malformation that caused all kinds of massive problems...facial deformities, type 1 diabetes from birth, horrible gastric problems requiring tube feeding, retardation, deafness, etc. etc. This of course meant endless doctor visits and tons of specialists, costing an unimaginable amount of money, paid for by YOU AND ME! Elsewhere on the site, we learn that the kid died, mercifully for all involved. And these people are considering trying to conceive another DNA mistake???

This little boy suffered horribly because his moronic breeders INSISTED on ignoring what Nature was trying to tell them. If I were in charge, selfish idiots like these would be BANNED from all assisted reproduction, FOREVER. Even if they paid for it entirely themselves, which of course would NEVER happen.

I hate people.

Agreed - if it doesn't happen naturally, then it's not meant to happen at all. Accept it already and STOP PLAYING GAWD! Especially at tax payers' expense.

There should be no insurance coverage* whatsoever for IVF. It is an elective procedure, and unfortunately so often goes wrong and incurs additional medical care, costing even more. There is no other condition with these characteristics that insurance companies would dream of covering.

* 13 states require insurance companies to offer IVF benefits. They are:

Arkansas

Mandates insurance carriers that provide maternity–related benefits to cover IVF. Allows insurers to impose a lifetime benefit cap of $15,000. Health maintenance organizations are exempt from the law.

Hawaii

Mandates insurance carriers that provide pregnancy–related benefits to cover one cycle of IVF, only after several conditions have been met.

Illinois

Mandates insurance carriers that provide pregnancy–related benefits to cover the diagnosis and treatment of infertility, including various ART procedures, but limits first-time attempts to four complete oocyte (egg) retrievals, and second births to two complete oocyte retrievals. Insurance carriers are not required to provide this benefit to businesses (group policies) of 25 or fewer employees.

Louisiana

Mandates insurance carriers to cover the "diagnosis and treatment of correctable medical conditions." Thus, insurers may not deny coverage for treatment of a correctable medical condition to someone solely because the condition results in infertility. Coverage is not required for fertility drugs; in vitro fertilization or any other assisted reproductive technique; or reversal of tubal ligation, a vasectomy, or any other method of sterilization.

Maryland

Mandates insurance carriers that provide pregnancy–related benefits to cover IVF after a two–year wait following diagnosis, with no wait required for certain diagnoses. Insurance carriers are not required to provide this benefit to businesses (group policies) of 50 or fewer employees. Religious organizations can choose not to provide coverage based on their religious views. A carrier may limit IVF benefits to three attempts per live birth, not to exceed a lifetime maximum benefit of $100,000.

Massachusetts

Mandates insurance carriers that provide pregnancy–related benefits to cover comprehensive infertility diagnosis and treatment, including ART procedures.

Montana

Mandates HMOs (but not other types of insurers) to cover infertility treatment as a basic health care service. The law does not define "infertility services", and some HMOs exclude IVF.

New Jersey

Mandates insurance carriers that provide pregnancy–related benefits to cover comprehensive diagnosis and treatment of infertility, including assisted reproductive technology procedures, but limits attempts to four complete oocyte (egg) retrievals per lifetime. Insurance carriers are not required to provide this benefit to businesses (group policies) of 50 or fewer employees.

New York

Mandates coverage for the diagnosis and treatment of correctable medical conditions. Requires coverage for the diagnosis and treatment of infertility for patients between the ages of 21 and 44, who have been covered under the policy for at least 12 months. Certain procedures are excluded, including IVF, GIFT, reversal of elective sterilization, sex change procedures, cloning, and experimental procedures. Plans that include prescription coverage must cover drugs approved by FDA for use in diagnosis and treatment of infertility (including Ovulation Induction (OI)). The law does not apply to HMOs.

Ohio

Mandates HMOs (but not other types of insurers) to cover infertility treatment as a "preventative" benefit. The treatment must be "medically necessary," and the Ohio Department of Insurance has ruled that GIFT, ZIFT and IVF are not medically necessary.

Rhode Island

Requires insurers and HMOs that provide pregnancy–related benefits to cover the cost of medically necessary expenses of diagnosis and treatment of infertility. The law defines infertility as "the condition of an otherwise healthy married individual who is unable to conceive or produce conception during a period of one year." The patient's co-payment cannot exceed 20 percent.

West Virginia

Mandates HMOs (but not other types of insurers) to cover infertility treatment as a preventative benefit. The law does not define "infertility treatment" and HMOs have interpreted the term as excluding IVF.

from here.

Hellooooo?

Adoption???

But that would be unselfish, Banshee...

Banshee Wrote:
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> Hellooooo?
>
> Adoption???
>
>

Then they would not be able to see a babeey with their DNA. (hurl)

---

lab mom

And an adoptive baby would be booooringly normal -- no malformations and congenital defects to elevate the parents to the status of saints, and maybe make them candidates for a spot on the local news with tinkly piano music playing across the narrative voice-over.

- - - - - - - -
"The death of creativity is a pram in the hallway"
- Cyril Connolly

Totally agree. I don't know why these numbnuts are so persistently trying to have Their Own(TM) when it's been such a collossal disaster. That poor kid lived a short and miserable life due to Moo's and Dud's selfishness.

You newbies missed the Great Moo Debacle that happened a few months ago. Here's the short version: IVF Moo ejected extremely premature fetus, saw that we were discussing how selfish she was and the very real suffering of her kid* and freaked the fuck out. (*Note: she was looking at her REFERRER LOGS. NOBODY trolled her page. She was so insecure and clearly not busy enough with TMIJITW that she wrote a blog entry about us.) Anyway, in about two seconds flat we had a shitstorm of hostile, angry Moos here. Most of them said stuff like: 1. No way to predict what would have happened (even though Moo transferred multiple eggs and it took every medical device known to man to get her pregnasty); 2. if you don't like paying for it, pick another insurance plan (clearly these Moos have been out of the real world too long); 3. It's everyone's RIGHT to have a child and you people are just "hateful" etc.

Nobody ever wants to talk about why we are expending all these medical resources when there are plenty of people here on Earth already. Why do we have to pay (through insurance and shared risk) just so these people can continue their ooooooooown DNA?

And invariably some MooCow will bring out the big C word: If you had cancer, you'd get treated. Well, yes I would. The difference is, not being treated for cancer will likely kill you. Nobody ever died from not having a baybee. IVF is the same as a cosmetic procedure--it doesn't cure anything except for lack of a baybee.

"2. if you don't like paying for it, pick another insurance plan (clearly these Moos have been out of the real world too long)"

Yah. If your employer subscribes to a plan that includes IVF, there ain't much you can do about it, aside from paying megabucks for a different one. Wake up, moos.

Medusa Wrote:
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> Agreed - if it doesn't happen naturally, then it's
> not meant to happen at all. Accept it already and
> STOP PLAYING GAWD! Especially at tax payers'
> expense.

I look at people who are childless (people cannot breed even they want to) and they want IVF to have kids.

And I think Childless couple should be grateful and realise thats this is a mircale and a gift from Gawd not to breed. Becuase they don't have to go thorugh extreme, foul, burden, Wallet-being, drain on their wealth and money like moos go through. Should enjoy life.

Why do these people like to play Gawd by using IVF and waste money to be a moo or duh to go thorugh all this BS? They should be grateful they don't have to put up of all his moo-crap.

Note to CL people: You don't need kids, your life is better how it is.

I have personally known several IVF freaks, and they never cease to amaze me with their outright and overt selfishness. One who stands out to me had TWO grown kyds at this point. Her husband had THREE kids from prior marriages and I suppose she couldn't "compete" since they were elementary school aged. I might add that she was a SHITTY step mother. Since the IVF failed, no small wonder when you are at or in menopause, they bought a baby from China, as adopting a Bi-racial kid for free would have been frowned upon in their "circle".

The money this costs is astounding. I think it's wrong for insurance to cover this, as it isn't life threatening. they want one so bad? They can pay for it.

Rose Red Wrote:
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> The money this costs is astounding. I think it's
> wrong for insurance to cover this, as it isn't
> life threatening. they want one so bad? They can
> pay for it.


I agree. We've all heard stories of people who die because they need a life saving procedure that insurance won't cover. Why the HELL would they cover IVF over something that would save a life? It's all so fucked up!

hell, obama is pushing health coverage for all. picking up insurance premiums AT OUR EXPENSE!! (if I heard it right). And always the push is because of some stoopid famblees defective sprog.
I am going to post a question, because I don't think it is proper here..

If fuck face monkey boy wants to make everybody equal and make everybody cover expenses for everybody, just tell me where in the FUCKING HELL is pride of ownership/accomplishment going to be?

I'm sorry, but I take great pride in knowing I have a good job with good benefits, to know that I worked hard for this job, worked hard for my education, so I could land a good job where I am taken care of and can afford decent things and to save for my retirement years. Same with hubby. We work hard to take care of our home, the pets, our cars. To know that our money that WE EARNED bought us the life we have is very satisfying. We're pleased with ourselves, as we should be.

If people's hard earned money is going to be wasted and pilfered even MORE for the parasites of this country, what kind of society is this going create?

And then we'll all be told we have to be even MORE tolerant, embrace DIVERSITY even MORE and LOVE THY FUCKING NEIGHBOR!!! BULL SHIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

kidlesskim Wrote:
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> they bought a baby from China, as adopting a Bi-racial kid for
> free would have been frowned upon in their
> "circle".

I don't know why some people have a fascination with adopting a child from another country, its almost become a "status symbol" to have a Chinese baby (or baby from other country) these days. Celebrities like Madonna and Angelina Jolie collect children from other countries, like they are little toys or something. Its just WRONG and the cynic in me says they do it for publicity purposes, not for the right reasons.

Casseyrod said:

"I don't know why some people have a fascination with adopting a child from another country, its almost become a "status symbol" to have a Chinese baby (or baby from other country) these days. Celebrities like Madonna and Angelina Jolie collect children from other countries, like they are little toys or something. Its just WRONG and the cynic in me says they do it for publicity purposes, not for the right reasons."

This is really mean, but I know a woman who adopted children from a turd world country. These kids look like they shoud be wearing loin cloths and killing birds with blow darts for dinner. I'm serious, they are National Geographic material. Both of them have learning disabilities which moo loves to talk about. I always feel like I want to tell her that they wouldn't have these disabilities if they were back in the jungle. Hell, they'd be right back at the top of the food chain there, providing they could find enough frogs to make their poison darts with.

"This is really mean, but I know a woman who adopted children from a turd world country. These kids look like they shoud be wearing loin cloths and killing birds with blow darts for dinner. I'm serious, they are National Geographic material. Both of them have learning disabilities which moo loves to talk about. I always feel like I want to tell her that they wouldn't have these disabilities if they were back in the jungle. Hell, they'd be right back at the top of the food chain there, providing they could find enough frogs to make their poison darts with."

Thanks bratBgone, for making me spew perfectly good beer all over my fucking laptop screen!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Well, I had to look, and sure enough I found The Great Moo Debacle thread from this past spring. Holy IVF, Batman! Talk about venom from the mom! Nasty! And....egads, TWENTY-TWO PAGES long!

It was very entertaining, though, mostly.

Hey Clem..wanna fucking SHARE??!! :bawl

str8six Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "This is really mean, but I know a woman who
> adopted children from a turd world country. These
> kids look like they shoud be wearing loin cloths
> and killing birds with blow darts for dinner. I'm
> serious, they are National Geographic material.
> Both of them have learning disabilities which moo
> loves to talk about. I always feel like I want to
> tell her that they wouldn't have these
> disabilities if they were back in the jungle.
> Hell, they'd be right back at the top of the food
> chain there, providing they could find enough
> frogs to make their poison darts with."
>
> Thanks bratBgone, for making me spew perfectly
> good beer all over my fucking laptop
> screen!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


I agree, that is some funny shit. I wonder how many turd world kyds have "disabilities" like ADD/ADHD/AWWTISM and Bi-Polar bear? You also don't see any "thyroid" problems either and kids who are so fucking fat that they can't walk from the car to the front porch without wheezing. Why do all of these obese and ADHD type kids only seem to reside in America, England, or Canada?

Hi str8six (used to have one of those in my old ford f-150 pickup...)

I hesitated to post the thread because I didn't want to possibly stir up an old hornet's nest. The big thing on the thread is NOT to click directly to her blog from the link provided, but copy and paste the link into a new window, and the other big thing was that NO ONE here went to her blog to troll. Both good things that should be observed! That said, here's the link to the thread:

http://www.refugees.bratfree.com/read.php?2,25584,page=1

Hey Clematis, thanks for the memories. I was positively nostalgic as I perused that thread. Why are moos so damned illogical?

And who could forget Schnozz, the Breeder Pleaser, who appears to have her own blog now.

Schnozz wrote about 10 pages where she repeated the same thing over and over: By questioning this woman's choices, we aren't doing something positive for "the CF Cause," Whatever the Hell that is. I would actually kind of agree with HAD ANYONE FROM HERE TROLLED THAT MOO'S BLOG.

None of those Moos could STAND us DISCUSSING the situation over here. Really pathetic. There are 4,569,430 Moo sites where you'll be worshipped if you do IVF and crank out premature loaves, but they all had to tromp over to thr ONE site that did not.

Ah, memories.

Hey Clematis, thanks for the memories. I was positively nostalgic as I perused that thread. Why are moos so damned illogical?

And who could forget Schnozz, the Breeder Pleaser, who appears to have her own blog now.

Schnozz wrote about 10 pages where she repeated the same thing over and over: By questioning this woman's choices, we aren't doing something positive for "the CF Cause," Whatever the Hell that is. I would actually kind of agree with HAD ANYONE FROM HERE TROLLED THAT MOO'S BLOG.

None of those Moos could STAND us DISCUSSING the situation over here. Really pathetic. There are 4,569,430 Moo sites where you'll be worshipped if you do IVF and crank out premature loaves, but they all had to tromp over to thr ONE site that did not.

Ah, memories.