Bingoed by another CFer

I'm talking about Essure and just generally about how my BF and I aren't on the same page about kids on another board. One lady chimed in who said she is childfree and could understand my lack of desire to want kids, but eventually goes on to say, "You're too young to be going around thinking about sterilization. There's some inherently wrong with that/you. To make a decision that permanent at your age is not healthy" This is slightly paraphrased...and was not even said to me, but to someone else about me who replied before her.

I think this was partly prompted by me thinking out loud about getting snipped/Essured on the sly, but in reality I'd never actually do that. Clearly this person did not catch that a stealth sterilization was a 'what if' situation in my case. I like the implication that I am mentally ill for wanting to be responsible about my birth control.

Getting bingoed pisses me off enough, but it just makes me even madder when another childfree person does it. Fuckers. I have serious doubts about the CFness of a CFer who bingoes another CFer.

Do not feel bad. CF people, just like all people, come from different walks of life and have any and all kinds of opinions. It does not matter if someone has not had kids. They may have seen a good number of people "change their minds" so they are probably basing some statements off that. I have had a good number of parents support my decision to not have kids. I had a CF person tell me I need to have kids for whatever reason. Opinions vary, I got my own. Stick to what you want. It is your life, if you are not happy, you will deal with it, not your CF board members.

I am sorry Cambion and I feel your frustration. I am FORTY SIX YEARS OLD, and while I don't look quite that old, even people who know my age STILL say that "You might change your mind". I don't know any CF people in real life other a cousin, so I haven't ever had it said by a CFer in real life, nor have I had any CF on a message board say it either, but they generally know my age too. The only thing that I can figure that may have motivated her to say that was that she had personal experience with someone getting sterilized at a young age and then regretting it, or she thought that you might "give in" later on since your BF appeared to be a fence sitter. I really don't know why, but I can understand your annoyance. I wonder how old a person has to be or look before people stop with the bingos? Maybe when I am old and gray, living in a nursing home, and hobbling around on a walker, they won't ask anymore. However, with these 70 y/o women getting IVF and popping out litters, I suppose I AM still considered prime baybee making age, in comparison to them. m

oooh, my first good CAPTCHA = heeLe
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Cambion, I knew at your age that I never wanted to have children and, if anything, my feelings on the matter have only gotten stronger. That said, I see a big difference between my thought processes now and those I had at 21. I guess that's part of the reason doctors are reluctant to permanently sterilize people under 30 and why even a CF person might say something like that. But I would be pissed, too, particularly since the person was discussing you rather than addressing her post to you. That's disrespectful. And (cliche alert) there are certainly many people your age who are more mature than people 3 and 4 times older. I've only been here a few days, but I can see that you've put more thought into your decision not to have kyds than the majority of people put into having them.

I'm sure you've been asked this before (not to mention that it's pretty personal) so feel free to ignore it, but I've been wondering why you're dating a known wannabreeder and where you see the relationship going. Do you think you will be able to change his mind or are you guys just having fun or what?

I figured this person might have been speaking on behalf of someone they knew who *did* change their minds, but still. I did not like the implication that I am crazy for wanting to be sterilized. Personally, if I knew someone who had a change of mind, I would not use it to bingo another CFer.

anneonimiss,
I'm really not sure how things will work out with DBF and I. We've been together seriously for three and a half years and have known one another for probably four years. He's a wannabreeder, but not ravingly adamant and needing kids right now. And he also told me he doesn't want me to change my mind and that he wants to do his best to try and work the issue out, which makes me think maybe he's going to see if he'll change his mind. We actually had a talk about kids today (without ever once saying the word "children" or "kids" - he called them "burdens" ). I want to try and find out if he actually genuinely wants kids or he just thinks he has to because "that's what adults do" or because he thinks he will just be a nobody and that having kids is something he can brag about that's easy to do. Considering he doesn't even like kids all that much, I think there might be a little light of hope somewhere for us.

I've never been "bingoed" by another CF'er--at least not yet, but I would certainly be annoyed if it happened. Your decision not to have children should be respected by other CF people. And the fact that this CF'er talked about you to a person who replied to the thread is beyond the pale. She might have been thinking of other CF people who were sterilised and then regretted it, but the whole issue of birth control is intensely personal and should be supported in this day and age.

I never thought about getting "bingoed" at my age (55), but with all these cows in their 60s and 70s having litters, it may well happen. Nothing would surprise me these days.

cambion if you need any help in convincing him, let me know i know how to talk male. as do some of the men here, its a different way, but we have all gone through this thought process

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I just post the stories, for interest.. for everyone

Lord, what fools these mortals be!
- A Midsummer Night’s Dream, Act III, Scene ii

Voltaire said: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."

H.L.Mencken wrote:"The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.”

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. Albert Einstein

How could a TRUE CF'er do that to you?

Good lord, if my 5 year old nephew came up to me and said he never wanted kids, I'd be dancing for joy, high-fiving him and telling him to make sure HE NEVER CHANGES HIS MIND!

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Cambion
I'm talking about Essure and just generally about how my BF and I aren't on the same page about kids on another board. One lady chimed in who said she is childfree and could understand my lack of desire to want kids, but eventually goes on to say, "You're too young to be going around thinking about sterilization. There's some inherently wrong with that/you. To make a decision that permanent at your age is not healthy"

Fuckety fucks! I wanted my plumbing out at 22!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

L7PXK

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Cambion
I'm talking about Essure and just generally about how my BF and I aren't on the same page about kids on another board. One lady chimed in who said she is childfree and could understand my lack of desire to want kids, but eventually goes on to say, "You're too young to be going around thinking about sterilization. There's some inherently wrong with that/you. To make a decision that permanent at your age is not healthy" This is slightly paraphrased...and was not even said to me, but to someone else about me who replied before her.

The bolded part is ridiculous. People make equally life-shaping decisions at relatively young ages: knowing they are gay and will choose a same-sex partner; knowing they want to be a teacher, &c. It's insulting to treat others' well-weighed private choices as whimsical notions.

Cambion, I was also shocked when I started posting on childfree lists, as they were called back in 1999, when a male childfree person took me to task for having a tubal. He insisted how the man should be the one sterilized. I was told I had a bad attitude, which would be self-fulfilling, when I told him how a man's vasectomy did not protect me because most relationships are not "forever". So, I was told how I fulfilled the thoughts via the divorces I have had. I was disgusted how another childfree person would denigrate my choices. I was 35 at the time and more than capable of making my own choices about my body and medical care.

Cambion, I kind of understand how it is dating a wannabreeder. My boyfriend is a fence-sitter, and although it's obvious to me that he has no real desire to have children, he also has the idea that it would be good to eventually pass a piece of himself along. He says, "maybe I'll think about it in 6-7 years".

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clematis
People make equally life-shaping decisions at relatively young ages: knowing they are gay and will choose a same-sex partner; knowing they want to be a teacher, &c. It's insulting to treat others' well-weighed private choices as whimsical notions.

Absolutely yes! It is the height of presumption when someone thinks they know what's best for you.

I did also get the usual "You might change your mind" bingo from a parent there, but that just didn't make me seethe nearly as much as the one telling me I'm nuts for wanting to be sterile at 21 (and the fact the person is CF was jut salt in the wound). If I would regret my decision, then I'd be a big girl about it...as I said to those folks, I'd rather regret not having kids than regret having them.

I'm sure if I wanted a baby, though, no one would try and talk me out of it. Because you're never too young to spawn in this culture, but until you hit your 50s, you're too young to decide to be sterilized. Grr.

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Cambion
II have serious doubts about the CFness of a CFer who bingoes another CFer.

I would too. I think someone who truly is CF, wouldn't say somthing like this.

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- The human gene pool could use a little chlorine

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clematis
The bolded part is ridiculous. People make equally life-shaping decisions at relatively young ages: knowing they are gay and will choose a same-sex partner; knowing they want to be a teacher, &c. It's insulting to treat others' well-weighed private choices as whimsical notions.

And no one bats an eye anymore when people make the decision to spawn at a young age...how much bigger a life-shaping decision could there be?

My youngest brother was oopsed by his now wife when they were both 21 and I guarantee neither of them put much thought into it at all. He put in none; she decided they would be vegan and therefore she couldn't stay on the Pill because it contains animal products and he, idiotically, continued to have sex with her using some crazy brand of nuveau hippie condom. She, I'm convinced, put a bit more thought into it, and by that I mean she thought what they all think, "I'm gonna get myself knocked up so he will have to marry me and let me be a SAHMoo." She certainly didn't think farther than that or their house wouldn't have looked like a garbage dump for three years following the birth of their first child (and shortly thereafter, their second - because Moo wanted them to be close in age so they could play together) because she had no idea what having kyds is really like, she just wanted the attention and perceived benefits. Ugh.

Cambion, maybe your BF should take up babysitting for SAHMoos. Seeing how they live and dealing with their brats for a little while would probably go a long way towards changing his mind. Kyds are physical, emotional, and financial vampires.

Or they'll get the guy drunk so he'll forget about a condom. :crz

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lab mom

annieonimiss, I want to try and get DBF to have some sort of interaction with kids. So far, the only interaction he has had is being around his nieces and nephews (who vary in age from 3 to 16) a couple times a year when his sister and brother visit. I think he's good at being an uncle, but I don't think he's ever been around a kid for a really long time or been expected to take care of one for an extended period. I want him to babysit some infants and toddlers, and I would love for him to read Mothering.com...I don't want to make him change his mind, but I want him to at least see what he'd be in for and just hope he changes his mind on his own. If he doesn't, then if we split up, he will have a better understanding of what to look forward to as a Duhddy. I think he has a case of Kodakitis and I want to get him to see that those Kodak moments often either are very rare or nonexistant. Besides, who's to say you can't have Kodak moments with your nephews and nieces? Why can they only be with your own kids? Shit, even folks who like kids often say the best kids are the kind you can spend time with and give back at the end of the day.

I hope this does not sound like I am undermining folks who are sterile, but I think having kids is a far more life-shaping decision than a tubal, or a vas or Essure or a hysterectomy. Depending on the procedure, you'll need to be out of work for a day or fifty to get the surgery and heal afterwards. You pay your hospital bill, or whatever insurance doesn't cover. That's pretty much it unless you happen to suffer a sterilization failure. A few months max of a mild life change and you're set for life. With kids, you have to change all the time for them...buy them new clothes, more diapers, doctor visits, more food, medicine, toys, and new age-appropriate things as they get older. They require a constant supply of money and stuff and many changes, to the point of possibly needing to move, adjusting your sleep schedule, finding work that can be fit into a childcare schedule or that offers daycare options. Last I checked, a tubal or a vasectomy didn't dictate where you can live and where you can work. Having kids impacts your life a fuck of a lot more than being sterile, and yet people can make the choice with little to no thought and everyone will think it's just dandy.

You're exactly right.

Hey cambion I'm 20 (and new to the forum hello everyone! :hello) and I've been trying to seek out Essure also, I would like to get it done in a few years time but unfortunately I don't think Essure is licensed by the NHS in the UK despite the fact I've read success stories of women getting it done here , it's been a bit fustrating for me so far. It also doesn't help when doctors look at you like you're crazy when you utter the word sterilization at appointments either. So I wish you luck if you are trying to get it done eventually or thinking about getting it done and not to give up even if some docs or even family give you grief about it. I also can't believe a true CF person would say that to you either, it sounds like a hesitant fence sitter to me or someone calling themselves childfree and not getting the definition at all . I think it's a great idea to get your BF to do some childcare for a long period of time to actually GET what looking after a baby or a small child entails and that you won't be the one to "do all the mum stuff" in his kodak fantasy. It's a shame true dad confessions has been shut down because a browse through that would have been very educational for him too.

Hey Cambion, I'd be pretty damn miffed, too. Like the others have said, it seems to be a decision that makes people think they know better than you. People can be so horribly presumptuous.

I hope your fencesitting boyfriend decides that he loves YOU more than the potential child you could "give" him. Good luck finding a non-judgemental doctor who will actually perform the damn Essure procedure for you.

Hey there MissMononoke - I recall seeing you forever ago on CFEZ. I'm happy to see some of the more sane folks from there are finding their way over here.

I have not yet begun looking for someone to sterilize me, but I want to eventually. Hopefully DBF won't have a tantrum about it like when I told him I wanted to be sterile before. I don't know why he's so against me being sterile if I'm never going to have kids anyway (then again, DBF has a major thing against any sort of body modification and I think that might have something to do with his inability to accept that desire of mine. It's also why I haven't gotten the eyebrow ring I want so much).

I have heard that Planned Parenthood performs sterilizations on women as young as 18, so that will definitely be where I begin my search.

And as far as the lovely bingo-slinging CFer...unless she was BSing me, she said her BF had gotten a vasectomy. She sounds like your typical CFer: never had the urge to procreate, enjoys her freedom and independence and has a sterile partner. Apparently she doesn't need to lecture her husband on why his sterility is bad because he was older than me when he got the snip. And re-reading the topic, she also told me that I was still a kid (at 21? I fucking think NOT!) and that I am guaranteed to change my mind about a lot of things in my life as I get older. Which is just her insinuating again that I am too young to know what I really want in life, including being sterile. Sorry, but last time I checked, there are no 21-year-old children, or no children who can legally drink. I haven't been a "child" since I was 12. I think she just likes talking down to me because she's in her upper 30s and clearly has a far more worldly view on CFdom than silly little child me.

Hey Cambion , yes it does feel like forever ! How are you? I still ocassionally lurk on CFEZ but I find this forum to be a bit more busy, CFEZ has gotten a bit slow these days but on bratfree there seems to be lots of new posts everyday. I've never heard of a 21 year old CHILD before ethier, I assumed a "kid" loses that luxuary when they hit 18 but when it comes to sterilization even women approaching their FORTIES still get talked down to like naive children. Maybe my solution is a quick trip to an american planned parenthood to get spayed haha ^_^.

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Tiquer

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clematis
People make equally life-shaping decisions at relatively young ages: knowing they are gay and will choose a same-sex partner; knowing they want to be a teacher, &c. It's insulting to treat others' well-weighed private choices as whimsical notions.

Absolutely yes! It is the height of presumption when someone thinks they know what's best for you.

I agree 100%. I couldn't help but notice throughout the years either that THE MOST rabid pro-lifers, who burn up the sidewalks outside of Planned Parenthood clinics every weekend while walking around with their bloody baybee signs, are the worst offenders when it comes to deciding for OTHER PEOPLE what is best for them in terms of having a baybee, or not. NEVER have I EVER heard of any one single case where a pro-lifer, or his "group" as a whole, has "saved a baybee", then bought the mother a house to live in or rented her an apartment, and signed on to pay her food, utilities, medical, clothing, shelter, etc......AND her baybee expenses for 18 years or even for a week for that matter. NOR do they show up with flowers at the hospital after the :"saved baybee" is born, go to the new moomie's house (that they now pay for, presumably) prepare her meals, clean the house, run errands, and baybee sit, change shitty diapers, clean up vomit, and walk the floors during the night while the baybee is sick. They are not even there IN THE BEGINNING to lift a mother fucking finger, so it stands to reason that they will likely skip to scene right over ALL of the headache and expense of the "saved baybee" and his upbringing, and it's doubtful they will finance his college education either, or his wedding, or baybee sit HIS baybee when it's born, and all of the shit in between, etc.......


These people who make life decisions for young women in the form of "save the baybee!!!!!", feel that once the commitment to NOT ABORT has been coerced from the victim, that their job is done. ALL talk and NO action is a cliche' phrase which could be rightfully applied to these assholes. Of course they protest, "There are THOUSANDS of couples waiting to adopt!". WHATEVER. They need to complete that statement, .............waiting to adopt healthy, white, infants......." Unless they are the ones who will adopt this "saved baybee", then they need to STFU and put down their offensive and magnified by 1,000,0000 times bloody "baybees" who are "killed" by a first trimester abortion. I absolutey hold a special place of hatred in my heart for these people, perhaps they rank a hate notch above "regular" breeders even because they mess with young, vulnerable, confused, and often frightened young women and use her current situation against her, rather than try and help. These rabid pro-lifers skip out faster than most baybee daddys. I hope that they trip and fall over their signs as they flee and choke to death on their cheap plastic "Fetus necklaces".

miss you may want to have a look at this site. you can email them for information (i am uk based as well but male


http://www.essure.co.uk/consumer/c_homepage.aspx

*********************************************************************************************************************************
I just post the stories, for interest.. for everyone

Lord, what fools these mortals be!
- A Midsummer Night’s Dream, Act III, Scene ii

Voltaire said: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."

H.L.Mencken wrote:"The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.”

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. Albert Einstein