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Women who die are "Mawms," but women who kill are "Wives"

Posted by bell_flower 
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bell_flower
Women who die are "Mawms," but women who kill are "Wives"
January 29, 2011
Okay, how about a news story with reverse Mawm-ism?

It's filled with rednecky goodness: Mawm, aka Delilah Wiley, appears to be white trash and works at a concrete plant with her husband. She has an affair with a co-worker and gives him a big (untrue) sob story that she's a battered wife. Dumb Dude, aka Clagon, pumps the husband with three bullets from a 12 gauge shotgun in the parking lot as the shifts are changing.

Note what a sweetheart Mawm is:

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She was very clear to Mr. Clagon through letters she had written to him, and through text messages she had sent him, that she really wanted to be with him," Hogan said. "And the best way to be with him was if her husband was taken care of."

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Hogan said Wiley claimed that she was being physically abused by her husband and couldn't take it anymore, but investigators found "no credible evidence … that there was anything to the level that she had described."

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In fact, in the days and weeks before the killing, Delilah Wiley and her husband had traded text messages saying how much they loved each other, Hogan said.

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On March 31, the day before the slaying, Delilah Wiley sent her husband a text message that she was drunk at a friend's house and couldn't get home.
Presumably, he was watching the kyds during her tryst.

newspaper story

Here's the headline:

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Woman pleads guilty in plot to kill her husband outside Chester plant in 2008

Note the last line of the story:

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Delilah and Dell Wiley were married two years and had two children.

ORly?

So I ask you, Gentle Readers, what would have happened if Dell Wiley had a girlfriend who killed Delilah with a shotgun in such a pre-meditated fashion? Would there not have been a public outcry about this evil other woman and her husband conspiring to kill a Mawm?

Would there not be EXHAUSTIVE coverage of this Mawm's death and family interviews and hand-wringing about the fate of the children? Any question that the adulterers both wouldn't have got the SHOT IN THE ARM, aka lethal injection? (Virginia and Texas are neck-and-neck when it comes to the application of the death penalty.) So why is this bitch allowed to skate on second degree murder?

When a Mawm is killed, we are bombarded with her Mawm status. "Mawm Missing." "Mawm Killed." But when a Mawm engaged in bad behavior, her reproductive status is relegated to the LAST LINE of a story and barely gets a mention? Furthermore, what about the victim, a guy who was just doing his job? Where is the outrage over him? Not even a feeble mention that he was a father, or just a person who didn't deserve to get three bullets in his head?

I think we all know the answer to these questions.
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Christhead
Re: Women who die are "Mawms," but women who kill are "Wives"
January 29, 2011
Interesting point. I'm curious to see if we could compile more examples of this. I think everytime a human being does anything worth noting, whether it be a guy or a father or a wife or grandmother or whatever, they should only really be identified by their gender ("Woman does this" or "Man finds this," not "Mom heads successful fundraiser," etc.) unless they're somebody of actual importance making actual contributions to the world beyond spawn (for example, scientist or professor).
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JoJo
Re: Women who die are "Mawms," but women who kill are "Wives"
January 29, 2011
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She was very clear to Mr. Clagon through letters she had written to him, and through text messages

What a dumbass! You don't put things like that in writing!
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kidlesskim
Re: Women who die are "Mawms," but women who kill are "Wives"
January 29, 2011
There are also plenty of documentaries and shows entitled, "When Moms Kill", as if it's somehow worse that a mother could or would commit murder, although it probably IS worse when the victim is her own kid. The media just slants the story to suit their needs and if they think that they will get more headlines and sell more papers, then they'll say whatever it takes. You can bet that if the murder plot involved any children that "Mom plans murder!" would have been plastered all over the news. I think that this story honed in on the "wife" aspect due to her being white and having a non Caucasian boyfriend. Since it's politically incorrect to make it all about race, then they just indirectly played up the racial aspect of it to garner more attention. Otherwise, the murderer's race would have NEVER entered into it. It's basically a duped boyfriend who was manipulated into killing an alleged abusive husband and this is actually quite common.

She should be charged with conspiracy to commit murder and get the same sentence as the shooter, IMO.

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If YOU are the "exception" to what I am saying, then why does my commentary bother you so much?
I don't hate your kids, I HATE YOU!
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yurble
Re: Women who die are "Mawms," but women who kill are "Wives"
January 29, 2011
Surely it should have read: Woman pleads guilty in plot to kill father of two outside Chester plant in 2008

Christhead, I would like something similar, but taken a step further by not even mentioning the victim's or perp's sex in headlines.
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bell_flower
Re: Women who die are "Mawms," but women who kill are "Wives"
January 29, 2011
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Christhead, I would like something similar, but taken a step further by not even mentioning the victim's or perp's sex in headlines.

Could you elaborate? I think identifying whether someone is male or female is okay.

I agree there should be no mention of whether someone is a mother or father in the headline, because it has shit-all to do with the story. It doesn't mean the person is any less dead or assaulted or less of a criminal, whatever.
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zatoth
Re: Women who die are "Mawms," but women who kill are "Wives"
January 29, 2011
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yurble
Surely it should have read: Woman pleads guilty in plot to kill father of two outside Chester plant in 2008

Christhead, I would like something similar, but taken a step further by not even mentioning the victim's or perp's sex in headlines.


not saying whether it is a man or a woman is like not saying whether the criminal is black, white, asian or whatever. giving a description of a criminal is not being racist or sexist. using crap like "person kills mother of three" is unnecessary, though
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yurble
Re: Women who die are "Mawms," but women who kill are "Wives"
January 30, 2011
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bell_flower
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Christhead, I would like something similar, but taken a step further by not even mentioning the victim's or perp's sex in headlines.

Could you elaborate? I think identifying whether someone is male or female is okay.

I agree there should be no mention of whether someone is a mother or father in the headline, because it has shit-all to do with the story. It doesn't mean the person is any less dead or assaulted or less of a criminal, whatever.

Okay, I'll try to explain my views. This is a bit of a detour!

I think that sex organs are relevant in a limited set of circumstances, such as reproduction and sexual attraction. Sex is not relevant for the majority of human interactions, and yet our language, which encourages identifying people by gender, and which has different pronouns for different genders, encourages this distinction.

Suppose I am interviewing for a job. What's the most important thing I can find out about this person in advance? Would it be that the person is of Asian descent? Would it be that the person has brown eyes? Would it be that the person is 52 years old? Would it be that the person is male? I'd much rather know whether the person has a technical background or a management background. Sex is as irrelevant to me as the other details I listed.

When I think of myself, my sex is one thing which defines me, but by far it is not the most important thing which makes me the person I am. If my sex has had more of an impact in my life than other physical characteristics, I attribute that to society. But if I were to pick one word to describe myself, that word would not be 'female,' as other characteristics are much more 'me' than my sex. Yet sex is exactly the one thing that someone learns about me, upon seeing my name written as Ms. Yurble rather than Mr. Yurble.


If I am the victim of an armed mugging, is the fact that I am a woman relevant, unless there has been a rash of similar crimes targeting victims with this common trait? Would you expect to see a headline reading: Redhead mugged a gunpoint or 5'6" person victim of robbery? Personally, I'd be rather surprised to see those headlines, and if I did, I would imagine that it was because that person was the 10th redhead to be mugged that month, and there had been no muggings involving people with other haircolors. It wouldn't just be thrown in there because the editor thought it would be an interesting characteristic to define the victim.

I'm not saying that the paper is being deliberately sexist. This method of identifying people primarily by sex is widespread in society, and supported by our language. But imagine if our pronouns distinguished on the basis of race. Wouldn't that feel strange, and vaguely racist?

Yesterday, Oprah was in my city. They were filming bler in the park and I had to detour. Her guest was Nicole Kidman, and whi was talking about her gestational carrier. They had Brad Pitt there, too, but whi was just standing around looking confused. Jesse Jackson was there, too, and I don't think ble knew why, either.

It's because we're used to differentiating people on the basis of sex that it seems normal and doesn't appear to carry any overtones.
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cassia
Re: Women who die are "Mawms," but women who kill are "Wives"
January 30, 2011
I also do not view myself as defined primarily by gender.
I have very little in common with many traditional women.
Many of my attitudes, experiences, interests and hobbies define me more than gender.
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zatoth
Re: Women who die are "Mawms," but women who kill are "Wives"
January 30, 2011
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yurble
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bell_flower
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Christhead, I would like something similar, but taken a step further by not even mentioning the victim's or perp's sex in headlines.

Could you elaborate? I think identifying whether someone is male or female is okay.

I agree there should be no mention of whether someone is a mother or father in the headline, because it has shit-all to do with the story. It doesn't mean the person is any less dead or assaulted or less of a criminal, whatever.

Okay, I'll try to explain my views. This is a bit of a detour!

I think that sex organs are relevant in a limited set of circumstances, such as reproduction and sexual attraction. Sex is not relevant for the majority of human interactions, and yet our language, which encourages identifying people by gender, and which has different pronouns for different genders, encourages this distinction.

Suppose I am interviewing for a job. What's the most important thing I can find out about this person in advance? Would it be that the person is of Asian descent? Would it be that the person has brown eyes? Would it be that the person is 52 years old? Would it be that the person is male? I'd much rather know whether the person has a technical background or a management background. Sex is as irrelevant to me as the other details I listed.

When I think of myself, my sex is one thing which defines me, but by far it is not the most important thing which makes me the person I am. If my sex has had more of an impact in my life than other physical characteristics, I attribute that to society. But if I were to pick one word to describe myself, that word would not be 'female,' as other characteristics are much more 'me' than my sex. Yet sex is exactly the one thing that someone learns about me, upon seeing my name written as Ms. Yurble rather than Mr. Yurble.


If I am the victim of an armed mugging, is the fact that I am a woman relevant, unless there has been a rash of similar crimes targeting victims with this common trait? Would you expect to see a headline reading: Redhead mugged a gunpoint or 5'6" person victim of robbery? Personally, I'd be rather surprised to see those headlines, and if I did, I would imagine that it was because that person was the 10th redhead to be mugged that month, and there had been no muggings involving people with other haircolors. It wouldn't just be thrown in there because the editor thought it would be an interesting characteristic to define the victim.

I'm not saying that the paper is being deliberately sexist. This method of identifying people primarily by sex is widespread in society, and supported by our language. But imagine if our pronouns distinguished on the basis of race. Wouldn't that feel strange, and vaguely racist?

Yesterday, Oprah was in my city. They were filming bler in the park and I had to detour. Her guest was Nicole Kidman, and whi was talking about her gestational carrier. They had Brad Pitt there, too, but whi was just standing around looking confused. Jesse Jackson was there, too, and I don't think ble knew why, either.

It's because we're used to differentiating people on the basis of sex that it seems normal and doesn't appear to carry any overtones.

there is a difference to what you are saying. if you are viewing applicants to a job, the audience is different (you and your bosses') and the goal is different (you are filling a position). a news story is aimed at the public and is relaying information to that public. imagine a news story where the following description is given:

"the suspect was 5' 5", was stocky build and had long brown hair."

there is nothing wrong indicating gender.
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kidlesskim
Re: Women who die are "Mawms," but women who kill are "Wives"
January 30, 2011
I like to know ALL details about people in the news, especially victims. I want to know their age, gender, race, religion, marital status, sexual orientation, occupation, location, etc........I don't know why exactly, although it may come to me later, but I just do. What I do NOT like to see though is someone's death or accomplishment glorified because they are a parent. THAT DOES get on my nerves because it implies that they, what happened to them, or what they accomplished is more important BECAUSE they have kids. It doesn't bother me if their parental status is just mentioned like any other fact about them, but that's generally not the case. I like full disclosure about ALL facts surrounding "stories" and I hate it when they leave anything out and then follow it up with, "More details later as they become available ".angry smiley

THIS is why I wouldn't be a good juror. I want to know EVERYTHING about the victim AND the defendant including prior arrests and convictions and I also want to know their COMPLETE histories. I also want to know each and every detail surrounding the crime, NOT just what either side is able to get entered into evidence, but that's just me.

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If YOU are the "exception" to what I am saying, then why does my commentary bother you so much?
I don't hate your kids, I HATE YOU!
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zatoth
Re: Women who die are "Mawms," but women who kill are "Wives"
January 30, 2011
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kidlesskim
I like to know ALL details about people in the news, especially victims. I want to know their age, gender, race, religion, marital status, sexual orientation, occupation, location, etc........I don't know why exactly, although it may come to me later, but I just do. What I do NOT like to see though is someone's death or accomplishment glorified because they are a parent. THAT DOES get on my nerves because it implies that they, what happened to them, or what they accomplished is more important BECAUSE they have kids. It doesn't bother me if their parental status is just mentioned like any other fact about them, but that's generally not the case. I like full disclosure about ALL facts surrounding "stories" and I hate it when they leave anything out and then follow it up with, "More details later as they become available ".angry smiley

THIS is why I wouldn't be a good juror. I want to know EVERYTHING about the victim AND the defendant including prior arrests and convictions and I also want to know their COMPLETE histories. I also want to know each and every detail surrounding the crime, NOT just what either side is able to get entered into evidence, but that's just me.

i sometimes understand it is the sympathy angle. a murderer kills a woman and they mention her being married or having kids because her death does have an impact on her family obviously. but when it is all about her being a mother while totally ignoring any other victims who were not parents, it is obnoxious.
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kidlesskim
Re: Women who die are "Mawms," but women who kill are "Wives"
January 30, 2011
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zatoth
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kidlesskim
I like to know ALL details about people in the news, especially victims. I want to know their age, gender, race, religion, marital status, sexual orientation, occupation, location, etc........I don't know why exactly, although it may come to me later, but I just do. What I do NOT like to see though is someone's death or accomplishment glorified because they are a parent. THAT DOES get on my nerves because it implies that they, what happened to them, or what they accomplished is more important BECAUSE they have kids. It doesn't bother me if their parental status is just mentioned like any other fact about them, but that's generally not the case. I like full disclosure about ALL facts surrounding "stories" and I hate it when they leave anything out and then follow it up with, "More details later as they become available ".angry smiley

THIS is why I wouldn't be a good juror. I want to know EVERYTHING about the victim AND the defendant including prior arrests and convictions and I also want to know their COMPLETE histories. I also want to know each and every detail surrounding the crime, NOT just what either side is able to get entered into evidence, but that's just me.

i sometimes understand it is the sympathy angle. a murderer kills a woman and they mention her being married or having kids because her death does have an impact on her family obviously. but when it is all about her being a mother while totally ignoring any other victims who were not parents, it is obnoxious.


This is what I meant to convey and I agree! I think that I like to know all of the details because of several reasons, the main ones being that I 1)Am very nosy 2)Knowing details helps me to form my own opinions 3) I don't like reporters dictating to me how I should feel about something or determining what I need to know. For instance, this shit splashed on headline news lately about the 4 y/o boy being "....snatched from his grandmother's arms!!!!" is rather misleading because his moo's crazy ex boyfriend was the one doing the snatching. Upon further reading, the boy's moo cunt is inpig with this nut's baybee. I am sorry, but "Boy snatched from his grandmother's arms" tends to make one draw a different conclusion without knowing the REST of the story. We might believe that there's a psycho just randomly snatching kids from grandmothers in broad daylight if we listened to reporters or only read the headlines.

That's just an example, but like they say, "Inquiring minds want to know".

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If YOU are the "exception" to what I am saying, then why does my commentary bother you so much?
I don't hate your kids, I HATE YOU!
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