Club Juana

This strip club was closed due to eminent domain in my area. One man -- probably a undersexed family man -- wrote to the paper of how the club owner was a pimp for selling drinks with the lure of women stripping. He also claimed that strippers are nasty, selfish, narcissisic women who only think of themselves. Many women in the sex industry are trying to make better money than they would as a food server, department store clerk, or receptionist. Even if some of the gals do enjoy their work, I don't see it as any moral "crime".

As for being a narcissist, I find that the bridezillas top the cake and then the pregnant moos-to-be who milk these occasions for gifts and attentions. Ever been behind the scenes before a wedding? The nasty self-absorbed behaviour of the bride says it all with her screaming for everything that better be perfect. I know a hairdresser and a make-up artist who do weddings to make extra $$$. It is not a fun gig at all! The male letter writer is probably angry that the wifey has the short leash on him so he cannot enjoy the "view" at any of these strip clubs.

I agree with you, India.

---

lab mom

but have you noticed male strip clubs are somehow ok, but female ones are bad.. i bet if it was a male strip club, no one would be complaining

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I just post the stories, for interest.. for everyone

Lord, what fools these mortals be!
- A Midsummer Night’s Dream, Act III, Scene ii

Voltaire said: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."

H.L.Mencken wrote:"The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.”

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. Albert Einstein

I've known 2 women who worked as strippers, both in their 30's. They only did it to pay their way through college, then on to grad school. One has a Ph. D. They've got 0 debt and kick ass educations at top schools. They hated every minute of it but kept focused on their goals in life. And they are confirmed CF'ers!

I feel sorry for the women who feel they "have" to do it because they "can't" do anything else. They money is good all around but it's not a great way to make a living. It's demeaning, sexist, and sometimes can be dangerous.

There are an enormous amount of strip clubs in my area. Some of the women who work there are skanks, but hell, so are some of the women who work at McDonalds! Many of these women are either putting themselves through school, or earning a living for their family. One thing I do know is that a large majority of them make more money than the teachers in my area. I used to toy with the idea of doing it to pay off my student loans, but of course I'd be crucified for doing so being a teacher, plus it's dangerous and demeaning, and I'm not a very good dancer!

It's nice the way you guys are snowing yourselves over about strippers. I dislike fundies as much as the next guy, probably more, but most strippers are leeching drug addict whores. I've known quite a few of them personally. Not by my choice, but a relative of mine. 'Stripper with a heart of gold' is a fucking myth.

Everyone basically prostitutes themselves. We do it on the job interview when we are trying to sell ourselves to a potential employer...often if the wage is far from fair. Women prostitute themselves when they seek a man with money for marrige. How about the woman who goes to bed with her boyfriend after he gets her that piece of jewelry for Valentine's Day? V-Day is one of the biggest "holidays" for women prostituting themselves in different ways.

People who are so concerned at what strippers do are usually angry that these women do earn more money than a woman who works as a receptionist. Pay for sex has been around since the beginning of time. Outlawing it to make someone feel better about her/his "morals" will not make this go away. Stripping is a dangerous profession and a lot of the strippers do end up on drugs. However, the drug issue is no different than a woman...or a man...who works in the corporate world and then goes home or to a bar to drown their sorrows via alcoholism.

i dont like strippers myself, but i hate the double rules women make about male strippers

*********************************************************************************************************************************
I just post the stories, for interest.. for everyone

Lord, what fools these mortals be!
- A Midsummer Night’s Dream, Act III, Scene ii

Voltaire said: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."

H.L.Mencken wrote:"The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.”

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. Albert Einstein

I never understood why there is the double standard about male strippers. Just my own opinion...but I notice that women who frequent male strip clubs tend to be desperate. Male strippers tend to be more in control than females in the same profession. It is not as dangerous for a man to work as a stripper because the female customers tend to be the "desperate housewife" type or are out-on-the-town for a pre-wedding party for a friend. Also, they go ga-ga over these guys who would not give them the time of day in "real life". Those dollar bills are what counts...

i have seen women basically rape men in those joints, theres been documentaries about it, the no touching rule for women, there isnt one for men strippers, when asked they say oh its a giggle, its a laugh, men generally sit alone, and not get involved

*********************************************************************************************************************************
I just post the stories, for interest.. for everyone

Lord, what fools these mortals be!
- A Midsummer Night’s Dream, Act III, Scene ii

Voltaire said: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."

H.L.Mencken wrote:"The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.”

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. Albert Einstein

Sure, India, sure. Nice excuses. I don't think you know any strippers IRL. This must be feminism at work. I am not angry at, and don't give a damn about how much money these women make, so nice assumption.

I believe Mercurior about the women that go to Chippendale's. Why do people keep insisting that women are above base behaviour?

its the women are angels routine, or the the most important job in the world syndrome. women are told they are better, they deserve better, that any of their negative points are actually good points.

but a mans good points are bad points and bad points are worse..

people should be treated equally, ame rules same laws.. bad behaviour is bad behaviour, whether its done by a poster girl for feminism or by a man.

there may be ok strippers out there, but they are rare and far between. i prefer looking at really real woman, rather than the fake jobs, fake smiles, fake breasts, fake everything. reality is much preferable.. and nicer..

but i can see why some men go to get away from the moos; and the brats.. not many brats go to a strip club..

*********************************************************************************************************************************
I just post the stories, for interest.. for everyone

Lord, what fools these mortals be!
- A Midsummer Night’s Dream, Act III, Scene ii

Voltaire said: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."

H.L.Mencken wrote:"The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.”

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. Albert Einstein

I think one of the reasons we see more female strip clubs than male is the fact that men are more visually stimulated than women. I went to a male strip club in college, and it really didn't do anything for me except give me a good laugh at watching some of the women act drunkenly stupid. The club I was at had a no touching rule.

Sherz Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think one of the reasons we see more female
> strip clubs than male is the fact that men are
> more visually stimulated than women. I went to a
> male strip club in college, and it really didn't
> do anything for me except give me a good laugh at
> watching some of the women act drunkenly stupid.
> The club I was at had a no touching rule.

I could not of said it better myself.

Living in Central Florida, you cannot help but know strippers. They are in almost every apartment complex. I pesonally don't care how these women make their money. I also do not feel that women are above certain behaviour, either. If you are angry re: my post, SubstanceD, I am truly sorry you feel that way and hope we could discuss it civilly. If not...oh well!

It's not that they dance naked in a club for money, it's the LIFESTYLE they lead: on drugs, whoring themselves out, only caring what they can get from men. Lots of times, it's not just some poor widdle innocent woman trying to pay for college. I'm not angry at your post per se, India, I'm cross with the perception that lots of feminists have of strippers as poor innocent sweethearts. They are manipulative, and use a man all they can, and then move on to the next, and lots of times they are drug addicts and thieves.

I do understand exactly where you are coming from, SubstanceD. Unfortunately, I got to know a former friend's sister too well who was and may be a stripper again. The woman's sister got fat and unattractive after childbirth so I cannot imagine her being in that line of work again. Yet...I've seen it all living in Central Florida! Comng from San Francisco, you would think I would be a little more savvy. However, strip clubs in the City are relegated to certain areas. I also do not feel sorry for the men. They know what they are doing when they go into strip clubs or pick up a prostitute. It is not as if they are looking for the virginal girlfriends to take home to their mothers or even for a girlfriend who can make good conversation.

and women know what they are doing going to these male strip clubs, remember all the hysteria over the chippendales, and the other male stripper groups.. you never get that with men, strippers are selling a fake idea. that they can have it, and they build up a negative idea of people, men who go there think women like it, they dont, well most dont, but the women still do it, for money or drugs or other unknown reasons.. to give these women a positive image in the press and in public, is a disservice to women and men ..

it reminds me of the film from hell, about jack the ripper, all those prostitutes had perfect teeth, heart of gold, etc etc.. when if you read the accounts all his victims was less than 6 foot tall, they had all lost front teeth, and werent in the best of shapes.. but they did it to survive.. to live.. not to make hundreds of dollars, but to live, but even then many died of cold and hunger.

thats the perception of strippers out there. that should be out there, not the heart of gold.. if there is, then they are rare.. but since prostitution is frowned upon, by society well most societies, stripping has become the poster child for the new idea that female strippers are somehow empowering themselves.. (whereas before they werent, in about 20 year its reversed)

i am a male, and i am glad to say i have never ever been to a strip club in my life i have see tv shows and videos taken by women i knew.

and i find strippers to be a deeply sad class of people,

*********************************************************************************************************************************
I just post the stories, for interest.. for everyone

Lord, what fools these mortals be!
- A Midsummer Night’s Dream, Act III, Scene ii

Voltaire said: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."

H.L.Mencken wrote:"The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.”

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. Albert Einstein

Fat and unattractive, Ouch. Why do people always seem to think these 2 concepts go hand in hand?

Denise, you are right. Fat and unattractive do not go hand-in-hand. I do apologize for that statement. With my former friend's sister, it was very true. Part of the unattractive part of the woman was her nasty, breeder entitlement-minded attitude.

i have a neighbour she is nuts, she sees flying feathered rats.. i call her a fat slug because of who she is not coz i think that fat is bad, just in her case i hate her.. (unfortunatly she is a distant counsin)

*********************************************************************************************************************************
I just post the stories, for interest.. for everyone

Lord, what fools these mortals be!
- A Midsummer Night’s Dream, Act III, Scene ii

Voltaire said: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."

H.L.Mencken wrote:"The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.”

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. Albert Einstein

Wow. I work with strippers AND prostitutes, and they definetly are not one in the same. Prostitution, simply and legally, is trading sexual contact for things of value. Stripping is taking off your clothes for money. Most municipalities do have regulations which dictate what a stripper (male or female) can wear, or do with/to a customer. Most of those regulations stipulate there is to be no sexual touching by the customer (when tipping a male stripper, you can put the money in his g-string, you can not grab his package), but a stripper may touch a customer (a female stripper may smoosh her boobs in a customers face, a customer may not grab said boobs). Now, whether or not a strip club follows these rules are a whole nother issue, clubs sometimes "allow" for more contact by the strippers than is allowed in the law. Very few clubs allow for customers to have more contact which is a simple safety issue, if your strippers are being molested, they generally aren't going to return to work in your club. Clubs generally get busted when customers complain, most areas do not post "morals police" in clubs to enforce the law.

Strippers, just like the rest of us, are INDIVIDUALS, and do not make up some sort of hive mind of sex workers. Men and women strip for a wide variety of reasons, and work in a very difficult field physically and psychologically. Male strippers are quite common in gay bars, so don't assume they're any less suceptable to accepting "extra work", are any less image obsessed, or have any less danger than a female stripper. Yes, it's alot easier to buy bigger perminant boobs, but the size of one's package can be just as easily faked, and if you're a man, dancing for men? You'd better be delivering an impressive freaking package.

Drugs? If you consider that strippers are basically people working on the fringes of legality, and scorned by most of society, it's not too much of a stretch to think that they probably have a more intimate knowledge of, and easier access to drugs than your average person. That said, it's also incorrect to assume that all strippers are drug addicts, stripping is a very physical profession. You have to be fit to take off your clothes in a sexy manner while wearing 7 inch heels. If you're a dude, you'd better have a torso a person could wash clothes on. Yes, a larger number of them are, but there are actual reasons for it beyond, "oh those strippers just won't stop having fun".

Sex work is not a noble, safe or healthy profession, but it is a profession, and people who choose to work in it are, for the most part, expected to act as professionals. They work for tips, and to get those tips, they've got to be friendly, coherent, and able to fufil the visual fantasies of the people watching. It's a lot more than just taking off your pants and dancing naked like you do in your living room.

"This must be feminism at work"

OK that one really ticked me off. I keep seeing the "F" word tossed around like it is a bad thing. This is particularly the case with men who have been burned by a woman, or who think women should just shut up, get pregnant and stay in the kitchen. Sorry but I really hate it when people talk about feminism like it's a bad thing.

"This must be feminism at work"

Hell, I'm not even sure what this means? Is it bad to stand up for strippers? If you don't like the idea of a person taking off their clothes for money, I do not believe anyone is REQUIRED to visit a strip club, or hire an escort.

And there's something that most folks don't think about when they whine about the strip club down the street...escort services. Did you know that escorts are supposedly just "on call" strippers, who will show up at your location and take off their clothes in private for you? That way, some guy can get a person, ALONE, in their residence or hotel room, with no supervision or protection, to take off their clothes. Hmmmm... I guess the folks who whine about strip clubs don't mind as long as the groping and rape happens in private with no security to stop it.

the thing is, i have heard feminist groups stating that strippers are degenerates for pandering to the male libido, the other groups say, they are being empowered by controlling the male libido.

i think both are immoral, but its the rules that allow women to act like animals towards male strippers, is wrong.. they are given greater leeway..

now imagine this was a woman that was grabbed, look at the duke lacrosse thing, prostiutes and strippers, are lauded in a lot of press


***http://www.nbc5.com/news/2433287/detail.html

MCHENRY COUNTY, Ill. -- The Daily Herald reported that 52-year-old Jacqueline A. McMahon pleaded guilty Monday to a misdemeanor charge for attacking a male stripper at her daughter's bachelorette party. In a plea bargain, the paper reported, McMahon was sentenced to 30 days court supervision and ordered to pay $2,500 to the victim.

Police said the 28-year-old stripper suffered head injuries, bruises and scratches when he was attacked with fists and hit over the head with a bottle after performing at the party on July 13, 2003, at a Holiday Inn in Crystal Lake, Ill.

The stripper showed up later than expected, police said, and he was not the dancer the women had requested.

"He was covering for a buddy," police told the newspaper.

The man ended his performance early, police said, and the defendants claimed he had not paid "enough attention to the bride," according to the paper. When the victim tried to collect his fee, the women refused to pay and attacked him, police said.

The $2,500 restitution fee was for medical bills, including a computerized tomography scan, and for the cost of his clothes, which were torn during the assault, according to the paper**

so its ok for women to basically assault male strippers, thats what i meant by feminism, and before someone says serves men right, for all the stuff men did in the past.. 2 wrongs do no make a right, where is this ah, women are better than men.

**http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stripper#Male_strippers

Visits by women to clubs featuring male exotic dancers, usually as a group for an activity such as a bachelorette party, have now become part of mainstream culture in Western countries. Unlike the enforced sedate atmosphere at clubs featuring female exotic dancers for male audiences, the female audience for male strippers is very vocal, rowdy, and even aggressive. Female patrons getting up on stage with the male exotic dancers and helping them strip or joining them stripping is commonplace. Usually, the nightclub management and their bouncers do not try to restrain their female audiences unless disturbances and fights break out. Female patrons tend to "push the envelope" to see how far they're allowed to go. Most commonly, it is the female patrons testing the boundaries who are the ones that start restraining themselves before the bouncers do.**

just try to reverse your thinking for a moment, would it be ok for men to be treated like that, is it ok for men to be seen as sex objects like some women do, whats wrong for one group is wrong for the other.

there is no mystical its ok if its a woman who does it, and its wrong if a man does.. wrong is wrong..

*********************************************************************************************************************************
I just post the stories, for interest.. for everyone

Lord, what fools these mortals be!
- A Midsummer Night’s Dream, Act III, Scene ii

Voltaire said: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."

H.L.Mencken wrote:"The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.”

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. Albert Einstein