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Smothering - Dr. Amy looks at the homebirth deaths

Posted by law 
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law
Smothering - Dr. Amy looks at the homebirth deaths
June 03, 2011
Mothering.com has inadvertently become one of the best places to learn about the deadly consequences of homebirth. Babies of MDC mothers routinely die preventable deaths at homebirth, and the moderators routinely remove any discussions about safety in connection with these deaths. In other words, they attempt to sweep the dead babies out of sight.

For a two year period, I kept track of the homebirth deaths to determine just how frequent they are. In the years 2007-2008, there were more than 20 preventable homebirth deaths on Mothering. com, as well as additional cases of anoxic brain damage. Keep in mind that these are the cases that were reported; there may have been more.

Preventable homebirth deaths on MDC 2007:

Homebirth Deaths from MDC
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StudioFiftyFour
Re: Smothering - Dr. Amy looks at the homebirth deaths
June 03, 2011
Bummer.
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loavesstillsuck
Re: Smothering - Dr. Amy looks at the homebirth deaths
June 03, 2011
I personally know a guy whose mother and father were chiropractors and they had two home births. This guy would have died had his father not known how to do a particular type of chiropractic adjustment (I don't know what it does, but essentially the baby was starved for oxygen and this adjustment saved him.) Now, how many smothers have an experienced chiropractor husband helping them with their home birth? I'll bet not many. And what about breech births and so forth? Nobody is trained to deal with that because midwives are a dying breed and the medical Gestapo has seen fit to train all its doctors to only do Caesarians in the case of breech births instead of delivering the babies vaginally. Nobody can handle the complications that come with home births anymore, unfortunately.
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kidlesskim
Re: Smothering - Dr. Amy looks at the homebirth deaths
June 03, 2011
I have mixed emotions on this one. bouncing and laughing

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If YOU are the "exception" to what I am saying, then why does my commentary bother you so much?
I don't hate your kids, I HATE YOU!
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yurble
Re: Smothering - Dr. Amy looks at the homebirth deaths
June 03, 2011
I still think this is very much a cultural issue. Here, home births are rather common--the highest levels in Europe, I believe--and there is relatively low infant mortality. But the system is set up to support this, with midwifes being part of the medical system rather than an alternative to it, and high risk cases are dealt with in the hospital.

So I don't think that home birth is inherently risky (remember, there are risks with the hospital, too--there was the thread about the woman who lost her limbs due to flesh-eating antibiotic resistant bacteria) if it is handled properly.

I really don't give a shit about where women give birth, so long as I don't have to be near it, and it doesn't place a strain on the health system. I don't care if infant mortality is high, either, because it's not like we're short on babies, or that infants are self-aware enough to suffer from fear of death.
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kidlesskim
Re: Smothering - Dr. Amy looks at the homebirth deaths
June 03, 2011
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yurble
I still think this is very much a cultural issue. Here, home births are rather common--the highest levels in Europe, I believe--and there is relatively low infant mortality. But the system is set up to support this, with midwifes being part of the medical system rather than an alternative to it, and high risk cases are dealt with in the hospital.

So I don't think that home birth is inherently risky (remember, there are risks with the hospital, too--there was the thread about the woman who lost her limbs due to flesh-eating antibiotic resistant bacteria) if it is handled properly.

I really don't give a shit about where women give birth, so long as I don't have to be near it, and it doesn't place a strain on the health system. I don't care if infant mortality is high, either, because it's not like we're short on babies, or that infants are self-aware enough to suffer from fear of death.



I misread the damned thing because I only skimmed over it! I thought it was referring to the moo's untimely deaths. Perhaps these are simply cases of, "Death by Home Birth Syndrome".™(pending). You know, they don't "believe" in abortion, so they purposely sought out a shitty Doula(or whatever they call them) and hoped for the best.confused smiley

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If YOU are the "exception" to what I am saying, then why does my commentary bother you so much?
I don't hate your kids, I HATE YOU!
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law
Re: Smothering - Dr. Amy looks at the homebirth deaths
June 03, 2011
Yurble - one woman who lost her limbs afer childbirth gave birth at home.

According to Dr. William Schaffner, the chairman of Preventive Medicine at Vanderbilt University Medical Center, the strain of strep that Katy contracted used to be very common hundreds of years ago in women who had just given birth.

Now, Schaffner says, this type of infection is extraordinarily rare.

"The genetics of strep have changed," he said. "We don't see these outbreaks as frequently as we used to. But every once in a while one runs into a strain of a particular strep group A that has the capacity to cause serious invasive disease."

According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, about 9,000 to 11,500 cases of the invasive strep infection occur each year, resulting in about somewhere between 1,000 to 1,800 deaths annually. In contrast, several million cases of the less serious strain known as strep throat are reported each year.

Schaffner says that the amputations Katy underwent are not uncommon for individuals suffering from the invasive infection.

"One of the ways to try to stop it is to try to get ahead of it and cut off the piece of the body where the infection is so it doesn't keep advancing," said Schaffner.

Schaffner also said that there is no way to know whether Katy's home birth made her more susceptible to the disease.
http://abcnews.go.com/Health/Parenting/flesh-eating-bacteria-costs-mom-arms-legs/story?id=10646649&page=2

The Florida woman who we were originally talking about in the thread here, Claudia Mejia, is also believed to have contracted the bacteria elsewhere.

Orlando Regional, however, maintains Mejia's infection was acquired elsewhere and that she was treated properly. In 187,000 births since 1988 at the nonprofit hospital system, comprised of seven medical facilities, Mejia is the only reported case of invasive group A strep, Jennings Hurt III, the hospital's attorney, said.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,274116,00.html
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kidlesskim
Re: Smothering - Dr. Amy looks at the homebirth deaths
June 03, 2011
"...One of the ways to try to stop it is to try to get ahead of it and cut off the piece of the body where the infection is so it doesn't keep advancing," said Schaffner..."



That is SUCH a horrifying thought! Just cutting off parts until there's nothing left! I have also read that vasoconstrictor drugs that are used can cause cell death to extremities. If anyone in the health care field can explain it then I wish that they would. I asked one of my mother's doctors about it when her fucking forearms were turning a light shade of green and he told me that as long as it's properly monitored it wouldn't be a problem. I was NOT convinced. The way I understand it is if the illness is due to an infection, like is being mentioned, and it's attacking the internal organs then vasoconstrictors can save-protect the internal organs and potentially save their lives. The nasty side effect is that sometimes the oxygen doesn't get to the hands, feet, arms, legs, etc......which is how they end up getting amputations.:hs

I have a dear older friend (nearly 70) who went in for routine heart bypass surgery with no anticipated complications, like my mother, and got one of these nasty infections and was given those drugs to save her life. She came out missing one leg from the knee down, a foot, and most all of her fingers. It was one of the MOST horrifying things I have ever witnessed. The especially awful part is how they have to induce a coma and when they wake up, they are missing body parts. I can't even BEGIN to imagine a worse horror and I absolutely would rather die. I have it in my living will that I do NOT want any life saving drugs if the side effect is loss of limbs. My mother contracted SOME kind of infection during her surgery too and wound up in the damned hospital fighting that for over a month.angrily flogging with a whip

She was oblivious about the whole damned thing and I was CONSTANTLY watching her green hands and arms and lived in a constant state of fear over it. Honestly, it's been over two years and I still have bad dreams.:bawl So, to any of you who may know, is it the infection itself or the drugs or a combination of both?

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If YOU are the "exception" to what I am saying, then why does my commentary bother you so much?
I don't hate your kids, I HATE YOU!
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WaterLily
Re: Smothering - Dr. Amy looks at the homebirth deaths
June 03, 2011
Just gives me more reason to believe that smothering.com is a cult of brainwashed moos.

Sucks to be moo!


lab mom
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Cambion
Re: Smothering - Dr. Amy looks at the homebirth deaths
June 03, 2011
Some Moos can shit out loaves okay at home, but it's risky no matter who the Moo is. And of course, some of these cows don't even get pre-natal care, so they don't know about any sort of birth defects, if the fetus is in a bad position to be born, or if the thing is still alive. Shitting loaves vaginally after at least one C-section can be risky as well, as the mother's uterus can rupture along the surgery scar. If it's just Moo and Duh playing catch, they may not be prepared for what to do if the loaf comes out with an umbilical noose. They might not know how to deal with a loaf that gets stuck (like those freaky water-headed babies with huge skulls). They won't know how to deal with hemorrhaging. By the time they get to a hospital - if they even go - it could be too late for the loaf and the mother.

Honestly, I don't feel sorry for the mothers one bit. They chose to play roulette by hiring half-assed midwives or stunt-birthing in a kiddy pool while Duh holds a camera. They chose this in favor of getting actual medical care to at least make sure everything is okay. These women are selfish to the point that they are willing to risk their unborn children's lives just to have some kind of crunchy fantasy birth experience. What the hell kind of a mother could they be if they can't even be arsed to try and make sure their loaf is born as healthy as possible?

The bitches deserve all the grief and depression they get for killing their children. I feel bad for the babies who had to suffer and die because their mothers care more about adding "Home Birth" to their mommy forum sig line than they do about the safety of their babies.
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satansbitch
Re: Smothering - Dr. Amy looks at the homebirth deaths
June 04, 2011
Home birth REALLY means moomie changed her mind about having a baybee.
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yurble
Re: Smothering - Dr. Amy looks at the homebirth deaths
June 04, 2011
law1204, I wasn't aware that she had given birth at home; I thought it was a hospital-acquired infection. Regardless of that case, I still think there are some risks associated with hospital births. That's not my main point, however--I don't really care what these women do. I only care about the cost that the rest of society must bear.

My objective was to give a viewpoint from a country which is developed and has a high number of home births, to contrast with the US, where it is not at all the norm. I think it's valid to condemn home births in the US--not because home birth is in itself a bad thing, but because the US lacks the medical network to support home birthing. I would argue that it is more cost-effective to establish such a system, because hospital care is much more expensive than medical care in another setting.

Pregnancy isn't a disease (much as I would treat it like one), so I find it odd that it's become so medicalised. I see reluctance to support homebirths as part of the same mindset that creates stork parking instead of encouraging preggos to get the exercise they need. It involves seeing pregnancy as a sort of disability or disease to be treated, whereas it is actually quite commonplace among mature female mammals. It's just not that special, so why does it merit special treatment?
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thom_c
Re: Smothering - Dr. Amy looks at the homebirth deaths
June 04, 2011
Quote
yurble
I still think this is very much a cultural issue. Here, home births are rather common--the highest levels in Europe, I believe--and there is relatively low infant mortality. But the system is set up to support this, with midwifes being part of the medical system rather than an alternative to it, and high risk cases are dealt with in the hospital.

So I don't think that home birth is inherently risky (remember, there are risks with the hospital, too--there was the thread about the woman who lost her limbs due to flesh-eating antibiotic resistant bacteria) if it is handled properly.

I really don't give a shit about where women give birth, so long as I don't have to be near it, and it doesn't place a strain on the health system. I don't care if infant mortality is high, either, because it's not like we're short on babies, or that infants are self-aware enough to suffer from fear of death.

The major difference is in Europe midwives are advanced degree prepared much like the Nurse Midwives are in the States. The problem is there is also a class of midwives here that are a simple post high school certification called "Certified Professional Midwives."

Nurse Midwives are Masters prepared like their European Counterparts. CPM's use things like self study courses and have no set requirement for clinical hours etc. They are only recognized in 21 states. In 9 states they are specifically proscribed. In 5 states there are no regulations aloowing them to practice thereby making them defacto illegal. While a simple delivery is a EMT Basic Skill, any complications require advanced care. CPM's are not required to maintain Neonatal Resuscitation Provider certification. Even if they did advanced airway management, IV or Intraoseous cannulation are not in their scope of practice, nor is fetal monitoring. All these are required of Nurse Midwives in Europe and the US.

_______________________________________________
“There are three things all wise men fear: the sea in storm, a night with no moon, and the anger of a gentle man.”
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yurble
Re: Smothering - Dr. Amy looks at the homebirth deaths
June 04, 2011
Thom, I find it amazing that 21 states would allow someone to practice medicine after a home study course! Of course the vast difference in mandatory training would make a huge difference in outcomes and the advisability of going that route.
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Miss_Hannigan
Re: Smothering - Dr. Amy looks at the homebirth deaths
June 04, 2011
But it's nattttchhheral!

I say the government should investigate that section of the board

--------------------
"[GFG's pregnancy is] kind of like at the stables where that one dumb, ugly-ass mare broke out of her corral one day and got herself screwed by the equally fugly colt that was due to be gelded the same afternoon."- Shiny
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CFinPenthouse
Re: Smothering - Dr. Amy looks at the homebirth deaths
June 04, 2011
Dr. Amy Tuteur is one of the few breeders I can tolerate.

Homebirths are actually not safer in Europe either, according to Tuteur. The Netherlands has the highest homebirth rates and the highest neonatal mortality as well. I'm not sure how the moos fare, however.

Shitting your loaf at home is a badge of honour for women of a certain social class. Their remaining lives tend to be unopposed. They have no other way to feel challenged or triumph over adversity than glorify a bodily function they share with an alley cat.
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kidlesskim
Re: Smothering - Dr. Amy looks at the homebirth deaths
June 05, 2011
Quote

Down here in Alabama, it's fine and dandy for a woman to give birth on her own, but if she has someone attend the birth, like her husband or any level of midwife not a certified nurse midwife, it's illegal. So basically if she has someone to help, it's against the law.

There are some nurse midwives in the state, but they work at medical offices, so I'm not sure what the appeal is in becoming one/obtaining one? What makes them "midwifey" if they are just nurses? I did lots of researching about midwifery several years ago. The state laws really vary on those. There's a birthing center with a midwife across the state line that several women in my area have flocked to so they could give birth in a more comfortable setting and not be breaking the law in their own state.[/quote



I lived down there for many years and NEVER knew about this! It probably has to do with potential lawsuits since it would likely appeal to middle income moos who don't quite qualify for ALL of the welfare freebies like Medicaid and don't have insurance. There's a pretty simple way to avoid ALL birthing related problems though, but I realize that the obvious solution will fall on deaf ears.

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If YOU are the "exception" to what I am saying, then why does my commentary bother you so much?
I don't hate your kids, I HATE YOU!
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yurble
Re: Smothering - Dr. Amy looks at the homebirth deaths
June 05, 2011
Quote
CFinPenthouse
Dr. Amy Tuteur is one of the few breeders I can tolerate.

Homebirths are actually not safer in Europe either, according to Tuteur. The Netherlands has the highest homebirth rates and the highest neonatal mortality as well. I'm not sure how the moos fare, however.

I did not think that was the case, based on what I recall from news reports I have read on the topic, so I searched for infant mortality rates. The following is from the 2006 United Nations World Population Prospects Report, as made available on Wikipedia:

4.7 for the Netherlands, 4.8 for the UK (which has a similar culture to the US), and 6.3 for the US. The lowest rating was 2.3 (Singapore), and the lowest in the EU was Sweden, at about 3. Highest is Angola, at 180. (These are per 1000 live births.)
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CFinPenthouse
Re: Smothering - Dr. Amy looks at the homebirth deaths
June 05, 2011
Quote
yurble
I did not think that was the case, based on what I recall from news reports I have read on the topic, so I searched for infant mortality rates. The following is from the 2006 United Nations World Population Prospects Report, as made available on Wikipedia:

4.7 for the Netherlands, 4.8 for the UK (which has a similar culture to the US), and 6.3 for the US. The lowest rating was 2.3 (Singapore), and the lowest in the EU was Sweden, at about 3. Highest is Angola, at 180. (These are per 1000 live births.)

I think Tuteur's comparison is to other Western countries. Also, she makes a distinction between perinatal/neonatal mortality (reflective of obstetric care) which is typically up to 28 days post birth and infant mortality (reflective of pediatric care) which tracks deaths from about a month to the first year of life.
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law
Re: Smothering - Dr. Amy looks at the homebirth deaths
June 06, 2011
Quote
yurble
Regardless of that case, I still think there are some risks associated with hospital births.

Totally agreed. I read a story not too long ago about a woman who died the day after she gave birth because staph bacteria had been mainlined into her spine via epidural. It may have even been posted here (I think this was last year sometime). You couldn't fucking pay me to do it, for sure.

I love Dr. Amy's blog. People are always whining about how mmmmeeeeaaaaaannn she is! She has nothing good do say about anti-vaxxers either.
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