Wanna stay friends with childed people? Be their babysitter/cook/housekeeper or you're a bad friend! June 03, 2018 | Registered: 11 years ago Posts: 344 |
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Dear Carolyn:
My best friend, "Gail," and I have grown apart the past few years. It's no one's fault, we just don't have anything in common anymore. She's a stay-at-home mom with two kids under 4, and is busy with all of the things that come with that. I'm single, dating a couple of guys casually, very busy and engaged with my career.
Five years ago we couldn't be separated, we worked in the same building, roomed together and socialized together. These days, we might catch up a few times a year. We really try to get together but even picking a night when we're both free to go to a movie is a nightmare, but we managed one last weekend.
At dinner, Gail broke down crying saying that I don't care about her, don't make time for her anymore, never go to their house.
It's true, but their house is kind of messy and chaotic, and with the kids and husband around we can't really talk, so what's the point? I feel bad that Gail is hurt and lonely, but I was blindsided by this. I thought she was happy with her kids and her husband, who is a genuinely nice guy.
Since we're in our 20s none of our other friends are even married, let alone have kids. I thought about suggesting Gail find a "mommy group" or something, but that makes it sound like I don't want to be her friend anymore and I'm blowing her off. Her family lives on the opposite coast so her local support group is pretty thin. What can I do?
-- Friend
You can start acting like a friend of substance, or you can admit to yourself -- and Gail -- that you were only a friend of convenience.
Before I explain, a pre-emptive clarification: I'm actually not judging here (much) because it's normal and necessary for some friendships to be deeper than others. The deeper ones yield the most, but also demand the bigger investment from us in time, attention, and sometimes discomfort, so it's OK that not every friend we have gets everything we've got.
What's not OK is to declare someone your "best" friend in the same breath that you admit you stay away because her kids annoy you and her house is a mess.
That's everything but an open admission that you care more about Gail's circumstances than you care about Gail herself.
Which, again, is fine if you're just a party pal -- but Gail seems to think you're her best friend, too, so she's expecting you to be more drawn to her than you are repelled by her floor Cheerios.
Gail's circumstances, by the way, are pretty typical for households with small kids. And no, it's not fun for parents, either, to have more housework than energy and more commitments than privacy. Gails can be happy about their choices and steadfast in their devotion to a "genuinely nice guy" and their kids and still be howling from their souls for a break.
Are you willing to be hers? She thought so, and you weren't, so now she's asking you directly instead of signing on to your "it's no one's fault" theory of drift, which only works when it's not patently self-serving.
As long as your attitude toward visits is "What's the point?" then you are indeed only an acquaintance of Gail's, now, not a friend -- which again I don't judge as long as she knows this so she can go "find a 'mommy group' or something." A suggestion I would have judged if you hadn't caught yourself before making it. Because, wow.
If instead you can -- if you want to -- find purpose in these visits beyond what's in them for your amusement, then you can be her friend. Some of these purposes being: to keep her company as she does her mom thing; bring dinner or help out in other ways; understand what her life is like so you can remain close; get to know her husband as a potential friend in his own right; get to know her kids so you can become Auntie Friend to them as they grow older and more interesting; slog through her tough time just as she would through yours (be it kids of your own someday or something else entirely); and even just logging in a good faith effort to appear on her turf, to validate any effort she then makes to appear on yours.
Kids suck parents in and push non-parents away. They test both sides of a friendship. You close your letter by asking, "What can I do?" -- and that's the first question on your test. Is it just a rhetorical shrug, or are you sincerely open to change?
Re: Wanna stay friends with childed people? Be their babysitter/cook/housekeeper or you're a bad friend! June 03, 2018 | Registered: 5 years ago Posts: 48 |
Re: Wanna stay friends with childed people? Be their babysitter/cook/housekeeper or you're a bad friend! June 03, 2018 | Registered: 13 years ago Posts: 12,434 |
Re: Wanna stay friends with childed people? Be their babysitter/cook/housekeeper or you're a bad friend! June 03, 2018 | Registered: 13 years ago Posts: 12,434 |
Re: Wanna stay friends with childed people? Be their babysitter/cook/housekeeper or you're a bad friend! June 03, 2018 | Registered: 15 years ago Posts: 1,802 |
Re: Wanna stay friends with childed people? Be their babysitter/cook/housekeeper or you're a bad friend! June 03, 2018 | Registered: 12 years ago Posts: 1,471 |
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yurble
I don't understand is how someone can be a "stay-at-home parent" and have a filthy house. One of my friends stayed at home while his wife worked. The house was tidy. Then she lost her job, so he went to work and she stayed home. The house became filthy. That demonstrated to me that as long as both parents aren't working, it is a choice to have a dirty house. The sheer laziness that causes many breeders to want to give up working once they reproduce leads to the same low standards at home.
There are only two circumstances where I'm willing to go to a friend's house and clean it up. Situation one is if I'm staying there, and I want to do something helpful as a guest. Situation two is if the person is ill or injured. Friendship is not about enabling someone's laziness.
Re: Wanna stay friends with childed people? Be their babysitter/cook/housekeeper or you're a bad friend! June 03, 2018 | Registered: 15 years ago Posts: 1,802 |
Re: Wanna stay friends with childed people? Be their babysitter/cook/housekeeper or you're a bad friend! June 03, 2018 | Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 88 |
This really chaps my hide. "Auntie Friend"? So if a woman doesn't have kids she's obligated to either have her own at the earliest possible moment or, as the very least she can do to be worthy of existence, she should devote attention to family or friends' kids.Quote
Posted by Carolyn Hack
...get to know her kids so you can become Auntie Friend to them as they grow older and more interesting; slog through her tough time just as she would through yours (be it kids of your own someday or something else entirely); and even just logging in a good faith effort to appear on her turf, to validate any effort she then makes to appear on yours.
Re: Wanna stay friends with childed people? Be their babysitter/cook/housekeeper or you're a bad friend! June 03, 2018 | Registered: 11 years ago Posts: 344 |
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yurble
One of my friends stayed at home while his wife worked. The house was tidy. Then she lost her job, so he went to work and she stayed home. The house became filthy.
Re: Wanna stay friends with childed people? Be their babysitter/cook/housekeeper or you're a bad friend! June 03, 2018 | Registered: 12 years ago Posts: 1,231 |
Re: Wanna stay friends with childed people? Be their babysitter/cook/housekeeper or you're a bad friend! June 03, 2018 | Registered: 19 years ago Posts: 9,199 |
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This is such bullshit. Every friend couple DH and I have had that has had kids has gone AWOL for years once the babies started arriving. When we did try to get together, it always was on their terms. And God forbid they find a fecking babysitter. One of the many problems with so many younger parents today is they do not comprehend the meaning of "adult time." When I was a kid, my parents threw lots of parties in their finished basement. We were not allowed down there, period. They would get a babysitter and stash us all upstairs. Thankfully, I have a few mommy women friends who get this and make time for self care (girls nights, dinner, interests in other things than kids), which does not involve being a mommy.
Re: Wanna stay friends with childed people? Be their babysitter/cook/housekeeper or you're a bad friend! June 03, 2018 | Registered: 13 years ago Posts: 12,434 |
Re: Wanna stay friends with childed people? Be their babysitter/cook/housekeeper or you're a bad friend! June 03, 2018 | Registered: 8 years ago Posts: 232 |
Re: Wanna stay friends with childed people? Be their babysitter/cook/housekeeper or you're a bad friend! June 03, 2018 | Registered: 13 years ago Posts: 12,434 |
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happyhiker
Keep her company as she does her mom thing?!? Great idea! I think I’ll invite friends over to watch me do my spinster thing. You just stand there and act interested while I scoop a litter box and fold laundry. Anyone who does not accept my invitation is just a convenient friend and not a real friend.
I learned a long time ago that you cannot have an interesting conversation if a child is in the room, so what’s the point? And I don’t need to see anyone do their mom thing, because they document every second of their lives on social media.
Re: Wanna stay friends with childed people? Be their babysitter/cook/housekeeper or you're a bad friend! June 03, 2018 | Registered: 13 years ago Posts: 7,835 |
Re: Wanna stay friends with childed people? Be their babysitter/cook/housekeeper or you're a bad friend! June 03, 2018 | Registered: 11 years ago Posts: 344 |
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mumofsixbirds
Also, Hack is forgetting something. The career girl probably has precious little time to herself...
Re: Wanna stay friends with childed people? Be their babysitter/cook/housekeeper or you're a bad friend! June 04, 2018 | Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 3,712 |
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Tiquer
Friendship is a two way street. While it is possible to remain friends with people whose circumstances are now wildly different, as in two kids SAHM vs. no kids career person, it requires both parties put forth an honest effort. Earlier comments about parents today believing that Every. Single. Activity. they do must also include the kids are absolutely correct. As someone who has tried propping up a friendship and, against my better judgement, also tried including their kids, my experience was that it was a complete waste of time. The kids had to always be the center of attention, constantly interrupted, couldn't leave anything alone, and were tirelessly needy. Truth is, I have nothing in common with kids who can't carry on a conversation, and I don't find misbehavior to be cute. So if someone is exhausted by their kids and won't put forth any effort to find a sitter so we can enjoy a meal or activity without constant interruption and distraction, then the friendship is over.
Re: Wanna stay friends with childed people? Be their babysitter/cook/housekeeper or you're a bad friend! June 04, 2018 | Registered: 12 years ago Posts: 146 |
Re: Wanna stay friends with childed people? Be their babysitter/cook/housekeeper or you're a bad friend! June 04, 2018 | Registered: 19 years ago Posts: 9,199 |
Re: Wanna stay friends with childed people? Be their babysitter/cook/housekeeper or you're a bad friend! June 04, 2018 | Registered: 11 years ago Posts: 344 |
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bell_flower
ETA: And while they are at it, they could have a go at that dreadful Prudie person. Prudie "I didn't want children but had a child for my HUZZ-band and I'm quite happy now," who doesn't believe anyone who writes her expressing CF leanings is actually CF.
Re: Wanna stay friends with childed people? Be their babysitter/cook/housekeeper or you're a bad friend! June 04, 2018 | Registered: 19 years ago Posts: 9,199 |
Re: Wanna stay friends with childed people? Be their babysitter/cook/housekeeper or you're a bad friend! June 04, 2018 | Registered: 13 years ago Posts: 7,835 |
Re: Wanna stay friends with childed people? Be their babysitter/cook/housekeeper or you're a bad friend! June 04, 2018 | Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 3,712 |
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lurker-derp
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bell_flower
ETA: And while they are at it, they could have a go at that dreadful Prudie person. Prudie "I didn't want children but had a child for my HUZZ-band and I'm quite happy now," who doesn't believe anyone who writes her expressing CF leanings is actually CF.
Is that the old Prudie or the new Prudie that recently came out as trans?
Re: Wanna stay friends with childed people? Be their babysitter/cook/housekeeper or you're a bad friend! June 04, 2018 | Registered: 11 years ago Posts: 344 |
Re: Wanna stay friends with childed people? Be their babysitter/cook/housekeeper or you're a bad friend! June 04, 2018 | Registered: 10 years ago Posts: 2,364 |