Mom's Fretful Anxiety over Daughter's "Giftedness" (from mothering.com) (long!)

I always love the posts by moms who are so concerned about being sensitive to those with kids not as "advanced" [neurotic] as theirs...oh, I feel so bad for them in their dilemma! Poor moos!

(excerpts)

"Dd1 is in first grade. I've not pushed for testing or requested anything extra at this point. She is advanced, but I don't know if she is gifted...I gather that largely do to what I hear other dc on this board are doing/saying.

"If generally speaking, dd has some specific strengths, particularly that she masters her spelling quite easily at this point (getting 100 percent of the words plus two extra credit words), and reads at a third grade level, does it mean she's not really gifted if she gets an occasional answer wrong...She was just exposed to "angles" this year and while she understood them during homework time, she didn't retain that for quiz time and thought they were referring to "sides" of the shape in question. Quite honestly, I was so used to her having perfect papers, it really shocked me a bit to see a 95%, and then I was shocked that I got shocked about it (that's when I realized, I needed to RELAX about grades).

"while she can read at a third grade level

[thanks for repeating that; I got it the first time],

and had gotten 100 percent on 2 of her 10 question AR test, it wasn't without reading the chapter book 3-4 times with me asking questions. I'm pretty sure if she read the book once, then took the test the very next day, she might not do as well. In fact, when that exact thing happened, she got one wrong.

"Because dd is advanced, she has more complex homework than another very close friend of hers who lives on the same block as she. So when every day he comes over, he asks, "can dd play", and I have to tell him no, because she has a bit more homework to do, and she definitely has a lot more reading to do (it takes a lot longer to read chapter books than it does the non-chapter ones).

The boy will come over 2-3 times knocking on the door [tell the brat to GO HOME] seeing if she can play, but she's not done with her work (not always because it's a lot, but because she wants to unwind first, then do it). I keep telling the mom that dd has more homework to do, but then she has begun to notice that there are a few differences between dd and her ds and it's getting uncomfortable.

[aw, it's so hard to have a "gifted" child! One does want to be Sensitive to those with less fortunate children!]

"I just am torn what to tell this mom/this boy...To boot, the boy is an only child, there's not a lot of friends on his side of the block, and the parents of the friends he did have can only take so much of him so they often go through phases where he is not welcome for a while. Which means he's always ringing on my door.

"I even have trouble talking with parents of her classmates, when they ask me specific questions regarding homework assignments. At some point, it becomes clear to me that dd is just different enough to make it hard to talk about things. She's one of 4 kids in her class of 21 in the enriched reading pull-out group (though there are kids in the other first grades getting pulled out too and they all meet in the lunchroom to work on these other assignments).

"I'm wondering when it's going to be clear to my friends that dd is different too. I try to be hush-hush about her abilities, her performance, her assigments, but it's very hard.

[Cue the waaahmbulance]

"I'm almost wanting to find out if I should have a conference with dd's teacher to talk about these things. If she could, at the very least, let me know what her instinct about dd is (though it's very early), or if they have done any kinds of assessments about her. If possibly, she could help me prepare for what might lie ahead (either giftedness, or just above average). Her K teacher said that the gifted program was a definite possibility for dd, but nothing else was ever said.

[she said that likely to shut you up, you stupid cow]

"What do you think? My anxieties are high on the matter because I feel so all alone. I don't have anyone in real life to ask or get support from at this point."

[Perhaps they're all sick and tired of hearing you go on and on and on about this topic...]

I see two kiddie problems here. I'll start wih the pest of a neighbor brat. This poor "only chyld" who is living on Breeder Island obviously was a result of failed birth control and his parents don't pay him any attention. Probably not unlike the pesky only chlyd who lived next door to me for a time, his moomie ENCOURAGES him to play elsewhere to get him out of her hair. A simple, "Miss ValeBRATorian" is busy doing chores and studying in the afternoons and will be from now on out, FOREVER, so there is no need for you to EVER knock on the door again. If she ever has a free afternoon and SHE WANTS TO, then SHE will knock on YOUR door, OKAY? I dealt with this with unwanted calls from classmates when my stepdaughter was a kyd, they have to be TOLD not to call sometimes and these little bastards will call after 10pm, and.or knock on the fucking door at the crack of dawn on Saturdays as well.

As for her kyd being "gifted". If she is basing this on the kyd studying more than a 3rd year law student and making good grades, then I find it HIGHLY unlikely she is anything more than average, but probably stressed out due to moomie's PERCEPTION that she is an Einstein Jr. 'GIFTED" means she should be making good grades without opening a book or hours upon hours of studying. This chyld will be ( if she isn't already) a very uptight, anal retentive, study freak who bases her self worth solely on grades, rather than than any ambition or desire to learn. I have seen this in children before and it has a classic symptom. One is that they will be given chapters 11-13 to read and can expect to be tested on it the next day. However, EVEN IF they find the subject reading material VERY interesting, they will NOT take the initiative to read one extra word than what they will be tested on. For instance, they won't read the last paragraph from chapter ten, which might help with comprehension, and they have NO curiosity about what may follow what they have learned on the first page in chapter 14. They have no natural desire for knowledge and that is re-enforced by a desire for the reward for the good grades, rather than the good feeling they would get from the knowledge. A dumb kid wouldn't understand this, which is why it's a tell tale "symptom"

Kyds who exhibit this behavior have an imbalanced mindset on what's important and what is not. They only do the absolute BARE minimum when given a task or assignment, which is a tell tale sign that they are anything BUT "gifted", but rather they are average at best and only interested in "making the grade" to please moomie or sometimes teacher. A thirst for knowledge is a true measuring stick for genius and it comes from within and can not be taught. IMO. Being "gifted" has good and bad sides to it, so I am not really "for" one or the other. However, the signs are there and it's pretty easy to spot it when they are nothing more than behaviors or skills taught by rote, which is how any smart monkey can be trained. This goes for every type of "gifted" kyd from schoolwork, athletic prowess, to musical talent.

I believe that the reason that UNgifted yet bright or perhaps ambitious is often confused with those who have natural gifts or abilities, is because the ones who are self appointed judges of said giftedness are at best, across the board slightly below average themselves. One good way to handle these parents, although they probably woouldn't "get it", but that wouldn't make it any less fun, are the following questions and then comment. "Would you want an orderly diagnosing an illness ?", "Would you want a $5 an hour lifeguard at the local YMCA judging an Olympic swim team?" "Would you want a member of a country church choir judging a national voice competition?" If not, then why do you feel qualified to judge whether your kyd is "gifted", when you CLEARLY are not gifted yourself?" I always wanted to say that when I was teaching piano lessons and dealing with parents who thought they had sired the next Mozart.

Also, this moomie is being self righteous, condescending, and higher than mighty as well as a liar by pretending that she is "worried" and keeping quiet about her child prodigy. I believe she is one of those passive aggressive boastful types who hide behind the facade of "concern", when she is only concerned with the attention she can get by playing martyrmoo.

Also, this moomie is being self righteous, condescending, and higher than mighty as well as a liar by pretending that she is "worried" and keeping quiet about her child prodigy. I believe she is one of those passive aggressive boastful types who hide behind the facade of "concern", when she is only concerned with the attention she can get by playing martyrmoo.

Truer words were never spoken...that's what gets me about these sorts of posts. Great response as always kidlesskim...

Pff...give me a bloody break. I was also an early reader and I was also in the enriched reading class in the first grade, and got 100s plus the bonus points on all my spelling tests. I'm certainly not gifted, and neither is this child. Her Moomie only thinks she is because of how incredibly slowly most other kids develop anymore, when in reality, her kid is developing at a normal level instead of at moron level,which is why it appears as though her child is "gifted".

It's sad when being average means being put in an advanced class, and average classes are now meant for the idiot children. You have to be a very special brand of stupid to be in the general/slow classes now.

"...I gather that largely do to what I hear other dc on this board are doing/saying"

I gather that mom is clearly gifted, as well, DUE to her extreme command of written language and her deep knowledge of homophones.

I really think she should push for testing for two very important reasons.

1. Teachers get time away from their classroom for meetings to determine whether or not the child will be tested. Trust me, this is a gift, and an opportunity for a bathroom break afterwards.

2. Parent testing requests are almost always granted. Nothing is more enjoyable for a teacher than watching the glimmer of hope and gleam of confidence leave a parunt's eyes when they find out their kid is average at the post testing results meeting.

You've all hammered that nail on the head so many times it's now a nickel not a nail.

This cow has an average student with an ambitious mother. That is ALL. Better not call Mensa just yet.

Like others have said, the real brains of the school never, ever study. They absorb all the information about the task from the first 5 minutes of teacher's explanations, then everything from homework to quizzes to tests are quite literally just 'filled out' like the simplest of forms. Classes and textbooks, to them, are in slooooowwwww motion. They sit through school politely for the sake of their classmates and so as not to disappoint teacher, but they would never dream of raising their hands to show off answering every single question correctly -- that sort of behaviour is for the try-hard kids who aren't so bright and need the learning time. And they find it amusing to second-guess why teacher constructed the tests in certain ways, trying to fool the slower students into misreading the question or getting confused, or picking the wrong solution because the wrong one sounds a little bit like the right one, and so on. They're way ahead of the adults teaching the class.

This mother ought to realise that her daughter's friend, who she makes sound utterly pathetic, doesn't think of her as smart. He just thinks of her as SLOW. And STUPID. Because to him, she can't seem to finish her homework and labours over it hour after hour after hour.

I hope this cow does attempt to 'talk' (why???) to they boy's mother, and that the boy's mother nods sympathetically and says in reply "Well I will make sure Johnny doesn't bother your daughter any more. Clearly she's having difficulty keeping up and it would be a shame if she were relegated to the slower track because she took the time to play outside a couple times."

That'll have our masterly moo shitting her pants.

- - - - - - - -
"The death of creativity is a pram in the hallway"
- Cyril Connolly

Really pathetic. She is secretly eaten up by the possibility her kid may be gifted (never mind it's based on a faulty premise) and she certainly wants to wave it under the other cows' noses.

These two problems have easy answers. 1. Tell the Boybrat what kidlesskim wrote: girlbrat will be indisposed in the afternoons from now on. Don't call us, we'll call you. (The real answer is that she should let her daughter play and just enjoy herself because she's in fucking first grade, but I digress.) 2. other moomies coudn't care less about her brat, any more than she's concerned about theirs. Moomies feign interest in other peoples' kids so they can talk about their own. It kills me how she's dissecting every nuance of conversation she's ever had with people, looking for evidence they are jealous of her superior spawn. This woman is obviously a SAHM and she has nothing better to do.

But keep in mind, what is now regarded as third grade level was what kindergarten kids were starting way back when...
What is college material, junior high (equivelent here) were expected to be fluent ..

Please, bitch...your brat is not gifted. Not even close. Why? Because the standards for third grade are the old standards for first grade 20 years ago, and due to grade inflation and lowered standards even that is a stretch.

Your self-esteem poisoned little bitchprincess will wind up being a parasite to you, until she can either have you committed to a retirement home or you die.

Should have aborted when you had the chance.

The irony in the whole situation with the genius/gifted/scarily-smart, whatever you want to call them, is that the family often worry about the weird social development patterns that occur in kidlings like that. Sometimes it's just chronic nerdy-ism, other times it's alien-like '8 years old going on 48' sort of personalities that emerge. But at any rate it's nearly impossible for them to fit in with their peers properly, just as it is for the semi-retarded at the other end of the scale to do so.

Families who fuck them up completely try to make the kid's chronological age over-rule their mental age -- these are usually moos who 'looooove babies' and who are gutted that this one isn't going to comply with her wishes to 'remain baby' for her amusement.

Ambitious parents of very-average children know this goes on, so like this dumbass embarrassing cow, they try to emulate it. They generate some kind of pretend buzz about their 'genius child' in the hope that there will at least be some kind of reputation built around them. They think it's better to go with the Emperor's New Clothes than it is to just be average.

- - - - - - - -
"The death of creativity is a pram in the hallway"
- Cyril Connolly

Something else that I feel warrants a mention, is that this child, like everyone, may just be good at one or two subjects, and may flunk in others. Everyone has strengths and weaknesses when it comes to schooling, and just because a kid is good at one subject, doesn't mean they're therefore good at EVERYTHING.

I speak from personal experience. My particular strength has always been language. I've always been a very good speller (if we had a Spelling Bee in NZ, I surely would have entered) and when I entered high school I chose foreign languages as my elective subjects, studying Japanese, Latin and Spanish. Japanese was always my favourite and, honestly, I was very good at it, and I went on to major in Japanese at university. I also got good marks in English at high school. Languages/linguistics has just been my thing. But that's pretty much it. When it came to other subjects at school, e.g. science, history, I was very average, and when it came to maths, I was (and still am) as dumb as a box of rocks and did very poorly.

However, my mother, who has always been a braggart, would brag to friends and family about me whenever I would get an above-average grade in a Japanese or Spanish exam. This lead to people assuming that I must be good at EVERYTHING and I quickly acquired a reputation as the family genius. It annoyed me a lot because then at family gatherings, an aunt or other relative would ask me how my last exams went, and would look at me in utter shock when I would tell them how I epically failed my maths exam or just scraped through my history exam. They had gotten the idea fully embedded into their minds due to the bragging of my mother, that because I did well on one subject, I must have been a brainiac who was good all-around, and were genuinely stunned to learn that I wasn't.

Similar things also occurred in the classroom as well, e.g. the kids who were in the same Japanese class as me, would see how well I did and assume that I was therefore good at everything. I remember clearly one girl whom I shared both a science and a Japanese class with, asking me in science one day for the answer to a question, and when I responded with a blank look and said "I have no idea", had her jaw drop to the ground and spluttered "But-but you're so brainy!! You do so well in Japanese!". I was like, "Um, thanks, but that's ALL I'm good at!".

Sorry for the long rant. My point is that just because this girl is good at one thing, doesn't mean she's an all-around genius, and the moo in question will be in for a grand shock if her Einstein-daughter comes home one day with a great mark in one subject and a shit one in another - but that's quite likely what may happen.

I actually just watched a Law and Order Criminal Intent episode about this one dad who thought his son was a genius. It turned out that the boy, while intelligent and possessing, was being coached by his dad. The dad, who turned out to be a big attention whore, freaked when the boy said he wasn't going to be admitted into a genius school so he killed the social worker who supposedly wrote a bad review (in reality, the boy lied about the bad review because he didn't want to go to the school).

It's obvious the girl here is not a genius. Geniuses don't need to read a book over and over again. Those who are really gifted understand concepts immediately, not after reviewing it 3-4 times and with moomy's help.

I've known quite a few people who claimed to have very high IQs. Its easy and fun to brag. But its a lot harder when they get something wrong, or get lost trying to drive somewhere - because they can't live down the embarassment.

I tell people my IQ is average and I am fine with that.