How to deal with child-centric job when you hate kids

cambion, i'm sorry. jeebus, since when did libraries become daycare centers? are these kids just dumped there by their moos or by their teachers?

I have to deal with kids sometimes in my job and I find that being authoritative works. also, the fewer options you give them the better. actually, this is true of my adult patients as well.

I also think you should stay with the job as long as you can stand it but look around elsewhere. good luck!

A big part of me doesn't see why I have to be the authoritative one because I am neither a teacher nor a librarian. I'm just the person who re-shelves and checks things in/out. Babysitting wasn't and still isn't part of my job description. And just in the short time I've been doing this job, I've learned that kids don't know how the fuck to put books back where they find them, even with the help of the little "shelf bookmark" thingies the librarian keeps on hand specifically for the purpose of placing books back where they go. I spent a good chunk of today just putting books in various places back in their proper order, not counting putting checked-in books back. I'm probably not going to be going out of my way to control these damn kids; as far as I'm concerned, that's the teachers' jobs, not the library peon's. So if little Kaaydhenn'n decides to have a meltdown, that's allllll the teacher's problem and none of mine.

I'm also wondering what the school would say if I demanded a salary closer to that of a librarian. I mentioned this in my interview topic in another part of the site, but if I'm running the library by myself without the supervision of the librarian because she's 15 or 20 miles away in a totally different town, then I don't think I am a library assistant any longer. I am a substitute librarian. I mean, they'd probably laugh in my face if I seriously told them to give me more money, but just sayin'. Surely if they didn't feel like paying for a second librarian, they can afford to give me and the other assistant some of what they would save.

Also, my mother did not go with me to work - I wanted to go on a test drive to the school outside of town because it was in an unfamiliar area and she went with me to be a backseat driver and make sure I didn't do anything horrible like drive the speed limit. Needless to say, since I drive like a sane person when I'm alone, I don't piss anybody off that's driving behind me like when my mother is in the passenger seat. In fact, the ability to drive my own way is the only thing I like about having a job. My mother has dropped me off at work a couple times when she needed the car, though.

I'm not gonna last a year at this job. Everything is pissing me off, confusing me, annoying me and/or stressing me out. I hate being around little kids; the school's day system is unnecessary, confusing bullshit; I have to wear uncomfortable clothing because my mother has a shit-fit if I attempt to dress myself. There is absolutely nothing I like about this job, and I still stand by my previous statement that I would rather scrub toilets than work with people's spawn.

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Cambion
A big part of me doesn't see why I have to be the authoritative one because I am neither a teacher nor a librarian.

Because your job will suck all the more if you're not. Not only this job, but other jobs as well. If people see that you're a pushover, they'll take advantage, so it is best to set the tone immediately which suggests you're willing to collaborate but not be taken advantage of. I've never had a kid-centric job so I don't know how to deal with kids as opposed to co-workers, but I'd take the advice from people with that experience.

No matter how uncomfortable it is for you to be assertive, it's a skill you'll need and being assertive is far less unpleasant than not being assertive now and suffering the consequences later.

That does not ask for more pay now. You have no demonstrated capability to handle the requirements and every reason to believe they're going as cheaply as possible. Try to use this as a springboard for a better job, but failing that you could try to re-negotiate when you have a demonstrated capability for the work and they'd have a hard time replacing you.

I would be packing a change of clothes along in my "lunch bag" and changing the second you can.
If this means at the school where your coworkers might notice, play it up for sympathy! "Verbal abuse if I don't wear what mommy wants, but hey this job will get me away from her, yay!" Almost guaranteed to result in free shit and word about roommate situations will get back to you ASAP.

Be comfortable.

Because you took a job at an elementary school!!!!!
Instead of planning on reasons you will get fired and reasons you will quit figure out ways to keep this job until you find another.
Honestly? The excuse that your mommy won't let you use a car she bought and paid for cuts no slack with me. It wasn't my parents' job to supply me with transportation as an adult. Instead of planning to quit this job you hate, you need to figure out how to stomach it, gain your independence.
You will not get a raise when you are barely out of training on a job. It doesn't work that way in any and every job you will get.
I have had jobs I hated or grew to hate. It sucks. What I did not do was stomp off in a huff or demand a raise weeks after I started. You took a job in a school system. Expecting not to have to deal with brats is unreasonable.

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Cambion
I mean, they'd probably laugh in my face if I seriously told them to give me more money, but just sayin'.

School? State job? Maybe it's different in your state, in mine the departments work with the money they are given, within a budget decided by the legislature. When it's politicians funding their favorite pork bellies or deciding who "deserves" the tax dollars they dole out, it's a waste of time asking for more. And honestly, the people working above you are probably not being paid what they feel they are worth so you're going to make enemies by thinking they should give you more.

I'm sympathetic but realistic, working a state job myself. Third year here, bringing a degree and decades of experience, and I haven't seen an extra cent more than what I started with. We don't get overtime or holiday pay, we get comp time. This year, with the budget finally decided two months past due, it was decided that state employees will get an across-the-board "bonus" of $750 at the end of the year. Woo

I'm about to lose a really great boss because he went to HR saying that he had other opportunities but would stay if they gave him a raise. He was given a blank look and told, in so many words, "we hope you enjoy your new job." That's the reality of state work. I'm out at the end of the year myself, unless something spoils my plans.

Get your experience, earn your references and keep looking for another opportunity.

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myrna minkoff
cambion, i'm sorry. jeebus, since when did libraries become daycare centers? are these kids just dumped there by their moos or by their teachers?

I have to deal with kids sometimes in my job and I find that being authoritative works. also, the fewer options you give them the better. actually, this is true of my adult patients as well.

I also think you should stay with the job as long as you can stand it but look around elsewhere. good luck!

Libraries in elementary schools are places that are going to deal with their primary users, which will be kids. I'm no lover of kids but if I take a job in a pediatric wing of a hospital or pediatric office I have no right to complain or demand a raise right out of the gate because children are present.

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Presto
I would be packing a change of clothes along in my "lunch bag" and changing the second you can.
If this means at the school where your coworkers might notice, play it up for sympathy! "Verbal abuse if I don't wear what mommy wants, but hey this job will get me away from her, yay!" Almost guaranteed to result in free shit and word about roommate situations will get back to you ASAP.

Be comfortable.

Child of 2 teachers not agreeing with what you say here. My parents would have smiled at the person and then snickered when they left. They both taught from the age of 22. A person nearing 30 complaining that their mommy made them wear xyz would have garnered no sympathy. They lived on their own and dressed themselves. That is part of adulthood and not something to be sympathetic about.

Relax everybody, I was kidding about asking for a raise. I'm just pissed and stressed about everything I have to do, especially when I'm by myself. I feel like the shit they're having me do is more than what I should be doing. I don't think manning a library all alone is what an assistant should be doing for days at a time. Especially when classes come in - it can be too much for two people to do everything and get the kids out the door in time, let alone just one. In fact, I forgot to do a major part of the checkout process today and wound up having to run down to the classroom and fix it before the kids all went home.

Remember, much of what I will say in this topic is just me venting. It's not easy going to a stressful job and then dealing with home stress before I leave and after I get back. But I still stand by it when I say that I will not be going above and beyond at this job. I'm not going to go out of my way to be mean to anyone or to sabotage the job, but let's say I probably wouldn't ask why I got written up if it happens. But hey, I screwed up a lot today (not on purpose), so maybe they'll learn to not have me be on my own.

My mother is still bitching about having the administration office tell me who hasn't gotten their fingerprints yet so I can carpool with them. I told her they aren't gonna give me that information, but her answer is, "Well it don't hurt to ask!" Maybe it doesn't "hurt," but they aren't going to tell me who has gotten fingerprinted and who hasn't. The way I see it, she wanted me to have this damn job, so she can figure out how to get me to the fingerprint location. Of course, she won't just let me drive there, even though I know where to go because she ascared of having me drive 65 miles an hour in her precious jalopy. So I have to kiss someone's ass for a ride on a work day because said fingerprint place is only open one day a week for fingerprint appointments.

The only reason I need attire approval is because my mother insists on ironing whatever I wear. Frankly, I don't think this job is worthy of ironed clothes, but she won't shut the fuck up about it. And the dress code is definitely accepting of more office-casual attire, as I see a lot of folks who come in in sneakers, capris, tie-dye skirts, etc. I feel kinda dumpy in what I have to wear because a lot of it doesn't fit right or is uncomfortable. I wish I had some lighter summer-friendly tops, but my mother bitches if I try to find things at the thrift store to wear because she says they're garbage and/or thinks I'm going to buy something five sizes too big (I go a size up for breathing room sometimes, that's about it), and she'll insist I buy new work clothes at this store that's kinda like Sears and sells nothing but clothes for 50-year-old women... and then she screams when I find nothing to wear there.

I don't know how my mother can bitch at me about being an adult and being responsible and then turn around and tell me what I can and cannot wear to work. I'm not retarded - I am fully capable of dressing myself in appropriate, yet comfortable clothing. Pick one or the other already - either I'm a responsible adult, or I'm nine years old and still need someone to hold my hand. I can't be both.

Soooo, shitty job + ill-fitting clothing + listening to maternal crazies before and after work = I'm a little stressed. If you wouldn't be stressed in my position, then you're a stronger person than I am.

She can tell you what to wear because you live with her and she meets all your basic needs.
She can deny you transportation because she pays for it.
I keep saying this but your only option is to move out.
Being self sufficient is the one and only way you can break this cycle. A huge part of that is keeping a job, either this one or another.
I don't know what else to say when you say you can't do any of the many ideas, on many threads people have given you for becoming independent. You also give many reasons for not keeping or getting fired from this job.
I truly don't know what to say. Your mother will probably not change. You seem unwilling to do anything to make a change for yourself. If you want to stay stuck in this cycle that is your choice.

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evilchildlessbitch

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Presto
I would be packing a change of clothes along in my "lunch bag" and changing the second you can.
If this means at the school where your coworkers might notice, play it up for sympathy! "Verbal abuse if I don't wear what mommy wants, but hey this job will get me away from her, yay!" Almost guaranteed to result in free shit and word about roommate situations will get back to you ASAP.

Be comfortable.

Child of 2 teachers not agreeing with what you say here. My parents would have smiled at the person and then snickered when they left. They both taught from the age of 22. A person nearing 30 complaining that their mommy made them wear xyz would have garnered no sympathy. They lived on their own and dressed themselves. That is part of adulthood and not something to be sympathetic about.

Yes, if the opportunities of their youth were available today, I'd be inclined to agree. And with such a persona as we can see here on the board you are probably correct that that is what _you'd_ be met with.
But I don't think Cambion quite resembles yourself in attitude, so _I_ happen to think she'd be pleasantly surprised by the kindness of strangers.

Besides, she's really got to cultivate relationships with people other than narcissistic mommy dearest, and asking about rooming opportunities is a great conversation starter.
I think everyone here has probably heard of a fledgling adult somewhere in the vicinity of their social circle who was raised by a helicopter, tiger, or other style of completely dysfunctional moron "parent". Incompetent parenting is spreading like an epidemic!
But there are still good people left in the world who would love an opportunity to help someone out of the situation they found themselves born into.

I came out of such a situation myself, but before the internet. There may have been people willing to help but I didn't know where to find them.
My goal in retirement is to help people being kicked out of their homes at 18, or those taking abuse who want to leave but can't figure out how to do so without becoming homeless.
Ultimately, many people still have kindness in their hearts.
If you still haven't gotten out in 8 years Cambion, you can be my first test case.

oh, I didn't realize the job was in a school! I missed that part; I thought it was a city library. no wonder there are so many brats.

yikes.

I can say that Friday was my best day at my job so far because I didn't have to interact with anybody. It was an in-service day and I was told I had to be there, which made no sense because no other aide was there and I wasn't supposed to go to the meetings with the teachers. WTF. So I just clocked in and did stuff in the library like shelving and sorting materials because there's always something to do in there. Being by myself and not having to deal with kids was bliss. Just a few hours of quietly taking care of books without interruption. I might get in trouble for being there, but hey, I'm just doing what I was told. It's not my problem if the staff can't get their shit straight.

I also wasn't told I had to watch the kids in the cafeteria on certain days and didn't find out until after lunch had ended. I have a phone right beside my head - they couldn't call me and say, "Hey get down here?" Or walk over and tell me? I can see the cafeteria from the library for gods' sake. People gotta tell me this shit; I'm not a fucking mind reader.

The librarian also insists on putting due date slips in the books, which I don't get because the kids have scheduled library days AND everything is kept track of digitally. All their teachers have to do is say, "If you have library books at home, bring them back tomorrow." In order to make sure all the kids get their shit checked out, slips have to be pre-stamped every single day, meaning that some slips get stamped every day and will get thrown out when they get full without ever having been in a book. Plus some of the stamps are shitty and you can't even read the damn date anyway. Seems like a waste of paper.

It's horse shit that a single assistant is expected to do all this. I had to have the teaching assistant put due date pockets and slips in all the books a few days ago because I couldn't check in everyone's books, check out their new ones AND put slips in them. The classes are so big that you do need two people in there to make sure everything gets done, and even then it's a struggle. And of course the kids are supposed to scan their own materials, which only a couple know how to properly do, so checkout takes forever when they do it, so I just check their books out on my own and if they say they want to do it (because they know they can), I let them. About half the time, they need me to do it for them anyway.

I also noticed none of the kids know the difference between "check in" and "check out." But since it takes pretty much the entire library period just for the kids to bring in their books, get new ones, check new books out and have slips/pockets stuck in each book, I don't think I even need to worry about lessons. There's no time for lessons.

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evilchildlessbitch
She can tell you what to wear because you live with her and she meets all your basic needs.
She can deny you transportation because she pays for it.
I keep saying this but your only option is to move out.
Being self sufficient is the one and only way you can break this cycle. A huge part of that is keeping a job, either this one or another.
I don't know what else to say when you say you can't do any of the many ideas, on many threads people have given you for becoming independent. You also give many reasons for not keeping or getting fired from this job.
I truly don't know what to say. Your mother will probably not change. You seem unwilling to do anything to make a change for yourself. If you want to stay stuck in this cycle that is your choice.

I agree.

Cambion: you need to move out. Do you have a friend you can room with?

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Cambion
I can say that Friday was my best day at my job so far because I didn't have to interact with anybody. It was an in-service day and I was told I had to be there, which made no sense because no other aide was there and I wasn't supposed to go to the meetings with the teachers. WTF. So I just clocked in and did stuff in the library like shelving and sorting materials because there's always something to do in there. Being by myself and not having to deal with kids was bliss. Just a few hours of quietly taking care of books without interruption. I might get in trouble for being there, but hey, I'm just doing what I was told. It's not my problem if the staff can't get their shit straight.

I also wasn't told I had to watch the kids in the cafeteria on certain days and didn't find out until after lunch had ended. I have a phone right beside my head - they couldn't call me and say, "Hey get down here?" Or walk over and tell me? I can see the cafeteria from the library for gods' sake. People gotta tell me this shit; I'm not a fucking mind reader.

The librarian also insists on putting due date slips in the books, which I don't get because the kids have scheduled library days AND everything is kept track of digitally. All their teachers have to do is say, "If you have library books at home, bring them back tomorrow." In order to make sure all the kids get their shit checked out, slips have to be pre-stamped every single day, meaning that some slips get stamped every day and will get thrown out when they get full without ever having been in a book. Plus some of the stamps are shitty and you can't even read the damn date anyway. Seems like a waste of paper.

It's horse shit that a single assistant is expected to do all this. I had to have the teaching assistant put due date pockets and slips in all the books a few days ago because I couldn't check in everyone's books, check out their new ones AND put slips in them. The classes are so big that you do need two people in there to make sure everything gets done, and even then it's a struggle. And of course the kids are supposed to scan their own materials, which only a couple know how to properly do, so checkout takes forever when they do it, so I just check their books out on my own and if they say they want to do it (because they know they can), I let them. About half the time, they need me to do it for them anyway.

I also noticed none of the kids know the difference between "check in" and "check out." But since it takes pretty much the entire library period just for the kids to bring in their books, get new ones, check new books out and have slips/pockets stuck in each book, I don't think I even need to worry about lessons. There's no time for lessons.

Wow. The kids are really that dumb to not know the difference between "check in" and "check out" when it comes to library books?

Anyways, yeah, sounds like you need to get out of there and get a job elsewhere where there are no children at all.

Good luck.

I swear my bitching is not just because of having to work with kids. I think that the school is expecting a lot from an unsupervised assistant with no experience or formal schooling in education or library science. And I know it's because they're too cheap to hire adequate staff.

And yes, the kids are that dumb. I'd ask them if they are checking books in or out, and they'd give a definite "checking in" or "checking out" as an answer. Then I'd ask "are you bringing books back or taking them home?" and in every single instance, they would answer the exact opposite of what they said before. So now I just ask them if they're taking the books they're holding home or bringing them back. But I also had a brain fart and realized that I could look at my computer screen and tell whether books I was scanning were incoming or outgoing. If they don't know what check in and check out mean, maybe they shouldn't be checking in/out their own books.

I've also explained to them and their teachers what books they can take out, which are from an entire room dedicated to ages 4-7, or books with certain labels out in the main area. I can't watch what books they pick up and check everybody's stuff out, and as a result, I've had kids bring me stupid shit like dictionaries or Time books with size 4 type and I have to tell them to go find something on their reading level. This is why there needs to be a librarian and an assistant, or two assistants; just two people working at the same time so one can check in/out and one can help the students find appropriate books.

@ Cambion: " I know it's because they're too cheap to hire adequate staff."
-> this "cheap culture" is unfortunately everywhere.
Today, one person is hired to work for 3 and is paid as a 0,5.

My 2 cents: I applied for a low paid job. During interview, I found out that the main
task would be translation of texts from one language into my mother tongue
and vice versa. This is normally a job for a translator but the company wanted
to avoid hiring a freelance translator who would have to be paid accordingly so
they created a low paid job for a desperate native speaker...

Good news! Now I'm being told I have to work off the clock! y

I left a huge mess at work yesterday that I just did not get the chance to clean up because, by the time I got back from my required end-of-day duties outside the room, it was just about time to leave. I didn't want to leave it, but I didn't think I could stay past my scheduled quitting time, either clocked in or out. I've always been told, "Hey it's 3, you can go now." I heard about it today from the librarian and the assistant, and since I absolutely have to make sure I do several things before I leave for the day, the only way I can do it is if I go clock out at my scheduled time, then come back and finish.

Considering I get a shitload of stuff to do at the very ass-end of the day when a class comes in and then I have to go deal with the buses for 15 minutes after class gets out, I just don't have time to get books put away and cleaned up by myself. Of course, the other assistant doesn't have to stay to clean shit up that they miss. Just me. I have time when I first get there to do stuff, but like I said, I get more shit to do right near quitting time.

I'd say it'll take at least half an hour to do everything that I've been leaving at the end of the day. Possibly more, depending on how big of a mess the students and/or other assistant leave.

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mrs. chinaski
Today, one person is hired to work for 3 and is paid as a 0,5.

Oh yeah. I see ads for jobs, like "receptionist" - except you also get to do the accounting/HR/payroll. And all for 12 bucks an hour. Too cheap to hire a real accountant or HR person.

Get it in writing that your duties include cleanup after the class. Do not clock out if they tell you to do that work. Otherwise, leave it and clock out.

Working off the clock is wage theft, pure and simple. If they try to get you to do that, don't. Try to get their requests in email form so you can make a complaint to the EEOC if need be.

I've noticed an increasing trend of devaluing work and expecting employees to work for free. We need unions in this country more than ever.

Cambion, get thee to your union rep pronto! and let them know what is going on. They can get this stopped for you!

Check your job contract, list of duties to see what it is that you are required to do. Stick to it. It doesn't matter if the librarian wants everything neat as a pin. If it isn't your job to clean up messes, then don't do it. You will want to give the librarian a list of your required duties, and remind her that you are a part-time aide only.

Document everything that happens in your job during the day. Keep a log of what people say to you, when they say it. Keep a log of anything extra you have to do off the clock. That becomes a legal document for any grievance the union files in the future.

Chin up sister, it's almost Friday!

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JoJo
I've noticed an increasing trend of devaluing work and expecting employees to work for free. We need unions in this country more than ever.

Preach it, loud and clear!!

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Cambion
Good news! Now I'm being told I have to work off the clock! y

That is illegal, for them to have you work off the clock.

You need to complain to the higher-ups, then give your two-weeks notice. I recommend getting a job where there are no children at all.

I knew that public schools were screwed up but did not think it was this bad.

Good luck.

I at least want to email somebody (union rep, principal, superintendent) and just simply ask what should happen in regard to clocking in/out if it's the end of my work day and I still have a crap-ton of stuff to do. I know I'm definitely not allowed to leave books and messes for the morning person, but if I gotta stay an extra hour after quitting time to make sure the library is clean, I'd like to be paid for it.

The librarian has specified that certain things have to be done before I leave, namely re-shelving of returned books and cleaning up books that get thrown on the floor, knocked over or put where they aren't supposed to go. I think some older students will come in and help put away the books from the morning classes, but I'm on my own at the end of the day most days. Plus, only one class comes in on my shift right now, but starting very soon, I will have two classes back-to-back. On top of that, kids come in after school and hang out in the library and I cannot control the messes they make once I leave.

I timed myself today - it took about an hour and 15 minutes for me to put back books, like maybe 30 books, and I didn't even get them all put back because some students came in and put back the last eight or so. I know putting books back doesn't seem like it'd be time-consuming, but even when I know where the fuck they go, it takes a long damn time to find the proper spot for each one. Some sections also need to be rearranged because there are books all out of order or I'll find a book in one area that belongs clear on the other side of the library. Many times this week alone, I've had to pull entire rows of books down and re-order them because they were just thrown back onto shelves and it was easier to redo the whole shelf than to pull out books and put them in their correct spots. Some thankfully do not need to be in order, but most others do.

I think the librarian will clock out and stay at the school working if stuff needs to be done. I don't know if that means I have to as well. And I checked - my list of duties does include keeping the library looking neat, which is okay with me. And there's one that basically says "Do anything the librarian tells you to do."

I'm honestly figuring that the school is gonna tell me some bullshit like, "We're dedicated to the students here, and if you're just here to get a paycheck, then this isn't the job for you, blah blah for the children yadda yadda."

It is completely and 100 percent illegal for an hourly employ to work off the clock. This is something that needs to be dealt with. I would beware of teacher's unions because a lot of teachers resent that certified teaching jobs are being eliminated and done by paraprofessionals. This is where I recommend cultivating relationships with coworkers. There is power in numbers even without a union rep since many school systems don't have union reps for paraprofessionals. There are government agencies that deal with this sort of abuses outside unions.
Show up at work every day on time and go above and beyond. See if the same thing is happening to other employees. Leave personal problems like your mom dressing you or not letting you drive at home. Do let your coworkers know you are looking for cheap cars or carpooling arrangement. Change clothes in the restroom when you arrive but don't make a show of it.
After you have established some credibility as well as being a person coworkers can count on you will be amazed at how much coworkers want to help you personally and professionally.
The one thing I would deal with immediately is the wage issue. Talk to your supervisor and see what must be done and what can be left. Figure out more efficient ways if possible. As has been said before, expecting 1 person to do the work of 2 or 3 sucks and it doesn't seem to be going anywhere but it doesn't mean off salary people should work off the clock.